Saddle slipping to 1 side

Chocy

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For those of you who have saddles that slip to 1 side how do u correct this?

Story is- horse been having physio for pelvis/back end/sacroilliac problems & general massage etc has shown him sore along spine where saddle sits on RHS. Now he does hav 1 shoulder bigger than the other at the mo & he has a work plan 2 try even him up & saddle fitter is out (again) next week.

But how have u sorted this- is it pads/prolite/risers etc on 1 side or both? & would they go under the RHS as the saddle slips to left? (rhs shoulder is he bigger 1)
 

d_morrow

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I have the same problem. You could try girthing differently on each side eg my saddle has 4 girth straps so I have had some success with using the 2 outer straps on the RH (big) side and the 2 inner straps on the other side. I also like the Stubbben Trevira Cord girth which helps saddle stability - and the thorowgood cob girth is good too. Finally - I have recently switched from using a sheepskin numnah to a polypad and this alone has helped as the saddle appears to ' bed down' into the pad which helps it stay put. Hope that helps.
 

d_morrow

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I have the same problem. You could try girthing differently on each side eg my saddle has 4 girth straps so I have had some success with using the 2 outer straps on the RH (big) side and the 2 inner straps on the other side. I also like the Stubben Trevira Cord girth which helps saddle stability - and the thorowgood cob girth is good too. Finally - I have recently switched from using a sheepskin numnah to a polypad and this alone has helped as the saddle appears to ' bed down' into the pad which helps it stay put. Hope that's of some use to you.
 

kirinsam

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I would ride bareback until the saddle fitter comes if you need to keep the work program going. Sonds like the saddle is causing the problem so remove it from the equation in the short term. I know my saddle fitter would say the same.
 

ozpoz

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Have you looked at the Saddle Research Trust website? Sue Dyson has a published article on saddle slip, the jist of it being the underlying cause of saddle slip should be dealt with, not just the saddle fit aspect. Maybe your horse needs a bit more than just massage now.
 

sbloom

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There are so many possible solutions. The better the saddle fit the less the slippage would be, and whatever the headlines of Sue Dyson's work say, this is still very true and very important. In my experience many horses have trees that are a little too curved and bars that are not quite right - in a bare tree fitting they would stick up, more vertical than the horse's back. These issues cause minor instability, and any asymmetry in the horse (most have at least a tiny bit of asymmetry) will show up massively in saddle slip.

Girthing asymmetrically can help, hence saddles with four straps can be really helpful, dressage saddles are the worst with their two straps and no choice. For more severe asymmetry I only work with Mattes correction pads - for most horses the sheepskin on the pads I use is beneficial but I do understand that on the occasional horse it can cause instability, but I think Polypads can cause just as much if not more, it's whatever works for that horse.

Shimming is not always logical - once the saddle fit is as close to perfect as possible you can start playing with shimming, and you will end up with whatever shimming combination keeps the saddle stable and in correct balance from front to back. If the saddle moves to the right don't think for a second that shimming both front and back on the right will work, it rarely does. Usually the asymmetry stems from either front or back - but even so a saddle moving to the right at the back might need a shim at the back on the left, or at the front on the left, or front or back on the right - it really can be that random! As I said, whatever works.

Of course ultimately you aim to be able to remove the shims. If the asymmetry proves to be permanent then I would consider flocking asymmetrically, but otherwise it's not a good option.
 

siennamum

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My horse has this problem, I have always struggled slightly with the saddle slipping and sitting off centre because of it.
Until I can get a new saddle (it's not a big issue for us) my saddler advised me to adapt my girthing. On the side the saddle slips to (right) I use 2nd & 4th straps, on the side with the big shoulder (left) we use 3rd & 4th.
It does seem to make quite a difference.

Horse can be quite fixed on left side & I really have to make him bend and flex both ways, hoping it isn't a sign of anything going on in rh hock now.
My horses tend to be a bit fixed to the right anyway, because I suppose I am right handed, and I do very little schooling, the inclination when hacking is to have horse flexed to the right.
 

ozpoz

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S.Bloom, if you read the article and not just the headlines...:rolleyes: :)

The research shows that saddle slip can be a valuable early indicator of hind leg lameness. Surely it is better to identify and treat lameness in the early stages?
For what its worth,I think we need informed research and not just opinions and experiences.
 

sbloom

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Just be aware that asymmetric girthing isn't standard either - what works for siennamum's horse isn't applicable to all. Girthing on the back straps can, on many horses, bring the saddle forwards. On most of the horses I fit, the first option is 1 and 3 (point and third) on the wide the saddle slips to, and 1and 4 on the side it slips from, but there are many different variations dependent on things like barrel shape and where the girth groove is.
 

Chocy

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Thanx folks!
The horse has had full work up done by vets- absolutely nothing found & have had ultrasound done as well as massage etc by physio whos more than happy 4 horse 2 b in work obv once saddle probs sorted!
its dressage saddle I'm using so not able 2 do asymmetric girthing altho had done this previously on old gp I had.
Sbloom i'll look in2 the matted stuff thanx just want 2 b as well informed as poss b4 saddle fitter out on tues. Feel I hav somewhat been given the run around bout my saddle as jump 1 def a problem & now it seems both have been incorrectly fitted all along
 

sbloom

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S.Bloom, if you read the article and not just the headlines...:rolleyes: :)

The research shows that saddle slip can be a valuable early indicator of hind leg lameness. Surely it is better to identify and treat lameness in the early stages?
For what its worth,I think we need informed research and not just opinions and experiences.



I have read it. All. In fact I have a copy scanned on my laptop for reference.

I do what works, if I think there is a mild lameness or asymmetry I refer to a vet or body worker. I fit wide horses as a speciality where, as Sue says, saddle slip is a big issue, and the better the fit is, the less the saddle slips, on the whole. I don't see a whole lot of lameness, though that depends on how she is defining lameness, which is not clearly identified in the article in H&H.

We do need research, and I have some academic background, udnerstanding both concepts of reliability and validity for statistics. More work is needed, and this is valuable work, but it is in no way cause and effect, and does not mean that most horses with saddle slip will have a mild lameness that needs investigating.

And considering that in so many cases horses are written off for lamenesses that non-veterinary treatments go on to cure, going to your vet for NQR is not always the most successful route.

Also lets bear in mind that this particular horse belonging to the OP is already under the supervision of a physio, so I had discounted the possibility that there was an undiagnosed hind leg lameness, funnily enough. It is STILL really important to stabilise a saddle and having it fit centrally while you work to correct whatever underlying problem there is.

I'll leave out the eye rolling emoticon.
 
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Myloubylou

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My saddler recommended a professional choice girth for my GP saddle which tended to slip to the right. It is elasticated but designed to be done up looser than standard girths
 

pickwickayr

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I had this problem with my pony,.saddle slipt to ride. Pony was asymmetrical and more muscled on the left. This was obviously made worse by saddle sitting to the right. Saddler fitted more flocking on right of saddle. This didn't help. She also tried putting shims on right of mattes pad but didn't help. Had another Saddler out who put shims on the left. This held saddle straight and allowed muscle to build up on right side. Pony straightened out immensely after treatment by a mctimoney chiropractor. I also saw a chiropractor as riding squint had put my hips out lol
 

Ellen Durow

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For those of you who have saddles that slip to 1 side how do u correct this?

Story is- horse been having physio for pelvis/back end/sacroilliac problems & general massage etc has shown him sore along spine where saddle sits on RHS. Now he does hav 1 shoulder bigger than the other at the mo & he has a work plan 2 try even him up & saddle fitter is out (again) next week.

But how have u sorted this- is it pads/prolite/risers etc on 1 side or both? & would they go under the RHS as the saddle slips to left? (rhs shoulder is he bigger 1)
The way to correct the problem is to have the saddle professionally re-fitted by a qualified saddle fitter.

Pads, risers, etc., are at best only a temporary measure and certainly should not be use to correct a problem where there is an injury.

It may well be that the back problems have been caused in the first place by an ill-fitting saddle.
 

PandorasJar

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Be careful girthing asymetrically for the back up straps too. I wouldn't put two buckles on the same breakaway point. As I've experienced, it's a lifesaver girthing properly when one does snap
 

sbloom

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The way to correct the problem is to have the saddle professionally re-fitted by a qualified saddle fitter.

Pads, risers, etc., are at best only a temporary measure and certainly should not be use to correct a problem where there is an injury.

It may well be that the back problems have been caused in the first place by an ill-fitting saddle.

Never bad advice to have a saddle checked but pads and shims are the very best way to tide a horse through a period of injury. They should not be used long term to correct an ill fitting saddle to a fully healthy horse, but in remedial fits they are by far the best way. As someone earlier found, asymmetric flocking doesn't always work, and always has to be undone by a saddle fitter at some cost. I don't ever do it for temporary fixes and have yet to find a horse with a permanent issue that requires it.

And shimming always has to be pragmatic - whatever works, once the basic saddle fit is correct. If the saddle moves to the right, you might need to put shims in any of the four pockets of a correction pad and not assume that shimming on the right will help. Similarly a smaller right shoulder will not necessarily want a shim front right.

Work with a saddle fitter but be prepared that it may take some experimentation (and the benefit of a shim pad is that it CAN be altered by the rider) to get the right combo of shims - a good fitter will show you the principles of shimming it (I also have videos on YouTube demonstrating shimmimg a Mattes pad) so that you can alter it slightly, ideally under their guidance. It is easy to get it wrong, but if you proceed with caution and follow guidelines it is possible to do it yourself.
 

Skippys Mum

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Err, its worth mentioning that both the dressage and jumping saddles that Chocy has were bought brand new within the year from a qualified saddle fitter - who has been back out repeatedly to supposedly fix the issues. One of the saddles has been reflocked 7 times so far. These are both quality saddles.

The horse had no problems prior to these so called "professionally fitted" saddles :(
 

FfionWinnie

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Err, its worth mentioning that both the dressage and jumping saddles that Chocy has were bought brand new within the year from a qualified saddle fitter - who has been back out repeatedly to supposedly fix the issues. One of the saddles has been reflocked 7 times so far. These are both quality saddles.

The horse had no problems prior to these so called "professionally fitted" saddles :(

Sounds like they just don't fit then. How infuriating!

With one horse I had every saddle fitted by a fitter slipped sideways. I (out of interest) tried on a saddle I already had, didn't slip :rolleyes: if you are on a yard chocy maybe you could try a few folks saddles if any are the right size and see if they slip then you can present that case to the saddler too.

I wouldn't be at all happy if the horse was previously fine and the new saddles slipped, that puts a different slant on it (pun intended!)
 

Goldenstar

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I broke and retrained a driving horse at ten , he had been in a team on the near side he was without doult the most crooked horse I have ever worked with, he persistently shifted his saddle to the right. This matched the uneven development of his muscles and in time stopped , interesting he will still slightly shift his saddle when tense or tired.

At one time the saddler was making fortnightly visits he was changing shape so radically and I spent a fortune on the saddler and physio in the first two years , not much help to you except to let you know you are alone in having to find a way through this .
 

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Wonky horses (which usually does boil down to subtle lameness), then wonky riders are the main reasons for saddles going over to one particular side, but saying that wonky horses and wonky riders often need to be able to get on with the job if they are ever going to improve and become less wonky. :D Some saddles go over easier than others and IME its trial and error with a horse that throws its saddle, and I've found that well broken in, old saddles that sit "around" the horse shift less, generally speaking.
 

sbloom

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If the fitter has not come up with a solution in 7 visits then there is definitely a fitting problem - whatever the underlying problem you need your saddle to fit well and be stable to, as someone else said, be able to get on with work and rehab your horse.

Personally I see that most saddles that are slipping are too curvy front to back or too upright in the bars, and flatter more open seats usually cure the problem. Taking it as a given that the width and front to back balance are right - a too wide saddle can wiggle and slip, a too narrow saddle is usually perched and will slip.

An interesting case yesterday, an advanced endurance horse with known issues, where his saddle has always slipped to the left. The saddle was down at the back, his asymmetry (whether in back shape or dynamic movement) seemed to be at the back because lifting the back of the saddle and spreading the rider's weight evenly helped a lot with the issue. It was not a saddle I originally fitted and I'd really like to see what a flatter tree would do for him.
 

Chocy

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The 7 re-fits hav been on my jumping saddle which hasn't been used since October (went 2 b flaired 2 c if that helps & not been back on horse as I'm reluctant 2 use it as I thot it had caused a lot of the horses shoulder problem)

But after not riding/physio/lunging work I started riding again & only using dressage saddle & on Fris physio recheck she found the back probs were returning so obv dressage saddle not right either! No no idea what the answer is & as u can imagine I have little faith in saddle fitter.

Sbloom- can I ask a qu! Dressage saddle has flair does that make it a bit easier 2 sort the slippage versus flocking? I feel the saddle is 2 low over the withers & so I'm sitting 2 far forward & not in centre of saddle. I feel an obvious tip front 2 back & the back of saddle must b moving a fair bit as on RHS it rubbed so badly skin was red & raw looking- horse had been clipped day b4 this but was his 3rd clip of winter so I don't c that being the cause.
 

sbloom

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I don't fit Flair and don't work with it, but I do sculpt flocking sometimes to help with slippage, and you can't do that with Flair. It sounds like you need a narrower tree or more air at the front (poss less at the back) or a thick pad/shim system to lift the front of the saddle. A too-wide saddle will wiggle at the back quite often, will also lift at the back, and could well be sitting off to one side - do try a thicker pad to lift the front and bring it back into balance, and see if that helps, but with the rawness you have in her skin you need to do something fast, and definitely don't use it until her skin is healed.

It does sound like you need a second opinion on what is going on with the saddles.
 

Chocy

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Sbloom- thanx so much you've basically said what I've been thinking/feeling so good 2 no my gut instinct seems right!

Rawness has cleared up by few days no saddle & using thick sheepskin numnah.

Saddle fitter back 2mo & 2nd opinion will b happening after that 2 confirm saddle fits/doesn't unless I get some sort of wonder answer 2mo!!
 
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