Saddles won't fit - underlying issues?

If I were you, as I have been in this situation, the first thing I would do is get a lameness work up. I don't think she looks lame, but I do think she looks uncomfortable. So I would think the first thing to do is rule out any possible underlying issues, hopefully it is her discomfort with her saddle not fitting that is causing her to look this way.

Then if all goes well with the vet I would look into a treeless saddle. I highly recommend the solutions saddle's they are rigid free and they do move with the horse. They are very expensive, but they can be your saddle for life, and out of all the treeless they look the most like a "normal" saddle.

I wont ride in anything else now, when I ride my daughters TB I use my saddle, just needs different pads to adjust the fit for it to be right for her, but your advisor can fit the one saddle to multiple horses.
 
It looks as if a Black Country tree might be an option for her - I'm sure we were meant to be trying one on her, but don't think it transpired. Saddler has been bringing the widest trees available to her in my price bracket, so again, we might have been limited in that way.

So - here's the plan:

Full lameness work up next week (we have a really good vet practice with two good equine vets) ....I'm pretty sure it is the saddles that have been making her sore, but best to know.

Try a treeless to see if we like it.

Maybe try a WOW from original saddler and ask specifically to try the Black Country eloquence.

Prepare to open the wallet a little futher....eeek!

Cheers all :)
 
I'm another one who would recommend a solution treeless saddle. I have 2 warmblood mares both with big shoulders and movement and they both love it. As was previously said yes they are expensive but you should then never need another saddle however the horse changes shape and they can also be fitted to more than 1 horse as I have done. 1 of mine is very spooky and I haven't had any problem with the saddle moving when she spooks and also I find it very comfortable and much kinder to my back than a treed saddle. The other interesting thing that I have found is that both my mares put the saddle where they want it - it doesn't matter how far forward you put the saddle on within a very short space of time they have put it back behind their shoulders and although with 1 you would understand it as her girth groove is quite a long way back the other one's is too far forward and in the past I had a lot of trouble with girths pinching her and in the end had a saddle made for her. I wish I'd known about the treeless then it would have saved me a lot of time and money!
 
I had a total nightmare getting a saddle to fit my late mare, I went through 100's of saddles and 5 different saddlers! I spent sooooooooo much money on saddlers, brand new albions, ideals, saddlecompany, wintecs finally settled on a black country made to measure which was the best for that horse. It was awful though, with her everything would slip forward! I wasn't bashful about changing saddlers, if they weren't helping they were out the door! It's not that I thought they weren't doing their job well as they were all experienced master saddlers but at the end of the day, I knew her best and what they were suggesting was not working! It got to a point where her back was so sore from blimin saddles that she had to have 3 months off... I was like you, wondering if she would ever be the sort of horse to fit a saddle!
Then the last saddler I tried suggested the black country quantum jump, plonked it on her back and even I could see it fitted, it just looked like it was part of her.. que massive sigh of relief! We got there in the end :).

You will get there, let us know how she gets on at the vets. She is a gorgeous horse by the way and she moves lovely :).
 
Firewell said:
I had a total nightmare getting a saddle to fit my late mare, I went through 100's of saddles and 5 different saddlers! I spent sooooooooo much money on saddlers, brand new albions, ideals, saddlecompany, wintecs finally settled on a black country made to measure which was the best for that horse. It was awful though, with her everything would slip forward! I wasn't bashful about changing saddlers, if they weren't helping they were out the door! It's not that I thought they weren't doing their job well as they were all experienced master saddlers but at the end of the day, I knew her best and what they were suggesting was not working! It got to a point where her back was so sore from blimin saddles that she had to have 3 months off... I was like you, wondering if she would ever be the sort of horse to fit a saddle!
Then the last saddler I tried suggested the black country quantum jump, plonked it on her back and even I could see it fitted, it just looked like it was part of her.. que massive sigh of relief! We got there in the end :).

You will get there, let us know how she gets on at the vets. She is a gorgeous horse by the way and she moves lovely :).
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Thanks Firewell - it's just so frustrating - I was hoping to start her jumping this year, but to no avail.

I'm really sure she's not lame / in pain somewhere - she just isn't telling me that and is so well in herself...but I'm prepared to eat my words! It will cost about 2.5x a saddler visit to get the vet check so worth doing!

I thinks she moves well too - was she has huge movement behind and I never considered it looked anything like stringhalt...again - eek! I was so proud of her at that intro - it was at Myerscough so there was a lot going on for first time out - I was just pleased she didn't fire me off into the atmosphere with all the excitement!
 
Don't put too much faith in my lameness diagnosis. I am far from an expert. in all honesty I suspect that she is just tense and a bit snatchy behind. As you say she is really active behind anyway. At the least the vet will be able to confirm whether she is a bit sore in her back, which will give you a starting point.
We've had our wierd shaped youngster in the field for 6 weeks now waiting for our saddle to arrive, he was sore from the treeless we bought to back him in, so I feel your pain, it is such a minefield when you just want to get on and work them.
 
I'm having the same issues. I've ordered a Reactor Panel and I'm both very excited and hoping to hell its the right way to go. :D

One thing about the slipping saddles, when mine was going over to one side it was due to a lip of material behind elastic (at just one end) catching under the flaps and making the elastic really tight. Don't forget to think about stuff like this which should be pretty obvious. :o
 
siennamum said:
Don't put too much faith in my lameness diagnosis. I am far from an expert. in all honesty I suspect that she is just tense and a bit snatchy behind. As you say she is really active behind anyway.
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The saddler did say, when she first saw her, that she had never seen a horse with such an amount of movement behind and move a saddle (twist) so much in her life.....so I guess we knew we were up against it then.
 
Sorry I haven't had a chance to read everyone's replies, but have you considered a half panel saddle which means the shoulders would not be impeded in anyway?
 
PonyIAmNotFood said:
I've seen this work on a couple of broad horses who seemed to slip most saddles. A wider gullet seemed to help stabalise the saddle. The one's I knew weren't big moving at all though so not sure how similar this would be.
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The wider gullet is often actually a hoop or semi hoop tree. A wider gullet on a regular tree just gives you less panel area, a wider gullet and usually twist is needed for wide horses. Also no-one has mentioned flatness - imagine if your saddle is too much like a rocking horse on the ground - a too curvy tree on a flat horse (meaning front to back flatness for both) will rock at the back even if the right width. A too shallow panel or even the panel configured/attached at the wrong place at the front - both can cause a tree of the right width to drop at the front causing the rocking in rising trot.

You almost certainly need a flatter tree from front to back, and many tack shops don't stock those as it's a relatively small market, and possibly a hoop type tree. If you have a lateral wriggle as well then it may be that even if the tree is flat enough from front to back the bars may be too curvy or too upright.

My broadband speed won't let me see the video well. One thing I will say is that adding a rear riser to stop a saddle bobbing at the back is not the right thing to do - a rear riser simply rebalances a saddle and may put a rocking saddle much too much on the pommel. If the tree is the right width and there is sufficient flocking/panel depth at the front, then adding a rear riser should be done to correct a saddle being DOWN at the back. Rocking has several causes and none should be corrected with a rear riser as a sole solution.
 
chattygoneon3 said:
Hi,I agree with your saddler and think it would be worth getting your vet to have a look.Recent research by Sue Dyson at AHT suggests saddle slip is commonly caused by hind limb lameness .See link http://www.saddleresearchgroup.co.uk/newras2012.htm Hope this helps.
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I'm interested reading this, as it was certainly the case with my Welsh D youngster. We didn't have cantle bounce like the OP, but every type of saddle slipped to the left.
 
If you painted her black she could be Toby!! In looks, movement and temperament! His saddle was unstable because of his exssesive movement behind plsu the fact he was as sharp as hell and a rustling leaf would send him 20ft sideways :rolleyes:

I had the exact same issues with an unstable saddle and tried loads. Eventually we tried the Thorowgood T6 saddle with extra flocking at the front (the front gusset is rather useless). It had the wide head and panels and very flat tree he needed and it didn't move an inch.

She also looks a bit tubby in the video: I found toby's saddle was much less stable when he was fat. Once he was lean and fit it didn't even need a breastplate.

I don't think there's anything wrong with her, you just need to find a suitable saddle! I'd start looking at very flat-tree'd cob saddles.
 
Kallibear said:
She also looks a bit tubby in the video: I found toby's saddle was much less stable when he was fat. Once he was lean and fit it didn't even need a breastplate.
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Ha, she is tubby, 'cos I can't get any work into her! She is also that tubby after being brought in every day in the summer from around 10:30 - 3pm, to miss the best of the grass! I was looking at her today and perhaps because of the tubbiness, but her girthing groove is really far forward, so perhaps a y shaped girth might well be ideal for her.

I don't think there is anything wrong with her either.....she was stiff to the right, but she does seem sorted now after the osteo has been out (about a month ago now).

Looks as if the Solutions fitter will be out to see us this week and she is a physio too, so I'll see what she thinks of my big girl! If I don't like the Solutions, a much flatter tree definitely makes sense. I just hope that I feel good in whatever fits her too.
 
Just bear in mind that a flatter tree generally excludes a deep seat :). I find most people find the right flatter tree more comfy, and the few that don't still benefit from a stable saddle and do get used to it eventually! There isn't always the perfect solution for a rider when a horse is tricky to fit, but even our "wide twist" tree which is a hoop tree, is liked by maybe 75% of people, and it is pretty extreme!
 
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