Scales of Training/Walk & Trot Tests

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I judged at an unaff once to see a mother leading her daughter with side reins on and leading the dog round the test at the same time!! How do you judge that
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PMSL
 
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it was a very windy day... she prob got 9s and 1s through its whole test, so our steady 6767677766767 sort of scores managed to beat it. *grins from ear to ear*


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I have pointed this out to many people who fret at the big flashy horses out competing. If they are not consistent they fluff their tests, where as the quiet and maybe not so flashy horse, does a good test throughout.

Flashiness is not all it takes to win.
 
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Can we have a 4th category.... "Competing BD, reasonably good, but not overly serious and often forgets test"?

Think i'll pop myself in that one
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I think you'll find that should be "Competing BD, reasonably good, but not overly serious and ALWAYS forgets test"
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Can we have another category..."OK OK I am a SJer and am never going to look as elegant as you lot, but I am trying to better myself and my horse, even if we do look ridiculous"
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And 'I am an eventer who is bored because it is winter and who has decided that there is only so much ground you can make up by being fast XC. What do you mean you can carry a whip, and surely no one person can remember 2 tests in one day?'
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That would be me!
 
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Can we have a 4th category.... "Competing BD, reasonably good, but not overly serious and often forgets test"?

Think i'll pop myself in that one
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Me too me too!!!
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From this thread you can pick out the serious competitors from the have-a-goers!
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What a bloody rude and snobby thing to say; Im shocked.
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How exactly is that rude? Did I say there was anything wrong with any of those people? Did I say that have-a-goers cant ride for toffee and only be in a riding school? NO!

Jesus, some people
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now that is rude but who cares.
 
I have never understood the whole 'needing to be good enough to affiliate BD' thing.

If you want to compete at well organised events with good judges and nice facilities then pay to affiliate. If you want to save money, aren't so fussed and prefer a more relaxed less formal comp go unaff?

I don't know whether to laugh or feel angry at some of the narrow minded posts on here, I'm quite gobsmacked!

I feel like going at the first opportunity with my orange donkey to enjoy a wonderful day out at a BD comp (coming last I expect but loving the experience and the feedback) just to stick two fingers up at all you pretentious wannabes
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Or perhaps I should put a video up and gain permission first?
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Written test too maybe?

Get over yourselves and instead be thankful that there are so many people competing at lower levels pumping lots of money into the sport you love so- you need them!
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QR....i think i have read enough....WHO THE HELL ARE YOU to say someone can't compete because they are, in your eyes not good enough?? believe it or not, for the leisure rider, competions are not so much about the winning but more about a social outing, as part of what is supposed to be an enjoyable hobby...if that means them wanting to pay the fees to affiliate to gain acess to good judging, decent facilities etc, then so be it.
like it or not this is not germany, and in this country we are trying to get away from riding being eliteist.
i am currently one of those useless, terrible riders competing at unaffiliated lower level dressage on an ex driving cob.....and quite frankly i will continue to do so as it is my business not yours. we can do a nice test at home, but what is the point in being stuck at home all the time never going anywhere new, surely getting out and about is good for the horse????????????
i for one will NOT be BULLIED into not competing by people with jumped up snotty attitudes.
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I judged at an unaff once to see a mother leading her daughter with side reins on and leading the dog round the test at the same time!! How do you judge that
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That wasn't in West Sussex was it? If it was I know who it was
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Back on the subject, I'm a very mere-mortal who's never competed outside of my RS. BUT this brings in the question - more people out at BD at prelim/novice and the new W/T test once it comes in with a lower standard.

Could the fact that RSs are in decline, costs are spiralling (I'm looking at £50 private lesson for an hour!!) and the basic fact that it is cheaper to own your horse having an impact? Gone are the days of RSs letting people compete the horses, get competition experience and basic school rules.

So you get people with basic basic experience on a horse that's say effectively a schoolmaster and they go "well, I can go compete"

Not saying everyone straight out of a RS is bad or all RSs are bad - I've had the scales of training bellowed at me for 7 years on anything from a 13.2 bog pony to an advanced eventer. I may not be able to get them right all the time but it's still what I work for when riding. Not to mention having ALL my group flat lessons in open order. Was told the school rules once - don't forget them.

But it's not universal, it's in decline, the decent RSs are expensive and the cheaper ones arn't worth the money if you're wanting serious improvement on decent horses. So really the only other option is to get your own horse and compete

Just a thought
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In that case shoot me down now. When I first bought B I had entered my other horse for her first novice BD test (on a ticket). She went lame. I had paid the entry fees and had owned B a week. He had no brakes or steering to speak of and certainly had no understanding of outline. I took him in her place, basically to see how he reacted to a show environment. Ok, so he hadn't a clue and did the whole test without so much as thinking about going on the bit, but he behaved impeccably, coped with a busy warmup and walked happily from one arena to another. That was all I wanted really, and wasn't bad for a 5yo who'd not really been anywhere.

I finished smiling and had a chat to the judge, explaining the situation. She was lovely about it and wrote 'clearly a new experience for the horse' on the bottom of our sheet, which was fair enough!

I just think people should not be so quick to judge why others are there - you don't know the full story, and rather than lose my money, I had an educational day out with my youngster.

In terms of the walk and trot tests - again, if I wanted some consistent judging, and had a horse who found canter difficult (as most babies do in a 20x40), but I wanted it to get some comp experience, then what is the problem? Surely it is better to get riders exposed to decent critical comment asap - it might make just one think about their training, and if so it has to be worth it?

[/ QUOTE ] I completely agree. The affiliated W&T tests is intended for horse and/or rider that lack ability/confidence in canter and also disabled riders who cannot canter, so that they can compete at affiliated level locally. I suppose the judgemental amongst us think they sould just stay at home until a disabled competition is available! Live and let live for Gods sake. If people are trying to ride well and want to be judged properly, but are stuggling with canter, what is the problem?
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QR....i think i have read enough....WHO THE HELL ARE YOU to say someone can't compete because they are, in your eyes not good enough?? believe it or not, for the leisure rider, competions are not so much about the winning but more about a social outing, as part of what is supposed to be an enjoyable hobby...if that means them wanting to pay the fees to affiliate to gain acess to good judging, decent facilities etc, then so be it.
like it or not this is not germany, and in this country we are trying to get away from riding being eliteist.
i am currently one of those useless, terrible riders competing at unaffiliated lower level dressage on an ex driving cob.....and quite frankly i will continue to do so as it is my business not yours. we can do a nice test at home, but what is the point in being stuck at home all the time never going anywhere new, surely getting out and about is good for the horse????????????
i for one will NOT be BULLIED into not competing by people with jumped up snotty attitudes.
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I'm with you lilym.

I had always thought and said I would like to aim to affiliate to BD but I won't be bothering now if there are so many people with this sort of attitude out there. I did a fair bit of unaffiliated with my pony and now I have a mare who can really do it, I was hoping to affiliate. She is a WB with flashy paces but me being a normal, average rider surely can't be good enough to bother going out.

I've followed this post and haven't replied so far but it's really got to me now. Where do you think most of the funding for you sport comes from, all those of you who think people at the lower levels shouldn't compete unless we're only out to win?

You come and do my job for a month and then tell me where you would fit in the time to train for high level dressage and to compete regularly. When I compete it's for fun, not to have some snotty nosed BD affiliate who thinks they're better than they really are look down their nose at me. Unfortunately some of us have proper jobs that limit the time we have with our horses, or we have children who have to come first. Should that really prevent us from even having a go because we may not be as good as those of you who have enough leisure time to school your horses to death?

I will be looking to BSJA instead with this horse I think. Always wanted to give dressage a chance until I read this post, well done you lot, posting this on a public forum really can't have done the reputation of BD any favours
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Chesnut Cob. Don't let those who feel superior here put you off. Despite the fact that in their opinions I should probably not set foot over the threshold of an affiliated competion, I have always found that the people I have met at affiliated competitions have been pleasent, friendly and generally to have a supportive manner to each other. I also know a couple of affiliated judges. I haven't heard them ever take this attitude with riders. They tend to be pleased to see people there trying to ride well and improve themselves and their horses.

I will continue to believe that PG's views are held by the minority and as the Dalai Lama would say ' what others think of us is non of our business'. Lets ignore the crap and carry on regardless
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QR.

First of all thank you all for a very entertaining post
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* I haven't a clue what the scales of training are (but neither does P_G so I feel better now
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) but it doesn't mean that I can't ride my horse and score in the high 60s at novice.

* Don't let BD introduce show categories as BSJA has done, it really is a bad idea, especially if you own a horse on the cusp.

* Lower level riders fund higher level riders. ECs have to make money, without it they won't exsist. There are not as many riders in the higher levels therefore they need to make money from the lower level riders.

* Someone getting a bad score does not affect you. It makes it easier for you to win. Their entry fees means the centre keeps going and you still have somewhere to compete.

* If you don't like W/T tests don't enter them.

* I once posted on here that I was going to do an Elementary test. I got shot down in flames, How dare I do one as I was a showjumper and I had only done about 3 tests before. Well if I hadn't entered it they wouldn't have run the class as I made the entries up to 3.
 
Really don't see the point of an affilated walk/trot test. But then as it's hard to find Prelim qualifiers round here at affiliated other than sparsholt it's unlikely we'll see any walk/trot affiliated. However if BD want to introduce a standard walk/trot test to be used by Riding Clubs/Pony Clubs and unaffiliated then that is a good idea.

Also if it is not a qualifing test and you don't need to register the horse then it's almost incidental if it's part of an affiliated show or not.

I would however be concerned about riders who feel unable to canter in a controlled manner warming up in a busy warm up arena with other riders preparing for tests with canter.
 
QR - Surely the venue can decide whether or not to run the Walk/Trot tests?

If it is found that the competition encourages the wrong type of competitor then they can just not run it again.

OR

It might, just might encourage those who think BD is for snotty middle aged women to come and have a go and they may get bitten by the bug.

If I was bringing on a very young horse and I was entering a BD event with my other horse, I would take baby horse and do the walk/trot test for a bit of experience without asking to any questions until we were ready to confidently do a Prelim and a novice.

The other wonderful thing about this is a more novicey rider can gleen useful training advice and tips from the more experienced, wonderful, friendly chatty BD members. The last BD event I did was great as a PSG rider was watching me and she came up after and asked me how it felt, I asked if she saw it and what did she see, she told me what she saw and what she would do to improve for next time!! THAT is a true, dressage rider who knows her job and is an out and out sports person.
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I say, give it a go, it will either work or it won't. If it works it could mean more venues and more competitions for the rest of us. (Equals less miles to be travelled and more money for BD to be able to hire more people to become more streamline)

If it doesn't work, well, they can just get rid of it again and stick with Prelim at the lowest level.

As Lzt said. Being affiliated does not mean you have to be a marvellous rider on a marvellous horse. It means you are paying for quality venues with quality judges. I only joined up as there was a severe lack of unaff dressage around here. I am glad I did affiliate as you do get what you pay for.
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I would however be concerned about riders who feel unable to canter in a controlled manner warming up in a busy warm up arena with other riders preparing for tests with canter.

[/ QUOTE ] Well I've done walk and trot tests on a young horse and my daughter has done them when getting to know new ponies - neither of us have any problem when other have cantering past us in the warm-up! Just because someone chooses to do a W&T test doesn't mean they can't control their horse!
 
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* I once posted on here that I was going to do an Elementary test. I got shot down in flames,

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Really?!

Why? How bizarre.
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I'm a complete flid and i do elementary....perhaps people are secretly disapproving of me...bovvered.
 
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HBII - please don't feel like that, I think some people may have come across like that on this thread but aren't really like that, yes I'm sure you will get those in the real world who may look down upon others but you get that in life full stop. I use to ride with an apologetic style for being at posh venues until one day I was warming up with Spencer (he was on a youngster so let's not get carried away with my level of riding here!) and he said sorry to me for cutting me up, he made me feel like actually I do have a place there and he treated me with complete respect, and I am sure you will get the same respect from anyone you compete against, so please, please go and do your dressage and enjoy yourself, we did all start some where, ok some started with more help and exposure than others, but we ALL started
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To all of you who have been put off by this thread - GO FOR IT!! - nobody on this thread has meant to offend or put people off, of that I'm sure.

[/ QUOTE ] I apreciate your constructive post, but if you re-read some of the posts on here its very clear that some people do indeed mean to put people off!
 
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personally have generally found that those at the top of their game are more generous/thoughtful/encouraging. its the wannabees that like to knock everybody else
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QR

personally have generally found that those at the top of their game are more generous/thoughtful/encouraging. its the wannabees that like to knock everybody else
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[/ QUOTE ] Absolutely. One of my instructors is the mother of one of our National Team members. Her daughter is always pleasant and supportive of other 'lesser mortals', unlike the 'wannabees' evident in this thread. Of course she doesn't need to focus on the weaknesses of individuals at the lower levels, she is too busy riding brilliantly herself and helping others to improve.
 
That's encouraging PG - Should I tell my sister that you think her time and money is wasted then? That because she doesn't know the 'scales of training' she should hang up her boots and crawl away?

What about people who do not live and breath horses and competing in whatever sphere? What about people who want a chance to compete under decent judges at decent venues? People who have incredibly hectic lives, but manage to find time to have a horse? People coming back into riding after a decade or two out of the saddle? People who have had or have health issues, but don't qualify for Para/Disabled (?) classes? Young horses/old horses? People who just want to have a go, but are to damn scared to have to canter in a competition environment?

Shessh and people wonder why dressage is deemed as snobby and bitchy by some outsiders. Give people a break, who just want to have a go!! It's their money and time not yours!!!
 
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