Second dog - or bitch?

[minesadouble]

We have a 7 year old entire male Vizsla and have just joined a waiting list for a 2022 Vizsla pup.
In this position would you opt for a dog or bitch pup?

I would not want to castrate a dog but would want to spay a bitch, obviously this would mean the bitch would have to have a couple of season before spaying.

 

[Bellasophia]

It’s such a personal decision,I’d ask you what preference you would have..boy or girl?...if you like the males I’d get a second male.
In my case I’ve always had females,usually two at a time,with couple of years age difference..however,the last two dogs ( my st poodle and schnauzer are a mixed sex pair)
He was three when I added my female schnauzer..he was never bothered by females in season on our walks..generally clueless and affable
We let the schnauzer( nano size) have a season and kept the dogs apart for twenty days ..my hub kept one on an upper level of the house ,and I the other..
My male howled for her,didn’t eat well, He was desperate for her every time he passed the door..it was brutal for him...we spayed the schnauzer three months later after the first season.Not too bad for a small breed,but for a larger dog( like your vizla or my st poodle girls22 kg)I would wait until at least two years to spay..even a bit later..
Some males are easier they say...not in our case.
It has changed my male a lot..he sniffs more on walks and chatters if a female in heat has passed by..he is far more aware.
He was three before we went through this,and is now eight I’d say it was the event of having a female in season in his house that definitely affected him,rather than reaching maturity.
If you are set on a female,you will need a really good plan to separate them ...best would be to send the male away for the mid week of the 22 day season..but who is able to do that?
Good that you are thinking this through.

 

[CanteringCarrot]

Why do you all prefer to spay but not castrate? Genuinely curious.

YO added an intact male into their family of 2 bitches. When one came into heat it was so difficult to keep them apart and it really stressed the male. They did end up breeding and all pups easily found homes (also kept one) but in the end it was easiest to castrate the male. They all get along quite well and it seems less stressful now.

I only have and had females. So haven't had to deal with it personally. Wouldn't set myself up to either. Just easier for me and the dogs this way.

 

[BaronSamedi]

Two boys are far better than a mix of one of each. Far easier with two of the same gender

 

[FinnishLapphund]

If you want to keep your current male entire, and you're not planning to become a breeder, then I put my vote on getting another male.

I know of several owners with entire males living together.
Although I've also known e.g. an ordinary dog owner with 4 small Schnauzers, 2 entire dogs + 2 unspayed bitches. But splitting a room in two with 2 small dogs on one side, and 2 small bitches on the other side is easier than having room for keeping two large Vizslas separated for around 3 weeks or so.

 

[ponyparty]

I think it depends on the breed as well though... in my breed it’s often advisable to have a dog and a bitch due to the potential for fighting. I know several other breeds who tend to advise this. I know almost nothing about Viszlas though (although my cousin has one who is an absolute sap, bless him!).

 

[Goldenstar]

I would never have two dogs .

 

[minesadouble]

Thanks everyone. Initially we planned a second dog pup but the breeder has said there will be a battle for dominance once the second pup is an adult. Obviously either sex will bring its own problems, and I'm undecided now.

 

[meleeka]

Thanks everyone. Initially we planned a second dog pup but the breeder has said there will be a battle for dominance once the second pup is an adult. Obviously either sex will bring its own problems, and I'm undecided now.

That’s what happened with my mums dogs. They were small dogs but the atmosphere was awful and it was heartbreaking to see the older one struggle to keep his dominance.

 

[Clodagh]

I'd get a bitch. You know you won't have the top dog thing, or almost certainly not, as most males seem to back dwn from a bitch. They may never get uppity, who knows?
Seasons are easily managed, if you will spay her at some point it is only 6 weeks of inconvenience in 2 years. Yes the dog (and likely her as well) will howl and pine but they'll get over it.

 

[Clodagh]

Why do you all prefer to spay but not castrate? Genuinely curious.

YO added an intact male into their family of 2 bitches. When one came into heat it was so difficult to keep them apart and it really stressed the male. They did end up breeding and all pups easily found homes (also kept one) but in the end it was easiest to castrate the male. They all get along quite well and it seems less stressful now.

I only have and had females. So haven't had to deal with it personally. Wouldn't set myself up to either. Just easier for me and the dogs this way.

Because generally speaking males have benefits from testilcles, and less negatives. Bitches can have a lot of problems if left entire, with mammary tumours and pyometra.

 

[FinnishLapphund]

I'm no expert on Vizslas, all I know is that they're originally a hunting dog from Hungary, always comes in different shades of a golden yellow-brownish colour, have a body type similar to a German Shorthaired Pointer (hope the comparison isn't seen as an offence), but maybe a bit smaller in height.
So I can't say anything about them breed specifically.

However, speaking about dogs in general, I want to say that even though I have heard about it occasionally also in Swedish, I've noticed that it seems much more common that I hear that with so or so dog breed you shouldn't/can't/it's adviced against having two adults of the same sex, in English.

By the way, I thought @ponyparty owned a Poodle? I've never heard males Poodles mentioned in Sweden as best living together with the opposite sex, and I've met people owning two or more entire male Poodles together.
I've also e.g. met someone who owned 3 entire males Rhodesian Ridgebacks.

I would prefer to say that there is no guarantee that there won't be problems when you own two or more dogs together, regardless of sex or breed.
Although it perhaps is more likely that two dogs of different sex will get along, and I've sometimes also heard that two same sex dogs gets along better when of different breeds, I still think it matters more how your dog, and you yourself, is.

Does your dog likes other dogs? Is he well socialised? Is he reasonably well trained, and respectful?
Are you a reasonably principled dog owner?

If you do get a bitch, can you separate them at home, and perhaps also give them separate exercise, for a few weeks during her season? Are you prepared for that instead of the risk for possibly having to deal with two males wanting to be top dog in the family, there's a risk you might possibly have to deal with a lovesick male who refuses to eat, and whines/howls, for a few weeks?

Regardless if you get a male or bitch puppy, even though I think the majority of dogs seems to be on a scale anywhere between love, to tolerance, when it comes to puppies, remember that there is also those dogs who doesn't like puppies. But sometimes the later changes opinion once the puppy is around/over 6 months old.

 

[ponyparty]

I'm no expert on Vizslas, all I know is that they're originally a hunting dog from Hungary, always comes in different shades of a golden yellow-brownish colour, have a body type similar to a German Shorthaired Pointer (hope the comparison isn't seen as an offence), but maybe a bit smaller in height.
So I can't say anything about them breed specifically.

However, speaking about dogs in general, I want to say that even though I have heard about it occasionally also in Swedish, I've noticed that it seems much more common that I hear that with so or so dog breed you shouldn't/can't/it's adviced against having two adults of the same sex, in English.

By the way, I thought @ponyparty owned a Poodle? I've never heard males Poodles mentioned in Sweden as best living together with the opposite sex, and I've met people owning two or more entire male Poodles together.
I've also e.g. met someone who owned 3 entire males Rhodesian Ridgebacks.

I would prefer to say that there is no guarantee that there won't be problems when you own two or more dogs together, regardless of sex or breed.
Although it perhaps is more likely that two dogs of different sex will get along, and I've sometimes also heard that two same sex dogs gets along better when of different breeds, I still think it matters more how your dog, and you yourself, is.

Does your dog likes other dogs? Is he well socialised? Is he reasonably well trained, and respectful?
Are you a reasonably principled dog owner?

If you do get a bitch, can you separate them at home, and perhaps also give them separate exercise, for a few weeks during her season? Are you prepared for that instead of the risk for possibly having to deal with two males wanting to be top dog in the family, there's a risk you might possibly have to deal with a lovesick male who refuses to eat, and whines/howls, for a few weeks?

Regardless if you get a male or bitch puppy, even though I think the majority of dogs seems to be on a scale anywhere between love, to tolerance, when it comes to puppies, remember that there is also those dogs who doesn't like puppies. But sometimes the later changes opinion once the puppy is around/over 6 months old.

No, my dog is a Manchester Terrier, who was quite a handful pre-neutering and would actively try to seek out other entire males for confrontation. Most of the time it’s best to have a dog with a bitch in this case, although of course there are always exceptions so it’s not the say that it can’t be done. But to set oneself up for success my preference would be dog and bitch.

 

[PapaverFollis]

I have two entire males here and never had an issue. They get on great. The older one has a less forceful personality and is quite happy to indulge his spoilt little brother. Spaniel crosses though so generally amenable characters. In terms of same sex groupings I'd be more wary of two bitches than two dogs personally but we all have different experiences.

 

[ponyparty]

I have two entire males here and never had an issue. They get on great. The older one has a less forceful personality and is quite happy to indulge his spoilt little brother. Spaniel crosses though so generally amenable characters. In terms of same sex groupings I'd be more wary of two bitches than two dogs personally but we all have different experiences.

Yes, I nearly added that I would be wary about two bitches, too, due to past experience with my old bitch and my mum’s. All seemed fine... until it wasn’t!

 

[CorvusCorax]

It depends on the breed, some are more prone to same-sex aggression than others.

 

[SusieT]

I would every time go for a bitch if I had a male entire (and I'd neuter both tbh ) . My experience is that two entire dogs can be absoloutely fine or can be a complete nightmare as puberty hits. Bitches can also be a problem but it is more natural to have a pack of bitches than adult males living together long term (not an absoloute, I appreciate plenty of adult entire males live together)

 

[FinnishLapphund]

No, my dog is a Manchester Terrier, who was quite a handful pre-neutering and would actively try to seek out other entire males for confrontation. Most of the time it’s best to have a dog with a bitch in this case, although of course there are always exceptions so it’s not the say that it can’t be done. But to set oneself up for success my preference would be dog and bitch.

As soon as I saw your answer, I remembered that's what you have. Sorry, I have no idea why my brain suddenly became convinced he was a Poodle. Should have done a quick HHO search to check of course.

It definitely doesn't sound as if your dog is likely to like living with another male. I don't know much about Manchester Terriers, more than the basic how they look, and that there isn't many of them in Sweden.

But talking in general about other Terriers, I've for example seen a Kerry Blue Terrier owner stating that dogs of their breed is likely to have problems living together with another dog regardless of if they're the same or opposite sex.
However I've also heard a Kerry Blue Terrier breeder say that dogs of their breed can live together just fine, as long as you avoid rivalry situations like having dog toys at home.

So

Anyhow, I think there is pros and cons with both options.

 

[ponyparty]

As soon as I saw your answer, I remembered that's what you have. Sorry, I have no idea why my brain suddenly became convinced he was a Poodle. Should have done a quick HHO search to check of course.

It definitely doesn't sound as if your dog is likely to like living with another male. I don't know much about Manchester Terriers, more than the basic how they look, and that there isn't many of them in Sweden.

But talking in general about other Terriers, I've for example seen a Kerry Blue Terrier owner stating that dogs of their breed is likely to have problems living together with another dog regardless of if they're the same or opposite sex.
However I've also heard a Kerry Blue Terrier breeder say that dogs of their breed can live together just fine, as long as you avoid rivalry situations like having dog toys at home.

So

Anyhow, I think there is pros and cons with both options.

Frank is highly offended that you thought he was a poodle ???



Definitely agree there isn’t a one size fits all solution, but generally speaking... I think the majority of dogs can live with another dog, just has to be the right dog ?

I know a Manchester breeder who has about 12 of them, all living in one house, entire dogs and bitches together. Think she just had one that she had to keep separate, from memory. So it can definitely be done; it’s just not usually advised. I’ve been doing a lot of reading around Dobermanns lately as that’s the next breed I want (I’m talking in a few years from now, not any time soon). Anyway, I’ve read it’s advisable to have a dog with a bitch rather than another dog, for them too.

 

[druid]

I have a mix, mostly dogs, all entire (Springers). Two are used at stud, one far more than the other. Two entire bitches currently. I don't tolerate dominant behaviour towards other dogs and we have no issues. The stud dogs can be in the same room as the in season bitches under supervision and don't do any whining or annoying because they know it's not allowed. If not heavily supervised by me they are seperated by at least two closed doors at all times during seasons. Zero issues.

I will say that your weakest link will be other people in the house when trying to keep seperate.

PonyParty I didn't know you had a Mannie too! Where is yours from? Our little bitch is just about to be mated - will be our first MT litter.

 

[ponyparty]

PonyParty I didn't know you had a Mannie too! Where is yours from? Our little bitch is just about to be mated - will be our first MT litter.

Oh how exciting! Frank's Talanors x Felfree, from a breeder near Reading - she doesn't breed MTs any more though.

Where's your girl from? And who's she about to be mated with? I hope all goes smoothly - and that you'll post some pics when the time comes! They're a terrific breed, not for the faint hearted, little devils love them though!

 

[druid]

Oh how exciting! Frank's Talanors x Felfree, from a breeder near Reading - she doesn't breed MTs any more though.

Where's your girl from? And who's she about to be mated with? I hope all goes smoothly - and that you'll post some pics when the time comes! They're a terrific breed, not for the faint hearted, little devils love them though!

Le Pommeau x Felfree here - she's visiting Int Ch Dixiedaly Doc Holliday (Reserve CC at Crufts in 2019), he's a Tasmanian (!) import who made up to Champion in Aus and Ireland along the way.

 

[ponyparty]

Oh wow! Exotic imported boi lucky girly! Hope all goes well, let me know how she gets on (and did I mention puppy pics? )

 

[FinnishLapphund]

Frank is highly offended that you thought he was a poodle ???

Definitely agree there isn’t a one size fits all solution, but generally speaking... I think the majority of dogs can live with another dog, just has to be the right dog ?

I know a Manchester breeder who has about 12 of them, all living in one house, entire dogs and bitches together. Think she just had one that she had to keep separate, from memory. So it can definitely be done; it’s just not usually advised. I’ve been doing a lot of reading around Dobermanns lately as that’s the next breed I want (I’m talking in a few years from now, not any time soon). Anyway, I’ve read it’s advisable to have a dog with a bitch rather than another dog, for them too.

I offer my most groveling, humble apology to such a handsome Manchester Terrier.

 

[ponyparty]

I offer my most groveling, humble apology to such a handsome Manchester Terrier.

???
He says all will be forgiven if he gets some treats. I’ve never met a dog more greedy!

 

[Christmascinnamoncookie]

I think it’s very personal preference. I would always go for dogs and geldings.

 

[Moobli]

I would say there is less chance of aggression problems between the two if you opt for a bitch as you already have a dog. Of course it is entirely possible for two of the same sex to get along great, and many do, but I would choose a bitch in your case to limit any potential problems. I have an entire dog and bitch (GSDs) and my entire male had the Suprelorin implant (basically chemical castration) for when my bitch had her first two seasons, and I will have him implanted again shortly for another 12 months and will then spay my bitch once she is fully mature. I never noticed any behaviour or temperament changes in him once the implant went in so it worked well for me. It might be worth chatting to your vet about.