Sedating for dentist

Denbob

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Beastie is due a check, will be his first one done by an EDT and not a vet for a little while. EDT has said they don't require sedation and beastie doesn't necessarily need it as he's good as gold but have been advised by my vet that it's helpful in order for dentist to get a clearer look even in a calm horse?
 

ihatework

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Unless you have particular concerns about a horse then I wouldn’t sedate.

If I’ve had a nervous/anxious one then I might give a couple of clicks of sedalin.

My EDT prefers them unsedated.
My experience of vets is they are very sedation happy!
 

ycbm

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Does your vet even agree to do them without sedation if they definitely don't need it? It's a great way to run up the bill to double the price. I'm a cynic!

I offered my EDT sedation of a flighty first timer three year old and he refused and the horse was soon putty in his hands. I think he would be very offended by the suggestion that he hadn't done the horse properly.
 

PapaverFollis

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Mine are both sedated for safety because they are nervous and Granny in particular is a head tosser when nervous. With the gag in she's lethal despite not doing much. I'm considering seeing if The Beast can be done without sedation or with just sedalin as she also hates needles but Granny will always need IV. Never had a problem with it.
 

Red-1

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I have only ever used sedation if there is an issue that is causing pain, as opposed to a routine float.

My EDT is very patient, and has grasped the (often overlooked) importance of giving them a break BEFORE they show that they need one. The first couple of appointments with a new one take double the time as the horse has a long time of becoming accustomed to the gag and learning that they way to make the gag close is to stand still (for increasing lengths of time).

I have stopped using any EDT who does not give the horse the respect of going at their pace. Once they have been done a few times with a horseman's thinking they are wonderful. Or at leats they always have been, as there is now't like a 'oss for making you out to be a liar :p

When I had one done by the vet I had to fight not to have him sedated (he was retired and at the vet for his retirement appointment, so I thought I would have them done while I was there) even though he had been done for the past 5 years not sedated and with no issues whatsoever. They still insisted on the crush, which I was OK with.
 

Red-1

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Vets are keen on sedation as they are the ones sorting out the mess when it goes wrong!
I think that a horse under sedation is more at risk than one trained to stand still fully conscious. I appreciate that the vet's time is money, so they may decide that an owner won't pay for their time to do it right. I can't see the need for sedation for one that is done every 6 months without sedation or any problems.
 

hopscotch bandit

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Beastie is due a check, will be his first one done by an EDT and not a vet for a little while. EDT has said they don't require sedation and beastie doesn't necessarily need it as he's good as gold but have been advised by my vet that it's helpful in order for dentist to get a clearer look even in a calm horse?
I've never bothered with sedation either, she's pretty calm and the EDT has a good way with her and often doesn't even want me to hold her. As long as the person doing the dentistry has a gag there is no reason why they can't look at the whole mouth. After she had the trauma of her slab fracture out she had a check up with another vet as I wasn't sure that the remaining tooth wasn't causing problems (there was a lot that remained) and the vet just put a gag on and managed to look at her fine. Fortunately everything was fine and the tooth is healthy still.
 
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Lintel

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I personally sedate- my quiet loving lump of a highland throws his head about like a mad man. Fighting with 500kg of animal with a metal headpiece is not worth the risk imo.
He is only this way due to a bad experience when he was younger. Which was entirely preventable but being 14 years old at the time I didn't do anything as I trusted the vet... the guilt really eats me up to this day!
 

Surbie

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Mine doesn't like power tools much or being rushed, which makes him throw himself about and charge about his box, but he will stand stock still and dribble for an EDT who will take time with him and use manual tools. Having said that he's not had to see a dentist when he's in pain.

My vet will only do teeth with sedation tho.
 

dogatemysalad

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I've never had any of mine sedated for teeth, including a young filly. The EDTs have always been very calm and patient with worried souls. This is why I prefer to use them and not vets who like to sedate them.
 

Denbob

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Denzel has only been sedated for teeth the most recent time when he was seen by my vet - has been seen previously without and his only fault was trying to drink the liquid the vet had his tools in despite his usual bucket being in its usual place and trying to chew a hole in the vet's shirt... massive dope.
 

Follysmum

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3 of mine are sedated purely because the EDT can not do them safely and do a proper job without, they are really nervous and can be a danger with the gag on. To minimise this they only have them done once a year.
 
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All of mine have always been fine but always used an EDT.

Was present when a vet was there for a friend to do dental work. Insisted on sedating very chilled horse to ‘get a better look at the back of its mouth’. Horses head was then on the floor and even this small vet struggled to look in with both of us holding his head up.

Another vet came out to do friends other mare a short time later. Walks into stable with gag and attempts to put it on from in front of the horse with no warning. Horse panics and runs back. Vet insisted sedation is needed as the horse is a danger without.

It was an eye opener! All my EDTs have spent time introducing themself to the horse, having breaks and getting them to accept the gag. One memorable time an EDT came to do my 4 year old for what may of been its first time. He did my other horse in the stable next door so the young one could observe and hear the sounds. Then asked for a cup of tea. Spent his 15 minute tea break stood stroking young horse in the stable and letting him sniff all the equipment. Was good as gold!
 

supsup

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Mine has been routinely sedated the last two times after changing vet practice. He'd been done without all his prior life. The vet's reasoning was that working on an unsedated horse is a much greater injury risk for her, and requires her to work in an awkward position, trying to follow the horse's head. Sedated, the head is put on a chest-high pillow, the vet has a clearer view and can rasp without contortions. This particular vet has had back problems and simply doesn't want to take the risk. She did try without, and of course there was some moving about of the head. I could see her point and then agreed to sedation.
What I find most annoying about it is that I need to stay around longer to wait for the sedation to wear off, when I should be heading back to work.
 

Red-1

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I think the point is that if it needs sedating it isn't going to stand still.
No, my point was that my vets want to sedate weather or not the owner says the horse will stand still. Most will not even try to treat other than a simple treatment without pre-emptive sedating.

As well as to do dentistry, I had a similar fight to X Ray, to shockwave therapy, to ultrasound. He stood perfectly still as I said he would, no sedation, but I spent longer arguing the toss that the treatment actually took. I think sedating them makes them feel awful, and is not good for them.

I do sedate if it is going to be a painful treatment, but not for routine stuff.
 

Red-1

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All of mine have always been fine but always used an EDT.

Was present when a vet was there for a friend to do dental work. Insisted on sedating very chilled horse to ‘get a better look at the back of its mouth’. Horses head was then on the floor and even this small vet struggled to look in with both of us holding his head up.

Another vet came out to do friends other mare a short time later. Walks into stable with gag and attempts to put it on from in front of the horse with no warning. Horse panics and runs back. Vet insisted sedation is needed as the horse is a danger without.

It was an eye opener! All my EDTs have spent time introducing themself to the horse, having breaks and getting them to accept the gag. One memorable time an EDT came to do my 4 year old for what may of been its first time. He did my other horse in the stable next door so the young one could observe and hear the sounds. Then asked for a cup of tea. Spent his 15 minute tea break stood stroking young horse in the stable and letting him sniff all the equipment. Was good as gold!
This is like my EDT too. I am prepared to pay for the extra time it takes to make sure the horse is not full of worry.
 

JanetGeorge

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Does your vet even agree to do them without sedation if they definitely don't need it? It's a great way to run up the bill to double the price. I'm a cynic!
lol, and not far wrong. My longstanding former vet (he retired) scanned almost all my mares with no sedation. His 'colleague' - who took over until I sacked her - insisted on doping everything to the eyeballs and STILL made serious errors. Vet needed TWO doses of dope to try and do one of my mares - my EDT did her with no sedation - he admitted she was a 'bit more difficult' than the rest. He only asked for sedation once - and that was for the removal of two wolf teeth in the lower jaw that were inside the 6's - and a severe risk of haemorrhage there if the horse (a 4yo) had played up. Vet came and doped him and watched, lol. And he cost me MUCH more than the EDT even discounting the cost of the dope.
 

Tiddlypom

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Meep!

My old school EDT gets a pretty good look at the back of the mouth without using sedation - this mare had horrendous untreated dental issues (has a missing molar) when he took her on, but over a period of 2 years he's rescued her mouth to 80% of optimal.

He's not averse to a bit of sedalin on a newbie/youngster/rescue for their first time.

image.jpeg


image.jpeg

Making friends with a very nervous new young foster filly when he was here to do the older horses. She'd already seen him at work through the talk grilles. He didn't float her teeth, he just ran his hands over her and opened her mouth. Left her feeling happy, and well prepared for rasping when she's older.
image.jpeg
 

Tarragon

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My pony would let you do his teeth without sedation when it was done manually but he wasn't so keen when the practice moved to power tools. I was advised that power tools are better than manual for the pony and teeth because less effort needed to be used so the teeth are not rocked as much. The argument being that a hand held tool needed more force to be effective and would gradually loosen the teeth over time. So the option I was given was no sedation but bad effect on teeth versus sedation and kinder on teeth.
I have gone down the sedation route but I do wonder sometimes if I am not just overly easily persuaded by a practice that may give advice that is tinged with self-interest.
 

EventingMum

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No, my point was that my vets want to sedate weather or not the owner says the horse will stand still. Most will not even try to treat other than a simple treatment without pre-emptive sedating.

As well as to do dentistry, I had a similar fight to X Ray, to shockwave therapy, to ultrasound. He stood perfectly still as I said he would, no sedation, but I spent longer arguing the toss that the treatment actually took. I think sedating them makes them feel awful, and is not good for them.

I do sedate if it is going to be a painful treatment, but not for routine stuff.
Most qualified EDTs will only request sedation as a matter of course more more advanced procedures not routine floating unless the horse is really problematic. I can understand vets wanting them sedated for x rays and some scans due the the risk of damage to very expensive equipment. Recently the vet forgot to sedate one of mine for scanning and shock wave therapy - luckily the horse stood perfectly and the vet's face was a picture when he realised!
 
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