Self employed grooms

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Polar Bear9

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So I work at two yards, one I am self employed and send an invoice each month. I have been doing this for 2 months now but have not registered as self employed or anything else. I have just agreed to also go self employed at the other yard (been working there as an employee for about 6 months) on a significantly higher rate of pay. Both my bosses are wonderful so I have no worries about holiday etc. I have my own insurance anyway, both BHS Gold and grooms insurance through the BGA

Do I need to do anything else now? Ive been keeping careful records of my hours and days working but the HMRC website has me very confused. Do I need to register now? When will I need to do tax returns? I've been told my mileage (which is a lot) is tax deductible, is that the case? To complicate it I have just quit a third job and still waiting on a p45. As I had two official jobs I was being taxed at 20% on one of my yard jobs. When I go fully self employed will there be no tax until I do my tax returns? :/ Help!
Thanks
 
You should have already registered with HMRC to be blunt I very much doubt they will allow you to do what you are doing self employed as they are very hot on the criteria being met. For one if you are regularly employed and have set hours they wont allow it. You need to prove that you are taking entrepreneurial risk in your business which Involves no definite income and usually involves you supplying your own equipment etc. They do this as it is not meant to be a way of cheating the system for either party.
You will also need to pay self employed national insurance on a monthly basis from day one.I can tell you now the change with the job you are on the books for now they are very unlikely to allow.
Just remember that you may delay paying your first tax bill but the first one may cripple you as not only will you need to pay your first account they will also want payment on account for the following year of the same amount and this is normally where the crunch comes for many businesses.
You are already running a risk by not already registering the other employment.
Be careful what you put on here as HMRC employees keep horses as well!!!!
 
I use two freelancers and others now and again and I think you will struggle to be self employed on the yard who have been treating you as an employee up to now
I would get advice from an accountant pdq.
 
Although not working in the horse industry when I was working freelance for a couple of companies the way I was advised by the accountant to do it was to set myself up as a limited company and bill the people I was working for from the company and pay myself a wage from the company. Once it was set up it wasn't difficult to run though the books had to go to the accountant at year end to do all the paperwork.
 
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I know you have to register for self-assessment, but that is the limit of my knowledge! I think I'm going to be having a lengthy conversation with HMRC on the very same subject over the next few days! I do think the website is next to useless.
 
Thanks all for the advise

popsdosh said:
You should have already registered with HMRC to be blunt I very much doubt they will allow you to do what you are doing self employed as they are very hot on the criteria being met. For one if you are regularly employed and have set hours they wont allow it. You need to prove that you are taking entrepreneurial risk in your business which Involves no definite income and usually involves you supplying your own equipment etc. They do this as it is not meant to be a way of cheating the system for either party.
You will also need to pay self employed national insurance on a monthly basis from day one.I can tell you now the change with the job you are on the books for now they are very unlikely to allow.
Just remember that you may delay paying your first tax bill but the first one may cripple you as not only will you need to pay your first account they will also want payment on account for the following year of the same amount and this is normally where the crunch comes for many businesses.
You are already running a risk by not already registering the other employment.
Be careful what you put on here as HMRC employees keep horses as well!!!!
Click to expand...

Thanks popsdosh, do you know if there is there some kind of website where these criteria they need meeting are outlined? In a simpler way than the HMRC site which is confusing me :/ My hours are not fixed at the moment. I don't think I will be above £9000 for this tax year across all three jobs (all part time, I was at Uni until a few months ago) so I don't have to pay income tax? Would I need to pay tax for next year even if I'm not above the threshold for this year? Bleugh, so confused.
 
It says on their website that you do not need to register until Oct of your businesses second tax year, I thought a month wouldnt matter. That is why I haven't registered yet. Will get on it right away though
 
Polar Bear9 said:
Thanks all for the advise



Thanks popsdosh, do you know if there is there some kind of website where these criteria they need meeting are outlined? In a simpler way than the HMRC site which is confusing me :/ My hours are not fixed at the moment. I don't think I will be above £9000 for this tax year across all three jobs (all part time, I was at Uni until a few months ago) so I don't have to pay income tax? Would I need to pay tax for next year even if I'm not above the threshold for this year? Bleugh, so confused.
Click to expand...

It is really easier to talk to them and ask the questions the real issue is nearly every case is looked at on its merits and the goal posts move. I do know they are very anti you changing to self employed with somebody you are already working for and paying PAYE.
If your earning are only that for this tax year no you wont need to pay up front for the next year but please keep it in mind because it can be a real ball breaker further down the line.
Can I just ask is it your choice or your employers idea for you to go self employed!! There are massive advantages to them and potential negatives for you! Have you thought about no holiday pay,or sick pay which is not insignificant in a risky profession. I assume when you are self employed you will be charging more? as you will be taking away from them substantial employment cost and you will need more to maintain the same level of income. When you do start doing your accounts and returns you will asked when you want your financial year to end as it does not have to be the same as the tax year. I would suggest you make this as long as you can to use up all your available tax allowance. Your first accounting period can be in excess of 12 months if you want it to be . After the first year they do not like you changing it but it is possible.
Doing your own accounts and tax returns are very simple in your situation ,I do all my own and its hellishly more complicated . Talk to HMRC try and see if you can get on some sort of training day that will explain everything it will all fall into place for you.
Oh yes keep track of your business miles . It is easier and more beneficial to claim a mileage allowance for your miles than trying to split out running cost for a vehicle that is unless you intend buying a van or something as part of the business cars are not a suitable business investment because of scale charges however commercials are fully allowable against tax.. PM me if you have any questions and will help if I can just dont want to bore everybody on here.

Oh and thats not an offer of free tax advice to all and sundry!
 
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Can I steal this thread for a moment?

I'm also confused with the tax website. I started a new job after not working for 6 months, and have been put on the tax code 0tx, and am currently being taxed 20%. If I don't do anything will I get it back at the end of the financial year?

I definitely don't earn enough to be on that much tax- I'm not sure I'd earn enough to be taxed at all.

Oops! Sorry Popsdosh! Just saw your last comment! Still though, if anyone would like to comment ;)
 
you need to call them up they should put your code right. Did you not give your new employer a P45 Things wont change until your employer has yout correct code. even the change of tax year wont rectify that.
 
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My husband retired, but took another job for 3 months to top up...

He was instantly charged 40% tax, despite his total income not being about to need 40%. He did contact them straight away, but it took over a year to sort it out.

My advice would be to hold onto the phone until you speak to a real person, it is surprising what they can do while you are actually on the phone.

You need to make sure you pay the Nat Ins, as that will make sure you get a state pension. I have run my business for 8 years now, albeit alongside an employed role, and only ever have had to pay for the tax I have owed. I am not sure when you start to have to pay next year in advance as well?
 
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