Selling a horse - dealer responsibilities?

[rebs]

Does anyone know if there are any legal requirements for a seller? I bought a horse from a dealer 5 weeks ago who has turned out to be nothing like she was described and is totally unsuitable for what I wanted. Is there any requirement for the dealer to take her back and refund me? At the moment the dealer has offered to take her and resell her and refund me once she is resold, minus livery costs for the period between returning her and reselling. Is this the best I can hope for? Is there any comeback in terms of her not being as advertised and described for the dealer to refund me without ending up having to take it to court?

 

[shortstuff99]

Yes if the horse is not as described then the dealer is legally obliged to take the horse back for a refund.

 

[ihatework]

Yes if it is abundantly clear the horse is not as described then the dealer should refund.

However, some ‘not as described’ traits can be a little subjective and usually come about when the buyer just isn’t competent enough for the horse they have bought (not necessarily implying this is you btw).

So I suppose it depends what the horse was described as and why you feel it is not as described.

 

[ycbm]

Was it a dealer sale. Did the person who sold it to you actually own the horse, or were they acting as an agent. Your rights are much lower buying from an agent than from a dealer who owns the horse.

Who did you pay, this will be pivotal?
.

 

[rebs]

The mare was described as genuine and straightforward - the dealer said she could be slightly grumpy in the stable. Since getting her home she has been very defensive aggressive in the stable - ears flat back, snapping teeth, coming at you with mouth wide open, lifted a leg at me when I went in to top up her water. Then aggressive behaviour outside the stable as well, trying to kick me, trying to bite me, actually bit me. Of course the dealer denies she ever did any of this with her.
I paid the dealer direct for her.

 

[ihatework]

I’d suggest you get some advice from BHS legal.

My personal opinion is that the dealer told you she was grumpy in the stable. If having a sweet cuddly horse was important I’d have been quizzing the dealer to the nth degree and want to witness behaviours. Grumpy behaviours are manageable and don’t mean the horse won’t do job they are sold for. It might be that with a review of management and confident handling they subside over time.

I appreciate it’s disappointing - new horse isn’t behaving like you hoped.

 

[Equi]

Hmm so she did say she was grumpy and that’s what you’re getting. This could be a tricky one legally.

 

[paddy555]

The mare was described as genuine and straightforward - the dealer said she could be slightly grumpy in the stable. Since getting her home she has been very defensive aggressive in the stable - ears flat back, snapping teeth, coming at you with mouth wide open, lifted a leg at me when I went in to top up her water. Then aggressive behaviour outside the stable as well, trying to kick me, trying to bite me, actually bit me. Of course the dealer denies she ever did any of this with her.
I paid the dealer direct for her.

when you went to view the horse did you look at her behaviour in the stable? how did she behave towards you as you walked in? could you handle her? did you brush her and saddle her yourself?

In addition to the possibility of the dealer misleading you have 2 other alternatives. Firstly the horse is simply trying it on with you. New horse sizing up the new owner and asking the question of "what if" The new owner has not explained very quickly that this behaviour won't work.

Other alternative is that the move has affected the horse badly and you are looking at ulcers or something similar due to the change of ownership.

From what you describe it doesn't come across as a black and white situation.

To start going forward I would hand her care over to someone else who is very experienced for a few days and move away from the situation. How does she behave with them? If pretty well then look to yourself, if still very badly consider ulcers, stress etc.

 

[Kaylum]

Yes what was she like when you viewed her. Was she sedate. Have you had anyone look at her like a vet? She might be in pain could be her teeth, her back or yes indeed as suggested above ulcers. Did you get her vetted?

 

[ycbm]

Yes if the horse is not as described then the dealer is legally obliged to take the horse back for a refund.

Only if they owned it when they sold it. In my experience, most dealers are actually agents, selling a horse they don't own and taking commission from the owner.
.

 

[splashgirl45]

have you changed her management,this could have upset her she could have been used to 24/7 turnout , some horses dont like being in at all. also what are you feeding her, this can have a huge effect on behaviour..as the dealer told you she was grumpy in the stable i feel you will have difficulty proving she was not as described

 

[black and brown]

Maybe she is feeling stressed following a yard move and is being extra defensive. If she was sold as being 'grumpy' then possibly her behaviour will calm down as she settles but she will never be a cuddly horse. Firm boundaries but also a sympathetic approach may help her to settle. I feel for you!

 

[honetpot]

Being grumpy in the stable is not really an objective description, so it's open to interpretation. Our old PC was grumpy, and would bite, and we would work around him, because he was a saint ridden, you could but a small novice child on him, and he was push button. One year when he went to PC camp and had to be stabled, you could see the look of horror on instructors faces when he pushed his way out of the stable for the third time, it was a bit like putting a lion in a cage. You had to watch your self when you tacked up, and his behaviour would deteriorate when he went anywhere new.
So it depends what you call grumpy, and if the horse is being defensive because it's anxious, because it's moved homes and the routine has changed.

 

[blitznbobs]

What you describe is what i would interpret as a grumpy horse… i have had saintly horses to ride that are bar stewards in the stable especially if they think you have victim tattooed on your forehead… you are going to struggle legally with this one imo

 

[AmyMay]

But is she genuine and straightforward?

How long did the dealer have her prior to selling?

 

[Ratface]

At feed time my old boy does a very convincing impression of a hungry cocodile. Ears pinned, pinched nostrils, long yellow teeth out, waving snake neck.
A brisk"get back," plus sharp forefinger pointed at mid chest produces the desired move away.
When he stands still, the feed bowl is put down and its' bearer immediately leaves the stable.
This took at least a month to train, as he'd frightened his previous owner into a chuck and run method, which was wasteful.

 

[Goldenstar]

The dealer said grumpy you have got grumpy .
Your error was not to interrogate the dealer more fully what grumpy meant and testing it out .
I think you will struggle to return the horse if you go to law it might go either way but to my mind you have got what the dealer said the horse was .

 

[skint1]

Is she good to ride? If so, it might be worth persevering on the ground work stuff, it may subside once the mare establishes herself with you.

 

[Melody Grey]

Firm but fair handling and a tummy supplement to calm things down might help?

FWIW, I moved my horses last week and for the first few days, the most ‘reliable’ two were gits. The one I thought might be a handful has been so laid back he’s horizontal. Don’t under-estimate the impact of a new environment and needing adjustment time. It could be that ‘grumpy on the ground’ has temporarily turned into ‘dinosaur’