Selling horses & disclosing info

[Zebedee]

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Does anyone know whether the Small Claims Court can/will prove if a person is a Dealer or not?

As a friend could certainly do with help on this one having bought from a dealer whose claiming not to be.

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Your friend needs to gather as much anecdotal evidence as possible....along with any advertisments from the papers / internet etc. Even if someone is only selling horses as a sideline they can still be counted as dealing if it can be shown that they are making some part of their living from this activity.

 

[Zebedee]

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on the last 2 vettings i have experienced the vet (different ones/practices) asked the seller in both cases if the horse had had any injuries , medical conditions , vices or behavioural issues

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That's what should happen, as it also to an extent exonerates the vet if the purchaser is being less than honest !!
Of course vendors never make sure they're unavailable at the time of the vetting leaving someone else who genuinely doesn't know the history to deal with things......or do they ???!!! However most vets are now wise to that one & will actually record that they were unable to get complete answers to the questions they asked, & may even advise their client to persue the answers themselves.

 

[dieseldog]

The last time I sold a horse that was vetted I had to sign the back of the vetting to say what injuries the horse had had that I knew about. I'm not sure if all vets use this vetting template, I also had to sign to say if he had any vices, but I thought it was quite a good idea.

Personally after the nightmare experience I had buying Dolly I would never wished to be classed as the same disgusting person that sold me her. I like to think that I am a lot higher up the food chain than he is. I asked all the questions he lied.

 

[pendam]

Think for welfare of the horse a seller should tell purchaser of any problems however minor. Friend bought horse last year and asked lots questions horse really bad now (foot problems) and he even passed a 5* vetting, the old owners must have know about this problem cause he was x-rayed and the problem had not just occured (major pedal bone rotation) in the first 3 months of new ownership. Funnily enough she has not been able to contact the old owner

 

[Hollycat]

Good idea re the insurance. I also read on here that you can ask the horses current vet to print a report of its treatment as long as you have the permission of the owner. Unless they use different practices for vaccination and for serious illnesses this would give you a good idea of what treatment the horse had received. I had to get this report to send to the insurance company when my horse died and its very easy to get. If the owner refused to let you order this report then alarm bells may ring and it could save you an expensive vetting.

 

[Weezy]

Yes a seller should disclose info, but remember they can only disclose what they know about themselves. I have found out that a horse sold to me (not P) as never having had an injury, actually had had various probs with the prior owner, who didn't disclose to the woman I bought off - sadly if the initial owner had passed the info on then the horse would have had a far more comfortable life, as it was he didn't.

I think CC gives a very good suggestion re: insurance certificate viewing, and I do think that at vettings vets should have full access to past vet records, would make life a lot easier.

If the injury is significant then you need to take it up with the vet - if he didn't see it then is it THAT significant?

 

[Rambo]

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Depends, I would tell them, just for the well being of the horse
ie you could be selling it as a broodmare, but they might be thinking they could event it in a few months/years time, but if they knew about the injury they may think differently!!
I think telling the truth is the best bet when selling horses, otherwise something may come back and bite you!

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Im not selling Spider! I just wondered what happens in those situations.

If you then find out a horse has had an injury and the seller didnt say, can you do anything?

Just always thought you 'had' to disclose all

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A fairly well known SJ'er was bankrupted a few years ago after it was proven that a horse he sold had a pre-existing injury which he hadn't disclosed when he sold the it. He was 'done' for over half a million £££'s from memory

 

[BBH]

If memory serves me right there was a high profile eventing case aswell involving a horse bought for hundreds of £000.

It does surprise me though when well known people do it, you would think they have a reputation to protect.

 

[Flame_]

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Just a small point about the insurance, from another angle. If the horse has a previous injury which has healed but has quite possibly left a weakness, as already mentioned it will probably be excluded on the insurance.

In some ways a potential buyer is better off NOT knowing all the history if they want the horse fully insurable. The vet usually finds enough problems leading to exclusions at the vetting. If the full history of every horse was always truly totally passed on from owner to owner, by the time a horse is ten it will be lucky to be still covered for anything, or sellable to anyone.

 

[JM07]

was the hypothetical horse vetted when it was bought?

why didnt that highlight the significant injury/lameness?

 

[treacle_beastie]

If it was bought privately then it is definitely buyer beware which is why most people have a vetting done or at least get the seller to write out a receipt saying 'sold as seen with no vices/injuries/illnesses etc to their knowlege. Again agreeing with other peoples comments - the seller must know about it first and they should really disclose it if ifs going to cause future problems - this is the duty of care part. However if they did know, were not asked and they believe it had no detriment to future use then they dont need to say anything.
If it is through a dealer then the sale of goods act comes in to play and you can take it back if something wasnt right and could be proven then have sold it on with this info.
Sorry if this doesnt help your 'hypothetcial' problem but agree with the others that I dont think you would stand any chance of making any sort of recovery in the situation you describe