Selling Horses? - Do buyers really appreciate Honesty?

I do definately prefer an honest seller, that's why I tend to buy from professionals, who have a good name to protect.
I bought a tb mare a couple of years ago, who I had some serious teething problems with but they told me she wasn't an easy horse so I never blamed the seller.
She sadly died after an accident in the field, so I went back to the same seller & bought one of her home bred youngsters.
She's a much more straight forward character than the other horse I bought but I was told that she didn't have much scope so wouldn't jump a big course.
I don't mind but if I'd wanted to do a lot of jumping it would have been important information.
It made good business sense to be honest with me as I that meant that I bought 2 horses from them.
 
No. I think there is being honest and being honest! A horse is a horse at the end of the day and if someone went on about the negative points too much I would probably discount perfectly suitable horses. I think that you should be honest about vices and quirks but putting down that a horse can be spooky if a massive tractor and trailer flies by within and inch or that it napped once 3 years ago or that someone fell off it because it spooked once I think that is silly.
Buyers should use their common sense. If an advert says it is Not a Novice ride, it's not for a Novice or if the horse is a 4yr old TB don't buy it if you are looking for a safe hack once a week.
 
RainbowDash said:
Hi,

As the title really and out of interest.

If a seller honestly listed all the good points (i.e. lovely stable manners, hacks in company - front, middle or behind, lots of scope, easy to lead, clip, and farrier) and were completely honest about the the bad points (i.e. prone to bolting if ridden alone, 70% in traffic as long as it's not trailer/skip etc, spooks at logs, prams and cycles, naps, doesn't school etc) in an advert - would you view/buy?

Personally I like blunt and honest adverts - what's your thoughts/experiences?
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Yes.

I'd far prefer to know any bad points in advance and decide whether I was happy dealing with them. As a seller I'd prefer someone phoning up wanting the horse I was selling, not half of it! Cuts down on timewasters both sides. I'd also then wonder what else was hidden that wasn't worth saying as I might not find out 'til purchased.

I have been to a viewing with a friend for a safe and sane happy hacker... to find him rearing repeatedly (in hand) when asked to go into the schooling paddock and then had to be run (at full pelt) through. Owners friend legged up on him and then circled telling us 'he makes me feel like a novice' he wouldn't go out of walk and kept threatening to rear and buck. Owner says didn't hack alone.
Friend declined a ride. Owner said this was all was normal for him (wasted 3hour drive!)

He was absolutely brilliant and so good (everything was threats that he wasn't happy - not nasty - and could have easily dumped rider) good on the ground aside from entering paddock. But nothing like what was advertised.

Personally if I read an advert saying he had a buck in him I'd not waste time viewing. If he had a rear, I'd pop along to see. So some bad habits are acceptable to me to accept or sort out, others I wouldn't touch. Same with most people.

So advertising to the right buyer is key. Don't advertise a project as a novice horse, or you'lll get people wanting a novice horse. Advertise as a project etc.
 
Firewell said:
No. I think there is being honest and being honest! A horse is a horse at the end of the day and if someone went on about the negative points too much I would probably discount perfectly suitable horses. I think that you should be honest about vices and quirks but putting down that a horse can be spooky if a massive tractor and trailer flies by within and inch or that it napped once 3 years ago or that someone fell off it because it spooked once I think that is silly.
Buyers should use their common sense. If an advert says it is Not a Novice ride, it's not for a Novice or if the horse is a 4yr old TB don't buy it if you are looking for a safe hack once a week.
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Agree on this level. Bad habits that are out of the norm I want advertised. But things that would set most horses off can be mentioned over the phone/viewing as long as they weren't biggies like doesn't hack alone/bucks/rears/bolts etc.
 
maree t said:
I find it really hard to word things correctly though. I didnt get a single reply to my last ad and wondered if I had made her sound worse than she is.
She is a great allrounder but fast. She has done everything but does pull the biggest and best bitch faces I have ever seen. She has never bitten or kicked though. She is only in a snaffle and if the rider uses their seat she pulls up no problem but she enjoys going fast and I dont want a rider that is always going to be pulling her around.
Do I say not first pony , or great 2nd pony or not novice ride ( although she can have complete novices pootling round the field they wouldnt be able to take her out )
Dreading having to sell but she has been outgrown.
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I wouldn't say about faces (as long as not followed up) as this can be discussed on the phone/person and doesn't affect safety.

I'd say about snaffle, responsive to seat aids so would suit more competant rider and will go far.. Fantastic all rounder has done X,Y,Z and especially enjoys X,Y,Z. Put photos and possibly a video to back this up too. Don't say she jumps and stick a photo on with her in a rug over winter, etc :)

Although is safe in a school/field with a novice, she is far more suited as a second pony as enjoys her work.

Sell her good points, mention her bad points (if compromise safety/medical)
 
My boy was advertised as the perfect pony if you could catch him and the perfect hack if you could get on!

When I went to see him (my OH insisted I could "fix" him and he was a bargain price) He was very nervous but not as bad as the advert made out. The seller kept willing my pony to do his naughty things so I could see him at his worst!

He turned out to be my perfect pony and I love him to bits. The advert did put me off a little bit, but at the same time I felt confident nothing was being hidden from me.

He comes to call and is much easier to mount now. (personally I think it was a trust issue) It could of been a horrible situation as if she had advertised him as the perfect pony, bar being a little nervous he was great when I went to try him and I could have ended up with a whole world of problems for a much heftier price tag!

I prefer an honest advert to a dishonest one. xx
 
When I was looking I responded to an ad in the yellow Free Ads for a horse a couple of hours away. It was a 16 year old girl selling him with the help of her instructor. The instructor wrote the ad and he sounded lovely but when I phoned the girl's mum answered the phone and assuming she was the seller I asked her for more info. She said the daughter was worried there wasn't enough info in the ad so had written her own piece that she would send on to me. What arrived was 2 pages of A4 that was like a school essay. It was very detailed and very honest. I liked what I read and arranged to see him. He was lovely and I wanted him but although he didn't fail the vet as such, he was worried about the shape of his mouth and his teeth and his ability to keep weight on. He was a Welsh x Tb who was on the TBside and I was worried about keeping weight on him as I've always had good doers so didn't go for him. I really appreciated her honesty but I think her being 16 and a bit naiive made her do it. I think I would do something similar if I ever sold a horse.

I appreciate adverts in print need to be short but web adverts could easily have an FAQ section for each horse or marks out of 10 for each element like, travelling, clipping,shoeing, catching, traffic, hacking alone /in company. I'd be very suspicious of a horse that scored 10 on everything!
 
_GG_ said:
Horse*

Sorry, am on phone so can't quote yourquestion and please forgive any.mistakes :-)

Basically, I will just be honest. If I think the horse is too much for the viewer, I will say that I will have a think about any other horses that might be more suitable but that, on this occasion I.believe the horse to be a little too much for the rider. If they say they don't care and they want it anyway, I will just say that whilst I respect that, I need to ensure that the horse is being used to its full potential and that knowing the horse better, I believe it would be as poor match and one I will not be responsible for. I have never offended anyone and most people are genuinely grateful that I consider their future safety/confidence.

Another example is a lovely section d I am selling now. He has beautiful flat training and will trot or canter into any jump, maintaing rhythm, never stops, just like a rocking horse. The viewer fell in love as he is stunning, but she wants to event competitively. This horse could go PSG with the right rider as his dressage is so establishes and he learns so quickly...he loves it. He foes live to jump, but he doesn't have the same natural ability to be able to bring in the ribbons eventing, as her old TB did. She would be left disappointed and he would he left not fulfilling his potential and also, possibly doing work that he doesn't thrive on.

You HAVE to be responsible when selling horses. If you overhorse a buyer, you risk that horse being poorly handled. For example and experienced rider may know that the horse just needs a good smack and telling to get on with it. An inexperienced rider may change bits, strap down in draw reins and ruin a good horse, selling it on to god knows who.
Or, and more dangerously, people can very very badly hurt, very quickly when overhorsed.

In terms of underhorsing..you are just giving the horse an unsettled future as the buyer will Dion realise they want more.

Horses are animals, not machines. If people are worried about the occasional spook, they should rethink what they expect from horses. If they frown upon a horse that fidgets having the girth done up or legs hosed...get a grip, there is no such thing as a perfect horse.

You just have to do your best to avoid nasty surprises, avoid potentially dangerous matches and avoid uncertain futures for the horses.
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ABSOLUTELY AGREE!!
I've had some really strange people turn up when I have had a horse for sale. Once a family turned up to try a young driving cob here. They told me they were experienced drivers, but couldn't work out how to put the harness on. At that point, I told them that I would not sell to them but would be happy to take them for a drive. They were very rude, saying they had come a long way. I said that it was a matter of safety (good old H&S!), and that I wasn't having a good pony driven into a car. I've had another came to try a young eventer that I was selling for somebody else. She was cantering happily in circles in the school, when she suddenly said "how do I stop him?". I was taken aback, as the horse was behaving perfectly. In the end, she spun him in a tight circle, where upon he tripped and she fell off. I told her that he wasn't the horse for her (as tactfully as I could), then she said "are you saying I can't ride?!". I managed to get of her eventually. There are a lot of people out there with very inflated ideas of how well they can ride.
 
cundlegreen said:
ABSOLUTELY AGREE!!
I've had some really strange people turn up when I have had a horse for sale. Once a family turned up to try a young driving cob here. They told me they were experienced drivers, but couldn't work out how to put the harness on. At that point, I told them that I would not sell to them but would be happy to take them for a drive. They were very rude, saying they had come a long way. I said that it was a matter of safety (good old H&S!), and that I wasn't having a good pony driven into a car. I've had another came to try a young eventer that I was selling for somebody else. She was cantering happily in circles in the school, when she suddenly said "how do I stop him?". I was taken aback, as the horse was behaving perfectly. In the end, she spun him in a tight circle, where upon he tripped and she fell off. I told her that he wasn't the horse for her (as tactfully as I could), then she said "are you saying I can't ride?!". I managed to get of her eventually. There are a lot of people out there with very inflated ideas of how well they can ride.
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The amount of people I see trying horses advertised as not novice rides that are perhaps only just getting to novice level themselves is staggering.

The most difficult situation in usually young riders that have been doing very well at their riding school on horse and ponies for whom, the monthly clear rounds etc are second nature. They come to view a horse as their first horse and want something flashy and special. It is very difficult sometimes explaining to these children and their parents that actually, "this horse is quite well schooled and whilst you may have done everything at your riding school, it has been on very forgiving horses. If you were to give this horse conflicting aids out of imbalance, lack of understanding, rushing to learn something new etc...you can run the risk of the horse saying no. Some will bolt, some will rear etc. it won't be the horses fault, but purely because I have agreed to sell you a horse that you are just not quite ready for".

Like I said before, I have never offended anyone. Some of the children get offended, but the parents always appreciate that I put safety of horse and rider first.

Before now I have actually shouted at a 20 year old to get off my horse and get off the yard. She repeatedly ignored my instruction to keep her fe**ing hands still. I could see the horse getting ready to explode. She didn't listen, horse stopped and I got there just as horse started getting light on front end. Horse had never ever done anything like this before, but she was kicking it on and sawing at the mouth and it was a young horse...she fried its brain. Her father, who had been telling me to let her get on with it soon changed his mind. I actually said to him that if he wasn't concerned with his daughters safety, fine, but I was.

They had seen the horse go beautifully for the 10 year old that rode before her..she was just a.bad rider with grand delusions of greatness.

You must put safety first!
 
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From the buyers perspective I think honesty is key!
When we bought Topaz, we were looking for a horse for my mum but that I would be able to jump and compete on. We didn't mind a forward quirky horse and we told the sellers that, Topaz seemed to fit the bill perfectly, and she is a fab if not quirky horse that can jump for fun, once we got over the shock of her huge bouncy paces!

However, were the sellers really that honest about everything.... No they weren't!

I asked if she had ever been hunting as although not what we were buying for, I have drag hunted in the past and would love to do it again, The response was she was fantastic. She had been out a few times, and had stayed the whole day but was a bit unsettled in between each leg, but as she was hunted as a four/five year old we thought that sounded about right, hunts are over-whelming for a youngster and expecting them to stand still after all that galloping and jumping was unrealistic for most babies.

So we bought her and after we had owned her for about 6 months and we had gotten to know her, I tried hunting her.

OMG:eek:, a horse has never scared me before like she did that day! I don't want to get into the meaning behind the word bolting, but to me anyway, what she did that day was bolting! She has a super light mouth and had never tanked off or even really pulled, but she went that day and not a thing I did made a blind bit of difference! I have horses take off with me before but this was so different, I was merely a passenger and only got her home by the hunt corralling her with four of their horses to the end of the leg and then managing to calm her down enough to bring her back along the lanes, and even away from the hunt it was still a dicey ride!

I was furious there was not a chance she was so well behave on her previous hunting outings, the seller put everyone in danger that day! Not just me and Topaz due to my none-existent control, but also everyone else on the hunt as when she went she ran into other horses, I couldn't slow her for jumps so we cut people up, pushed them over fences and was generally massively dangerous for all involved! But there was no need to lie, we weren't buying a hunting horse just an all-rounder for riding club and I just asked if she had ever been before!

They also neglected to mention that she also bucked/reared and bronco-ed like a good'un!

Now I'm not the best rider by any stretch of the imagination, but I am brave and I think Topaz was lucky to end up with us as the sellers clearly didn't give two hoots where she went and what happened to her:mad:. As it turns out she just needed time to mature and see the world which I was capable of doing with her, I dread to think what could have happened in a home with less brave/stupid :rolleyes: owners as me and my mum, as I've got horsey friends who are as good as or better riders than me who wouldn't ever get on her from seeing her erm excitable behavior:D! It was just such a daft thing to lie about her hunting:confused:, I mean if we'd gone for a hunter then maybe I could understand the temptation to big this side up or maybe they thought as it was only a passing interest I might never actually take her, who knows but Topaz has landed on her feet and isn't going anywhere, not that anyone would have her from her past behavior :D.

Sorry for the long post, but this topic hits a nerve with me, as Topaz's story could have had such a different ending!
 
_GG_ said:
If I am selling, I insist on warts and all descriptions. I have said no to more buyers than I have sad yes to. I work hard for a good reputation, so I won't ruin it by taking money without ensuring it is a good match or selling a horse that proves to be anything other than what I advertised.
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There's very few people like you around unfortunately.
 
Try selling ponies. I have only ever sold the ones my children have outgrown bar one.
We do not have smart facillities, no school, they are all good in traffice go past buses been to PC, shown, hack out, nice normal ponies.
Everyone wants the best possible pony for the lowest price. There is no such thing as the perfect pony and for a budget of less than £1000 with a pony being well behaved 99% of the time and sound and good to handle you would think they would be happy. But obviusly because I have more than one and I am so honest I must be a dealer.
One chap I put off couldn't understand that the reason I didn't want them to have the pony was his child would be too big by the following summer.
The last pony I sold I sold it from my friends smart yard and it sold to the first viewer no problem. He is now a PC schoolmaster and last sold for £3000
I am lucky that I have the money to keep them so I have a paddock full of ponies in their late teens and twenties. Their loss, my pleasure.
 
As the admin of www.projecthorses.co.uk we encourage all our site users to be totally honest. That is the point of the site after all, somewhere people can advertise warts & all. But we do suggest that when people do advertise, they need to remember that they are trying to sell their horse, so do need to market it. We suggest they list positive points before negatives, so that they attract people, and never more negative than positive points. In the paragraph after, when they list the bad points, we suggest that they 'justify' each point - i.e. if a bad loader in a lorry, make sure to say that it's good in a trailer, or fine if you do 'x' or take a few minutes, or that you think it's sortable with a little work or the right facilities. We do say tho that the justification MUST be true!

I think sometimes people get a little too hung up on the bad stuff, and forget all the wonderful things about a quirky horse!
 
i am totally honest when selling as i always want the horse to go to the right home , i really would be horrified to here of any of mine being pasted about after i had sold them on
but i have never advertised any of mine , i just take them out and about and pass the word around that they are up for sale

i advertised a few for friends and was honest when selling but i didn't put the worst in the advert but told them over the phone and even videoed the worst one did for a buyer that was traveling a long way
they always sell no problem but they are realistically priced if they have problems
 
I prefer honest from the onset. As otherwise could just be wasted phone call. Although being told at phone call stage is preferable to not finding out til viewing and onboard which has happened on more than one occasion!
 
I would prefer honesty if I was buying. I would want to know every little thing about the horse!

If I was selling, I would bullet point it, perhaps and then add "Email/text/call for full description" and have a ready written email/text/script about the problems and ways I've found to over come them.
 
As a potential buyer in about a year I would definitely say yes.

I believe that's when things go wrong in a purchase when someone is dishonest. Be that buyer or seller. As a buyer I would be completely honest and would expect the exact same back from the seller.

Perhaps it would put some off buying but then, would it be better to 'pull the wool over' (not suggesting you have or would OP) and then the problems would be uncovered by the buyer who would then sell on and perhaps do the same?

I think some adverts that are much the same ie good to shoe bath clip etc become quite monotonous and less believable than one which says for example good to bath but does fidget or good in traffic but dislikes birds coming out of bushes or tesco bags! I prefer a characterful advert as that means thought and truth has more likely to be in the ad!
 
sherry90 said:
As a potential buyer in about a year I would definitely say yes.

I believe that's when things go wrong in a purchase when someone is dishonest. Be that buyer or seller. As a buyer I would be completely honest and would expect the exact same back from the seller.

Perhaps it would put some off buying but then, would it be better to 'pull the wool over' (not suggesting you have or would OP) and then the problems would be uncovered by the buyer who would then sell on and perhaps do the same?

I think some adverts that are much the same ie good to shoe bath clip etc become quite monotonous and less believable than one which says for example good to bath but does fidget or good in traffic but dislikes birds coming out of bushes or tesco bags! I prefer a characterful advert as that means thought and truth has more likely to be in the ad!
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i agree with you from a buyers pov as some things are easily over come
as more of a seller than a buyer if some thing i said put the buyer off the horse then it wasn't the right buyer for the horse and the horse would be likely to be sold :(
i'm a softy though and if i do sell iv'e normally had them a few years and get quite attached to them so i'm normally looking for the right home for them rather than simply lining my pockets
 
As harsh as it sounds I'd be pleased if when I put my new horse on the box to take home, his/her old owner cried! Both tears of happiness knowing they are going to a forever home but at the same time sad that they are leaving.
Then again I am a soppy b****er but that's the reason why I know it is going to take me a long time to find the right horse for me!
 
Yes they do, nothing worse than getting the perfect horse home and finding out it is a nut case or has some serious physical issues. Plus I'd want to know the horse's quirks on the advert to make the issues aware immediately for potential buyers. A liar can frankly put the horse and rider in dangerous positions if you lie or down-play about any quirks/problems. After seeing a woman lie about a horse she was selling on our yard I could never do it. She sold a mare that had damaged its pelvis because she had brought it back into work too quickly after having a foal. She didn't tell them this, sold her from the field, as a lovely novice ride suitable for pony club type things. In reality, her foal had been weaned at 3 months, she had a damaged pelvis, needed to be reschooled, had a stable and was just turned out for purpose of selling quickly and cheap and buted up :mad: needless to say, I saw the horse up for sale 3 times last year from various owners.
 
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_GG_ said:
if I get a call a few months down the line saying the horse has started refusing, getting pushy etc...they get a very polite, "well perhaps seek the advice of a trainer to make sure you haven't changed anything because as you know, s/he didn't have those issues when you bought him/her"!
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I've had to do this twice, because i sell my horses after two years of owning them so i can buy a new one and with the profit i pay for running the new horse(its the only way i can afford riding, i'm only 17 and at boarding school so no time for a job) anyways back on topic i have had to explain to someone 18 months after they bought one of my horses that they may need to change back to the feed and bit, because my mare was sold as forward but not strong so they chucked an american gag in and she did not appreciate it, and once they changed back to the wilkie she was happy as larry.
another horse three months ago half a year after they bought my old boy thye called up blaring thst i sold them a maniac so i offered to come ride him to see if i thought there was anything up because admittedly he did sound out of character and the vet said he was all fine, so i went down and i checked the saddle which i sold with him and it was fine they had all the same tack and all they had changed was the chaff in his feed so it wasn't that. they said the problem was his jumping and that he had started refusing and rearing after he refused this was very out of character, so i rode first and he refused but there were no nasty rears so he started jumping comfortably and so i watched the daughter who was my age and her mum was blaring on about how she never needed lessons because she was so great ect ect, instently alarm bells were going off in my head, and as she started jumping i noticed that every time he jumped she held on to the mouth of Beau and he was scared to jumped and when he started refusing again she would jab him in the mouth and give him a whopping great smack... i turned to the mother and had to be blunt and just say theres your problem with no lessons she is getting bad habits and scaring the boy.

sorry rant over i just needed to say that as it really upset me as those horses were advertised honestly especially little beau who was a 2nd pony and a great sj but i always said it was fast and had a sensitive mouth. i think in that case she just needed lessons and they were out sj again soon but i felt so silly for letting my blessed pony go with them.
 
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