Sheered heels and going barefoot

[holeymoley]

Is this the correct time of year to transition to barefoot? Maybe ‘correct’ isn’t the right term, more is it advisable/possible?

In my head the answer is probably not the best given the ground is a mix of hard and then soaking wet. Reason for asking is that I strongly suspect that my gelding has sheered heels. I have owned him for nearly 20 years. He has always had naturally great strong hooves. That was until he had laminitis with quite significant rotation. Rotation was corrected with heartbar shoes and frequent trimming by a very highly thought of remedial farrier. And I absolutely cannot be more grateful for what he done for my gelding. His final xrays showed everything back in alingment. This farrier only did remedial work for vet school referrals so I had to find my own. Previous one prior to laminitis was no good as had let the hooves get quite long and out of shape. He also said it was normal for there to be specks of blood in his hoof trimmings. In hindsight this was the evidence of my horse having quite a few very short but severe laminitic episodes.

Fast forward to now- I have a really nice farrier who has kept my guy sound(5years on) but. And it’s a big but. There’s something not sitting right with me about his hooves. I’ve done a lot of reading over the years about hooves and trimming to try and learn when things aren’t going right and to me I can see the following in his fronts- unbalanced heels, upright inside wall and flare on the outside wall and sheered heels. And I think the sheered heels is pretty serious and having a knock on affect on the rest of the hoof resulting in the rest of the above. Where do I go from here? I always ask farrier if everythings okay with his hooves and he says absolutely fine. I’ve been considering barefoot for over a year if I’m honest and I’ve just never had the courage to do it. He’s barefoot behind which he’s fine with and I have boots if needed, which is very very rare. He’s also now 22 and in very little work. He doesn’t have the best confirmation and is very narrow in front which I think is potentially not helping matters with the sheered heels. I think in terms of bone structure he is possibly slightly wonky- he did rotate medio laterally too which I think hasn’t helped. Farrier is probably trying to correct this imbalance but is actually doing the opposite resulting in the sheered heels. I have photos to PM if anyone can help. Thank you

 

[Highmileagecob]

Have a look at Pete Ramey's Hoof Rehab pages and see if anything there seems helpful. It wouldn't hurt to ask a trimmer/podiatrist to take a look and offer an opinion. Not wanting to knock farriers in general, but if the horse is sound after shoeing and you keep calling them back, they will not point out that anything is going wrong. As you are probably aware, you need the frog to be strong and healthy, and doing it's job. The back of the foot should flex when weighted, allowing the frog to 'kiss' the ground and absorb shock. Well developed heel bulbs aid this process and cushion the internal structures within the foot. If this cannot happen, the frog starts to shrink or move as the horse weights different areas of the foot. If he is more or less retired, there is no harm in removing the shoes and allowing him to get comfortable pottering around. Good luck - keep us updated won't you?

 

[sbloom]

Being narrow in front is postural as much as conformation and could almost certainly be improved, it will be affecting the feet, though that is usually through medio-lateral balance rather than directly causing contracted or sheared heels. If we don't improve the body sometimes the feet just don't improve, but certainly poor feet can hold the body back. It's often hard to pick what was the original issue, we just have to try and improve both.

There are some pages on FB worth following - Holistic Equine in Cumbria (who also does in person and remote consults across much of the country), The Equine Documentalist and Progressive Equine Services (the latter in Australia).

When to go barefoot is always a tricky one and I'm no expert but if he's not in work, and any groundwork you might do could be done in an arena or plain concrete, then it matters less when.

 

[ycbm]

Is this the correct time of year to transition to barefoot? Maybe ‘correct’ isn’t the right term, more is it advisable/possible?

In my head the answer is probably not the best given the ground is a mix of hard and then soaking wet. Reason for asking is that I strongly suspect that my gelding has sheered heels. I have owned him for nearly 20 years. He has always had naturally great strong hooves. That was until he had laminitis with quite significant rotation. Rotation was corrected with heartbar shoes and frequent trimming by a very highly thought of remedial farrier. And I absolutely cannot be more grateful for what he done for my gelding. His final xrays showed everything back in alingment. This farrier only did remedial work for vet school referrals so I had to find my own. Previous one prior to laminitis was no good as had let the hooves get quite long and out of shape. He also said it was normal for there to be specks of blood in his hoof trimmings. In hindsight this was the evidence of my horse having quite a few very short but severe laminitic episodes.

Fast forward to now- I have a really nice farrier who has kept my guy sound(5years on) but. And it’s a big but. There’s something not sitting right with me about his hooves. I’ve done a lot of reading over the years about hooves and trimming to try and learn when things aren’t going right and to me I can see the following in his fronts- unbalanced heels, upright inside wall and flare on the outside wall and sheered heels. And I think the sheered heels is pretty serious and having a knock on affect on the rest of the hoof resulting in the rest of the above. Where do I go from here? I always ask farrier if everythings okay with his hooves and he says absolutely fine. I’ve been considering barefoot for over a year if I’m honest and I’ve just never had the courage to do it. He’s barefoot behind which he’s fine with and I have boots if needed, which is very very rare. He’s also now 22 and in very little work. He doesn’t have the best confirmation and is very narrow in front which I think is potentially not helping matters with the sheered heels. I think in terms of bone structure he is possibly slightly wonky- he did rotate medio laterally too which I think hasn’t helped. Farrier is probably trying to correct this imbalance but is actually doing the opposite resulting in the sheered heels. I have photos to PM if anyone can help. Thank you

I'd love to help but I'd rather see them in person. I saw a horse last week with sheared unbalanced feet, where I thought the photos were a disaster in the making, but actually when you see them on the horse were completely understandable and gave me great hope the horse will come sound. If it would help, are you anywhere near Manchester?

In answer to your question no time is a bad time to take the shoes off a horse which is being harmed by them and there is a wonderful choice of boots these days.
.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

For a horse that is in minimal work I would say just go for it and see how he goes, I took both of my horses barefoot one was just fine the other needed boots for 9 months to be comfortable.

 

[Noble]

The pictures below are of my mare, thank you so much YCBM, the bottom is when her shoes came off 7 weeks ago. The top is last week after her last trim, I had been struggling with her in shoes for 4 years before this. The best thing I could have done, it is a massive improvement in a short space of time and I now have hope.

 

[Reacher]

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[ycbm]

The pictures below are of my mare, thank you so much YCBM, the bottom is when her shoes came off 7 weeks ago. The top is last week after her last trim, I had been struggling with her in shoes for 4 years before this. The best thing I could have done, it is a massive improvement in a short space of time and I now have hope.

I wasn't going to out you but now you've outed yourself I really can assure everyone that when you see the feet on the horse they aren't nearly as problematic as they look there, and now she's being allowed to grow feet that match her legs there's every chance she's going to come right.

And she's a super mare, worth the effort.
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[Noble]

I don't post much but I felt it worth outing myself , I was talked out of taking the shoes off for about 12 months. Hopefully the pictures help someone else, she would never have come consistently sound if the shoes had stayed on. She stands chance now. Thanks again to YCBM for her help. X

 

[ycbm]

She's already soundl in a straight line at 7 weeks and not that much off on a curve. I'm excited for all the of us to see what happens as the balance comes right. Your farrier is a gem.
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[holeymoley]

Thank you for the replies. I'm afraid I'm quite a bit more north than Manchester, probably some 300+miles unfortunately.

I've had a read over some articles online and my hoof book. I'm more than certain this is what he has, it seems to go hand in hand with the rest of the issues. His poor frog isn't even touching the ground.

Noble, that's an amazing change in such a short time. I really think shoes off is where I need to start. Mine isn't quite as off-set as your girl, but I'm not sure if mine is the beginnings. Or maybe it's something completely different. I'll try and upload a photo.

 

[ycbm]

HM one of the biggest factors will be whether you can find a trimmer, be that a farrier or only a trimmer, or yourself, who is prepared to let your horse grow asymmetric feet to match what are very likely to be less than perfect front legs. These imbalances and shears are so often caused by farriers who gave been taught to make the foot symmetric when they shoe. If that doesn't match how the horse actually moves, it creates all sorts of stresses.

If you take some photos, please get the camera right down on the floor for side and front shots, and if we can also have some side and front of the whole of the front legs that could give some clues as to what's going on.
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[holeymoley]

HM one of the biggest factors will be whether you can find a trimmer, be that a farrier or only a trimmer, or yourself, who is prepared to let your horse grow asymmetric feet to match what are very likely to be less than perfect front legs. These imbalances and shears are so often caused by farriers who gave been taught to make the foot symmetric when they shoe. If that doesn't match how the horse actually moves, it creates all sorts of stresses.

If you take some photos, please get the camera right down on the floor for side and front shots, and if we can also have some side and front of the whole of the front legs that could give some clues as to what's going on.
.

Funnily enough my book said that when there’s confirmation issues, a lot can be made worse when we try to overly correct these things. We should really try to just accept the horse as it is. That is of course providing it’s managing and not lame.

I have two photos I took the other night, not the best but gives an idea. Pretty poor lighting and at the time it was so that I could see what was going on as I was sure it just didn't look right. I've tried to zoom in best I could. Please also excuse hair, he has slight feather and was given a bit of a rough trim a few weeks ago to be able to treat some mud fever.

He does get his frogs sprayed with sole cleanse and I also have field paste. My plan would be to get a good clean and slather that on too once the shoes are off. I don't have a photo of right fore but it's frog is much straighter than the left. Strangely enough when he did rotate the right fore was the worst. He is also on week 5 of 6 of shoeing cycle.

Any advice welcome x

 

[ycbm]

Have you any recent x rays of those? They look pretty unbalanced and I think you are right to want those shoes off. But the hair line is oddly in balance, given that the frog and heels look like a drunken sailor. I think I'd want to know where the bones are if somebody else is going to trim him.
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[holeymoley]

Not had xrays recently, last were 2022 and they were lateral ones only to check that the pedal bone was in the same place in that sense. I would agree that it's probably sensible to get a dorsal view.

I've found the last xray of that hoof

 

[holeymoley]

Managed another photo last night, again with flash on so colouring a bit off. Maybe doesn't look that bad as before? Also maybe trying to kid myself. What I have noticed is you can see directly through to the front of the shoe. So I think definitely is shoes off.

Out of interest, once shoes come off- I expect he'll be okay for a while, but, should he be wearing boots to go to field? There is a short walk of around 250yards or so to the field on straight tarmac. Or he can be put out via another field. But normally anytime I'm bringing in or out he'll be walking on the tarmac. Or is it a case of wait and see?

 

[Highmileagecob]

Try the walk and see how things go. Quite often tarmac and grass are comfortable for a newly barefoot. You can expect some discomfort as the frog starts to work, and maybe an abscess or two as internal structures start to change shape and put stress on parts that haven't been stressed for a long time. Be prepared for six to twelve months of slow patient rehab to bring everything back in balance, and please, please do not allow anyone to trim the foot into balance before the horse is ready.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

Managed another photo last night, again with flash on so colouring a bit off. Maybe doesn't look that bad as before? Also maybe trying to kid myself. What I have noticed is you can see directly through to the front of the shoe. So I think definitely is shoes off.

Out of interest, once shoes come off- I expect he'll be okay for a while, but, should he be wearing boots to go to field? There is a short walk of around 250yards or so to the field on straight tarmac. Or he can be put out via another field. But normally anytime I'm bringing in or out he'll be walking on the tarmac. Or is it a case of wait and see?

I would see how it goes I find most horses are fine on flat smooth ground it's stony rough they struggle with, and smooth tarmac is great for conditioning the feet so you might find that little walk everyday will really help make good hooves so I would use it to your advantage as long as he copes.

 

[holeymoley]

That's them off today. Will be really interesting to see how they change from here on. He's marched out to the field, perhaps better than without shoes but then maybe all in my head. I'm fully expecting him to be tender at some point though. Any recommendations for hardeners? He has good strong hooves despite his previous problems, and he has good sole. Heard good things about Red Horse Stronghorn I think it is?

 

[Noble]

When I had the shoes taken off my girl I had the vet there at the same time to do x-rays before during and after to help the farrier, she needed 1/4 inch off the outside front right to balance them. She walked out fine for the first 3 weeks, doing 20 mins a day on hard flat ground, and then the wheels fell off. She was very tender for a week but we were then able to carry on with our walking, we are up to 45 minutes a day in hand. Good luck.

 

[Highmileagecob]

Give some time for the feet to balance themselves, and allow the horse to grow it's own foot. Don't be in a hurry to start shaping and balancing. It's taken a long time for the issues to show up and it will take time to sort out. As the internal structures of the hoof start to remodel, new stresses and pressures will develop that have to bed in and build strength. You may well see abscesses or intermittent lameness.

 

[ycbm]

When I had the shoes taken off my girl I had the vet there at the same time to do x-rays before during and after to help the farrier, she needed 1/4 inch off the outside front right to balance them. She walked out fine for the first 3 weeks, doing 20 mins a day on hard flat ground, and then the wheels fell off. She was very tender for a week but we were then able to carry on with our walking, we are up to 45 minutes a day in hand. Good luck.

Are you fit yet ?

There's nothing like a rehab to improve the health of the owner!
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[ycbm]

That's them off today. Will be really interesting to see how they change from here on. He's marched out to the field, perhaps better than without shoes but then maybe all in my head. I'm fully expecting him to be tender at some point though. Any recommendations for hardeners? He has good strong hooves despite his previous problems, and he has good sole. Heard good things about Red Horse Stronghorn I think it is?

You actually want things to wear differently so I would caution against using anything which hardens the hoof unless he starts to feel his feet too much.
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[holeymoley]

Just to update- we’re now two weeks in to being barefoot. Having some tender days. I’ve decided to use his boots going to the field on certain days, weather dependent, Ie just now as we have temperatures of -5/6c so ground will be hard. But other than that he’s doing amazingly. The difference in the hoof already is quite remarkable. The higher wall on the inside has almost levelled itself out, making the heel bulb look less skee-wiff. The frogs are now touching the ground so really interested to see how they change shape over the next few months. He has had a bit of chipping to the inside wall but I expect that.

 

[alibali]

Keep photographic records. It really helps to monitor changes. Plus we all love some good foot rehab photos

 

[ycbm]

Sounds like great progress.
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[holeymoley]

Wee hoof photo to show difference already. Not the best though, I was trying to get a photo of the rub he's managed to give himself presumably with his boots, but it gives an idea of the difference. Here's a shoe one too.

 

[Highmileagecob]

Looking good! If the hoof boots are big enough, a baby's size 1 nappy makes a decent sock, to help cushion against rubs.

 

[holeymoley]

Looking good! If the hoof boots are big enough, a baby's size 1 nappy makes a decent sock, to help cushion against rubs.

Oh! Hadn’t thought of that. A friend gave me some Cavallo wraps but they’re tiny, so been using husband’s old cut up football socks in meantime

 

[Highmileagecob]

Avoid getting them wet or you will struggle to get the boot off!