Shetland dilemma

[harribea]

Maybe I've just had a bad winter but I'm feeling really down about my Shetlands and don't know where to go with them. Would appreciate any thoughts or advice (even if it's just to give myself a good kick). (Sorry about this LONG post)

I basically rescued two mini-Shetlands from someone's back garden when they were a year old. I'd always wanted ponies and dreamed of one day getting my own horse. I've now had them for 5 years, I keep them at home in a 1-acre field with a very large shelter (out daytime, in at night), and I also have a 15hh Connemara I keep in livery nearby as a mother-daughter share.

I'm proud to say that the ponies have gone from being pretty much feral (biting, kicking, barging, etc) to fairly calm (with us - see below). The chestnut is a big character, he's boisterous, friendly and into everything; he's been the hardest to teach but a lot of fun along the way. The piebald was very fearful and can still be jumpy and nervous but he's a sweet, happy little thing who never puts a hoof out of line (and would make a lovely child's riding pony). They are inseparable and it's always been a joy watching them jump all over each other and race around together.

The chestnut has always been prone to put on weight, so the last 5 years have been a never-ending journey of attempts at various approaches to managing this. They are both now reasonably slim (for Shetlands) and all was going ok until... last autumn he ate some leaves form a hybrid sycamore that has a few branches hanging over the field. It's never been a problem before but for some reason he came down with colic and it nearly killed him. The vet sorted him out, he got better and seemed cheerful enough but was never really himself again ie no leaping around in the field no matter how much his mate tried to tease him.

About November time, I noticed that his hooves were growing long and he seemed lethargic. The farrier said he had slight laminitis, so I took his advice, halved the time between trims and kept them both in so that I could completely control his diet. They ended up staying in until about 3 weeks ago which was utterly miserable for the pair of them and for us, since the field was so wet and even the thick rubber matting in the shelter couldn't stop the mud coming through. Anyway, everything improved health wise and at their last farrier visit we decided to start letting them out again during the day, which was a relief. They were ecstatic and he was back to his old self; racing around and having fun.

Last night, my daughter brought them in and said the chestnut was limping again... This morning he's moving around ok but I'm despairing a little. To anyone else he would probably appear normal but to us it's like he's lost his bounce. His mate - with exactly the same diet and living conditions - is perfectly chipper, and can't seem to understand why he won't play with him. The farrier is back next week but I think I'm going to have to call out the vet again.

So what's the problem?

Well, I love them both and I just want him to be well. But there's a few things spinning around in my head:
- They're not insured, for a start, and I'm worried that there's going to be a lot of investigative stuff going on here.
- I work from home but I'm really busy and am worried that they should be doing a lot of exercise but I don't have time.
- I'm spending a lot of time with our horse (hacking/dressage for me, SJ/XC for my daughter) and after getting his fitness to an excellent standard he's just had a field injury and is now on shockwave therapy so I'm back and forth to the vet, walking him twice a day (thankfully he is insured) and worrying about him all the time. And when he is better we'll be out and about with Pony Club, comps etc.
- We've divided up the field so many times but he has no respect for the electric wire and when we turned it up he just started jumping over it (seriously, like a Puissance).
- We've never had them backed as we don't have a rider for them (I'd thought of asking the neighbouring farmer whose sister trains and kids are small, but my daughter gets really emotional at the thought of them being with other kids and tbh, while our little chestnut is perfectly well behaved with us, he's quite shockingly violent with the farrier and the vet, so I wouldn't risk it).

I know this is all very confusing and a bit of a mess. I'm just a bit lost and would appreciate advice from anyone who can help, or just tell me to sort myself out!

 

[Meowy Catkin]

I'd get a cushings test done. I've got a neighbour who has shetlands and one of hers has thankfully improved having been really struggling with cushings related laminitis recently. This was a young mare, so it really isn't just an old pony thing.

ETA - she found that leaving four weeks between trims was too long for this particular pony. She really needs her hooves kept perfect as well as her pracend medicine to keep her sound.

 

[meleeka]

Keeping them in is counterproductive really because the grass will just be growing in their absence. I’d get a Cushings test done too. It doesn’t cost much. If it’s negative I’d put a track up, double fenced if necessary and leave them out all year with the shelter. You are fortunate that you don’t have anything with differing needs to worry about, so it should be doable.

 

[harribea]

I'd get a cushings test done. I've got a neighbour who has shetlands and one of hers has thankfully improved having been really struggling with cushings related laminitis recently. This was a young mare, so it really isn't just an old pony thing.

ETA - she found that leaving four weeks between trims was too long for this particular pony. She really needs her hooves kept perfect as well as her pracend medicine to keep her sound.

Thank you - I would never have thought of that but I just looked up some of the symptoms and he has almost all of them! His winter coat takes sooooo long to shed; last summer we were still scraping away in June! He usually has a pot-belly shape and he drinks A LOT.

 

[harribea]

Keeping them in is counterproductive really because the grass will just be growing in their absence. I’d get a Cushings test done too. It doesn’t cost much. If it’s negative I’d put a track up, double fenced if necessary and leave them out all year with the shelter. You are fortunate that you don’t have anything with differing needs to worry about, so it should be doable.

Thanks - I will get the test done (and it's a relief to know it's not expensive) as I think he has a number of the symptoms. I didn't know about it and would have just thought he was so young... And I must admit I HATE having them in cos they're just so happy in their field, watching cows and sheep go past and chasing the cat!

 

[Silver Clouds]

Thank you - I would never have thought of that but I just looked up some of the symptoms and he has almost all of them! His winter coat takes sooooo long to shed; last summer we were still scraping away in June! He usually has a pot-belly shape and he drinks A LOT.

Sounds like cushings is very likely. Hopefully if the test comes back positive he can be managed with medication and will be a bit easier to keep comfortable. As a previous poster has said a track system would be a good idea as it will encourage him to walk further, so provide him with a bit more exercise without taking your time (apart from setting up the track initially of course).

You sound quite stressed and worried about him (it is such a worry when they aren't themselves), I really hope things improve for you and the pony soon.

 

[harribea]

Sounds like cushings is very likely. Hopefully if the test comes back positive he can be managed with medication and will be a bit easier to keep comfortable. As a previous poster has said a track system would be a good idea as it will encourage him to walk further, so provide him with a bit more exercise without taking your time (apart from setting up the track initially of course).

You sound quite stressed and worried about him (it is such a worry when they aren't themselves), I really hope things improve for you and the pony soon.

Thank you - I am really worried and I think it's just getting on top of me a bit. It would break my daughter's heart if anything happened to him and I would just feel like such a failure.
I really appreciate the advice from all of you, especially as it was such a long post. I've just booked for the vet to come on Tuesday to do a test, and my husband has gone out to start moving fence posts around. A track sounds like a good idea as he'll have less space to attempt a jump!

 

[alibali]

Glad to see you've already taken the good advice re Cushing's test. Just a warning regarding possible false negatives. My section A got repeated bouts of low grade but chronic lammi from age 3 onwards no matter how carefully I managed him. A Cushing's test was negative, I eventually persuaded the vet to allow me to do a Prascend trial and he has remained sound on 1/4 tablet a day for the last 4 years. I'm lucky to have a vets that are prepared to think outside the box a little when conventional treatment/ management doesn't work. Without the Prascend I've no doubt I'd have had to put the wee man to sleep long ago. He does now need his feet trimmed little and often (ie weekly to fortnightly) to avoid his toes shooting forward and his heels collapsing.

 

[CPayne]

You should be able to get the actual test for free through your vet so that you just pay for the visit and charge for blood draw. You can then register on the website https://www.careaboutcushings.co.uk ,if they have cushings, where you can add your pony and keep track of their prascend dose, ACTH levels, symptoms etc and you get one test free per year I believe. I use it for my cushings Shetland.

 

[suestowford]

My Shetland has Cushings, he was diagnosed aged 12, but his hormone levels were so high then that the vet suspected he'd had it for a while before showing any signs. He has done very well on Prascend and is so much healthier & happier for it. I must admit my heart sank when he was diagnosed, I thought it was a death sentence but now I've got my head round it all it's not so bad.

 

[harribea]

Glad to see you've already taken the good advice re Cushing's test. Just a warning regarding possible false negatives. My section A got repeated bouts of low grade but chronic lammi from age 3 onwards no matter how carefully I managed him. A Cushing's test was negative, I eventually persuaded the vet to allow me to do a Prascend trial and he has remained sound on 1/4 tablet a day for the last 4 years. I'm lucky to have a vets that are prepared to think outside the box a little when conventional treatment/ management doesn't work. Without the Prascend I've no doubt I'd have had to put the wee man to sleep long ago. He does now need his feet trimmed little and often (ie weekly to fortnightly) to avoid his toes shooting forward and his heels collapsing.

I've just read more about it and I do think this is what is wrong with him. My biggest worry now is that - like your boy - he's possibly had it for a long time. I juts keep thinking about how much we joked about his coat last year, and how we thought he was calmer because he'd matured in age, and how we put his aggression with other people down to lack of general exposure, etc etc. I feel like it's been there and I just didn't see it.

 

[harribea]

You should be able to get the actual test for free through your vet so that you just pay for the visit and charge for blood draw. You can then register on the website https://www.careaboutcushings.co.uk ,if they have cushings, where you can add your pony and keep track of their prascend dose, ACTH levels, symptoms etc and you get one test free per year I believe. I use it for my cushings Shetland.

This is really helpful - thanks. I've just had a look and I'll talk to the vet about the free test. Great resource.

 

[harribea]

My Shetland has Cushings, he was diagnosed aged 12, but his hormone levels were so high then that the vet suspected he'd had it for a while before showing any signs. He has done very well on Prascend and is so much healthier & happier for it. I must admit my heart sank when he was diagnosed, I thought it was a death sentence but now I've got my head round it all it's not so bad.

Oh wow, it's lovely to read this. My head is already spinning to 'how am I going to tell my daughter?' and 'what are we going to do if our other little one is left on his own?'. Husband has just told me to stop catastrophising! Glad to hear your boy is happy and healthy.

 

[alibali]

Oh wow, it's lovely to read this. My head is already spinning to 'how am I going to tell my daughter?' and 'what are we going to do if our other little one is left on his own?'. Husband has just told me to stop catastrophising! Glad to hear your boy is happy and healthy.

Yes in the nicest possible way stop catastrophising! Since I started him on 1/4 tablet Prascend (cost per day around 25 pence) he has been completely sound (touch wood!) I still manage his weight carefully but in summer he still gets out on grass all be it restricted to prevent excessive weight gain. Since then he has also been broken to carriage and also regularly comes out ride and lead at all paces for up to 16km. He leads a full happy and useful life. There's no reason why your boy shouldn't too with careful management if he does indeed have Cushing's

 

[harribea]

Yes in the nicest possible way stop catastrophising! Since I started him on 1/4 tablet Prascend (cost per day around 25 pence) he has been completely sound (touch wood!) I still manage his weight carefully but in summer he still gets out on grass all be it restricted to prevent excessive weight gain. Since then he has also been broken to carriage and also regularly comes out ride and lead at all paces for up to 16km. He leads a full happy and useful life. There's no reason why your boy shouldn't too with careful management if he does indeed have Cushing's

I hear you. Thanks. Think I'll stop googling now and go make a cup of tea...

 

[lottiepony]

I've just read more about it and I do think this is what is wrong with him. My biggest worry now is that - like your boy - he's possibly had it for a long time. I juts keep thinking about how much we joked about his coat last year, and how we thought he was calmer because he'd matured in age, and how we put his aggression with other people down to lack of general exposure, etc etc. I feel like it's been there and I just didn't see it.

Don't beat yourself up about not realising. If you knew every symptom of every equine problem you'd be a vet! The main thing is you're now taking action which is great and all you can do. Echo the comments about having a track they are the best thing for controlling weight. Sounds like the pair of them landed on their feet when you took them on.

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

We have a mare who was diagnosed with EMS at 5yo. She is 21yo now and still happy as Larry. She has had 3 minor lami interruptions in her life after the first major one but other than keeping on top of her feet and weight she has never been a bother to keep.

I would get the test done then you can go from there. It is easily manageable when you get the hang of it.

 

[angel7]

Just a note of caution because catastophising is not necessarily a bad thing... whether it is cushings or not you are still looking at a lifetime 30years+ of endless monitoring, managing, dieting, worry is it too hot, cold, frosty, sunny etc and this in itself can be very draining emotionally in the longterm. Are the feet needing walked out on tarmac to improve them? Costs will also be higher if meds required, muzzling, replacement forage, increased foot trimming. You should not feel guilty to consider PTS for the chestnut if you cannot face the increased work of managing him. They cannot tell us when they are sore or hungry and a lifetime of restrictions is not much fun for a cheeky pony. I say this as someone who has managed these types for many years. Just because you can doesn't mean you must. Don't keep the pony going to avoid upsetting the family.
You have another pony at livery, could they be moved home to keep other pony company if you decide to PTS? Would it be easier to rehab the 15h at home?
If you prefer the 15h at livery I'm sure the other shetty could be rehomed as a companion. Just playing devils advocate, I see too many miserable horses that would be better PTS.

 

[SEL]

I see too many miserable horses that would be better PTS.

yes - but if it is cushings then those little pink tablets can be miraculous at turning a miserable horses into something that is bouncing around like a 4yo. I've seen a Sec A manage grazing again after laminitis brought on by cushings.

Tracks are easy to put up (good electric and stallion posts are helpful) and I've found even my most determined grass hunter enjoys being on a track where they can nibble and browse. They are much better at self exercising too.

 

[harribea]

Don't beat yourself up about not realising. If you knew every symptom of every equine problem you'd be a vet! The main thing is you're now taking action which is great and all you can do. Echo the comments about having a track they are the best thing for controlling weight. Sounds like the pair of them landed on their feet when you took them on.

That is really kind of you - thanks. I know they're very happy with us and, having seen where they were before (in a small backyard that had turned into a mudpit with young children who'd lost interest and a couple who hated them), I feel good knowing we've been able to give them a safe and calm place to hang out and be themselves, and a routine they can rely on. I guess I'm always conscious of the fact that I didn't grow up with horses so I feel for them having to put up with a mum who's only learning by failure!

 

[harribea]

Just a note of caution because catastophising is not necessarily a bad thing... whether it is cushings or not you are still looking at a lifetime 30years+ of endless monitoring, managing, dieting, worry is it too hot, cold, frosty, sunny etc and this in itself can be very draining emotionally in the longterm. Are the feet needing walked out on tarmac to improve them? Costs will also be higher if meds required, muzzling, replacement forage, increased foot trimming. You should not feel guilty to consider PTS for the chestnut if you cannot face the increased work of managing him. They cannot tell us when they are sore or hungry and a lifetime of restrictions is not much fun for a cheeky pony. I say this as someone who has managed these types for many years. Just because you can doesn't mean you must. Don't keep the pony going to avoid upsetting the family.
You have another pony at livery, could they be moved home to keep other pony company if you decide to PTS? Would it be easier to rehab the 15h at home?
If you prefer the 15h at livery I'm sure the other shetty could be rehomed as a companion. Just playing devils advocate, I see too many miserable horses that would be better PTS.

I really appreciate you saying all of this. I want to stay focused on the positives and will keep faith based on what the other posters have said, but you have hit the nail on the head with my biggest concern, which is the guilt I would feel if I had to make that decision. I've just never even thought about it. I've always been very practical about other pets, regardless of how much I love them, but I've assumed the ponies would be with us for decades. I hope it doesn't come to this but knowing there are people who would understand helps a lot, as I wouldn't want to enforce wretchedness on him or us just out of pride.

I'd rather leave my 15hh in livery for lots of reasons; he's VERY happy hanging out with the lads, he's in a great routine with lovely people who give him expert care, he has lots of space and there are plenty of fields to switch around, the YO is my riding instructor and our daughters are school mates, and the yard is near the school so I meet my daughter there every day. I also learn so much via the social aspect of being at a yard and everyone is hugely encouraging. Never say never but not for now. So I guess I would need to find a companion. That said, a donkey has sadly passed at the yard leaving his little sheep-mate all alone, so that could be a temporary fix if needed.

 

[alibali]

Just a note of caution because catastophising is not necessarily a bad thing... whether it is cushings or not you are still looking at a lifetime 30years+ of endless monitoring, managing, dieting, worry is it too hot, cold, frosty, sunny etc and this in itself can be very draining emotionally in the longterm. Are the feet needing walked out on tarmac to improve them? Costs will also be higher if meds required, muzzling, replacement forage, increased foot trimming. You should not feel guilty to consider PTS for the chestnut if you cannot face the increased work of managing him. They cannot tell us when they are sore or hungry and a lifetime of restrictions is not much fun for a cheeky pony. I say this as someone who has managed these types for many years. Just because you can doesn't mean you must. Don't keep the pony going to avoid upsetting the family.
You have another pony at livery, could they be moved home to keep other pony company if you decide to PTS? Would it be easier to rehab the 15h at home?
If you prefer the 15h at livery I'm sure the other shetty could be rehomed as a companion. Just playing devils advocate, I see too many miserable horses that would be better PTS.

This too, my section A is stable, comfortable and out 24/7/365 on grass with free access to a barn and in company, all his needs are met and he lives a happy and useful life. I've achieved this with not too much expense, hassle or stress on my behalf. However if either I hadn't been able to stabilise him in a lifestyle that he was happy in OR that lifestyle was unreasonably demanding on me physically, emotionally or financially then I would not have hesitated to put him to sleep. Horses do not understand the future so death holds no fear for them, there are many fates worse than a kind, gentle dignified end for them. Equally I don't think you have any reason to despair or catastrophise just yet. Fingers crossed you can find good and workable solutions for your boy

 

[harribea]

This too, my section A is stable, comfortable and out 24/7/365 on grass with free access to a barn and in company, all his needs are met and he lives a happy and useful life. I've achieved this with not too much expense, hassle or stress on my behalf. However if either I hadn't been able to stabilise him in a lifestyle that he was happy in OR that lifestyle was unreasonably demanding on me physically, emotionally or financially then I would not have hesitated to put him to sleep. Horses do not understand the future so death holds no fear for them, there are many fates worse than a kind, gentle dignified end for them. Equally I don't think you have any reason to despair or catastrophise just yet. Fingers crossed you can find good and workable solutions for your boy

Thank you - it makes me sad but it means a lot to hear it.

 

[meleeka]

I’m another who has a Cushings pony that lives out (on a track in summer) without any special treatment apart from her tablet each day. In fact, I worry less about her getting laminitis than I do about my natives. They are more likely to get laminitis if they’ve had it before, but no more so than a non Cushings horse If levels are controlled. Medication took years off my pony and literally gave her a new lease of life.

Ps. Your husband is right ?

 

[HollyWoozle]

Don't lose heart just yet. We have a mini shetland who was diagnosed with EMS after a bad bout of laminitis but with regular trims and a strict diet he is managing really well. He lives out 24/7 with a shelter but his paddock is small and with poor grazing - his main forage source is soaked hay in small holed nets and then he a balancer (good to make sure he has everything he needs for maximum good health and good hooves). All our grazing is pretty rubbish and I think it's a blessing, so I would be inclined to let your shetties trash the grass in yours as much as possible by leaving them out when it's wet, provided they have somewhere dry to stand too, if you can't put in a track system.

We don't have a jockey for him and no easy access to bridleways (and no school) so the only exercise he gets is moving around in the field, but the regular trims and getting the diet right makes all the difference. His management isn't overly costly or stressful and I believe he leads a good life. He is currently separate to our others, but just a fence between them, but will soon be gaining a friend with similar needs to improve his quality of life. Something you already have covered of course!

Good luck with it and I am sure you will work it out. If it comes down to it and the most sensible choice seems to be putting him to sleep in the end then there is also no shame in that as others have said. Sometimes it is simply in everyone's best interests.

Edited to say: I agree 100% with the Cushing's test and meant to say that at the start! I just meant that Cushing's/EMS can be managed easily in some cases.

 

[Equi]

Am I the only one noticing that there are no photos of these little munchkins????

 

[Nicnac]

Hope it's a simple solution and he can get back to himself. If they need exercise, can't your daughter spend some time 'playing' with them? With the light evenings from Sunday it should be easier. I also have an aged Shetland who needs careful management but we make sure she gets quite a bit of exercise to keep her joints mobile and use up some calories.

 

[harribea]

Am I the only one noticing that there are no photos of these little munchkins????

 

[harribea]

Aw, I’m glad you asked. I’m trying - but they don’t seem to want to load up!

 

[Equi]

Awww look at his sweet eyes ?