Should a judge smack a youngsters to get them to go forward?

IF it was my horse and it refused to canter id of been happy for the judge to give it a slap if it was refusing to canter.
I will say that id be thinking the horse need to learn so on the judges head be it.

HOWEVER. asmuch as I appreciate you being defensive you do need to realise that may be your horse was to tired and you shouldnt of put it forward.

I guess lesson learnt, maybe take a different rider to your next show and get them to do a class on your horse so shes gets used other rider in the show atmosphere?
 
perfect11s said:
Ok then yes they should... but only once they have applied the other aids and not got the desired response ...is that the right answer???
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that's up to you if you think its right,but if it was your horse,think about it? would you accept it been smacked?
all ive done on here is asked a question & i'm not upset(mean horse been smacked) by it but simply just asking a question
 
I would have been put out, yes. If the horse cantered, then came back to trot surely the correct thing would have been to get the horse balanced and ask again, not smack it? If the judge could still not get the canter then maybe return to the rider and mark accordingly.

I agree that judges do not get paid as such and do it for expenses, etc. but any decent judge would know the difference between a naughty horse and a horse that was young and inexperienced.
Young horses have to learn and whilst I don't agree that they should come out until they are perfect at home nothing can prepare them for their first show/outing.
Sorry to hear about this I would have been cross too if it had been my horse :-(
 
xloopylozzax said:
Im on the other side of the coin- i wouldnt present an unfit green youngster for a ride judge.
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A youngster can tire so easily through and switch off in the line-up (especially if its a big class). I think its totally unacceptable for her to have smacked your horse. The odd tiny little flick ok, but not several times and proper smacks!
 
MagicMelon said:
A youngster can tire so easily through and switch off in the line-up (especially if its a big class).
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If that was the case, the owner/rider should have brought the horse out and saved it for another day. Nothing spoils a youngster more than being asked things when it is tired, it's up to the rider to assess the situation and act accordingly. Putting the horse away for another day is not the end of the world and the mark of a person who understands horses.
 
I have to say I can see this from both sides.
1) The OP has had other people on this youngster and the youngster did have a familiar rider. However the horse was tired, the OP pushed it too far by taking her into another class and as a result the horse backed off the judge. Lesson learnt.

2) The judge has to ride many horses in one day and I suppose that riding many lazy horses in one day is annoying as they should be presented with a horse that is fit for the job, not tired, green etc.

However I would have had a problem if the judge has smacked my horse. (If he had managed to get on her with a whip in the first place would be amazing as she is whip shy!!!)
 
With Stinky, he was not ridden by a judge until he had done a season of being ridden by me and knew what was expected and was going sweetly for me. I did a lot of work with him in preparation for being ridden. He had many different riders on him of all abilities and sizes, so he was not phased by someone who did not ride perfectly and tolerates all types, nor does he get upset if the judge is tall and puts legs in different places to me.

He has been ridden by some fantastic judges, and others who just sat with baggy reins and no leg (my pet hate, why can't they put their leg on and take up a contact? He then goes into riding school with a novice mode - slowly and carefully taking care of them rather than really going forward, but I would not have him any other way), I had one judge who gave him such a boot that he did trot to almost gallop - he still won as the judge said totally their fault, they didn't realise gypsy cobs were so forward going and he came back instantly when asked.

If a judge were to give him several hard smacks or really sock him in the mouth, I would not be pleased and not show under them again. However, if it were a small flick to say get a move on, ie to back up the leg aid, then I would have no problem with this and would be thankful that he had someone on him who made him do as asked.

If my horse dumped someone for giving them a small flick, I would be mortified and do work to ensure that they did not react this way before having anyone else ride them.

Show horses have to have perfect manners and be able to be ridden by just about anyone, and this is something of an art form and requires a lot of time and preparation.

Personally, and this is my own personal view, I would not have had the horse in a class to be ridden by a judge on its second time out, but done a few more shows first, including one with a different rider to myself that knew them before asking the judge to ride.

I see - and this is not directed at the OP, many horses that the judges need a medal to get on and I would have a rule that if a horse unseats a judge on two seperate occasions, it is banned from being ridden in the ring for a year, third time and it is banned for life.
 
Had a read through and had to comment.
I was at said show (without horse) and the hoI took my horse at 5y/o out showing- they have to learn somewhere- i did smaller local shows, sadly there are none of these about any longer! But i also did larger shows. Without experience the horse will never learn. The horse in question has had different riders on board, some more experienced than others and never had any issues.

Had it been my horse i wouldnt be happy- they are there to judge and NOT to school I would rather they retired the horse and placed me last, getting the horse to move off the leg is my problem, and my instructors.

I saw in here somewhere about the judge riding with a show cane not a whip- yes she hit with the cane. Shes lucky she stayed on- my horse would have chucked her a mile!
 
IMO, I'd be fuming if a judge laid a finger on my horse, or anyone for that matter!

I had someone down my yard the other day who was saying hi to the horses in my field, and my pony is really friendly and came over to her, and she began pulling his whiskers, and he hates it, then began really pulling and really in his face. I warned her he wasn't fond of that and tried to get in the field before he got p*ssed off and he nearly kicked her in the face, she went to slap him and saw me looking, trying to not laugh. I told her that he is usually okay with strangers, however POLITELY told her that I wasn't really happy with her doing that.


I know people have argued you shouldn't present a green horse to a judge, however in a youngster class, the horses are all going to be pretty green and, like us, have good and bad days, so we should cut them some slack. (horses that is, not the judge).
 
Oh dear, hasn't this kicked up some dirt?

I know the OP and her horses and they are shown from being foals, this will not have been the mare in questions second ever outing (Who was it??) just her second under saddle.

The OP only has one backside and too many horses so they do have different riders at home and out and about.

IMO the judge shouldnt have smacked her, just a low mark!
 
I am with those who say you need to present a well prepared horse for a judge to ride and I think a second ridden show is not when I would be introducing a ride judge even if the horse had been shown in hand before.

I would have left the second class as really you were just setting your horse up to fail.
 
horseychick1 said:
that's up to you if you think its right,but if it was your horse,think about it? would you accept it been smacked?
all ive done on here is asked a question & i'm not upset(mean horse been smacked) by it but simply just asking a question
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No I dont... it would be different if someone was schooling my horse , and they felt a smack was approprate and could justify their actions.. but like I said I dont realy see the point of the judge riding surely very few horses give there best with a total stranger riding.. its not a machine that has a set of buttons and leavers all in the same place , so all it realy proves is whether or not anyone can ride said horse,
 
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perfect11s said:
No I dont... it would be different if someone was schooling my horse , and they felt a smack was approprate and could justify their actions.. but like I said I dont realy see the point of the judge riding surely very few horses give there best with a stranger riding.. its not a machine that has a set of buttons and leavers all in the same place , so all it realy proves is whether or not anyone can ride said horse,
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But thats the point the best horses do give there best for a strange rider and that is why (alongside as near perfect conformation as possible) they win.
 
My answer would depend on......


If the judge felt she was backing off from an external influence and gave it a smack on the shoulder to get her attention back and stop a spook before it started then i would have no problem

If the horse broke from canter to trot because it was tired and the judge smacked it on the backside as punishment then i would be annoyed
 
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