Should Farriers wear helmets ?

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POLLDARK

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This has been brought to my mind by a young Farrier I know who took a severe kick to the front of his head & fell back onto concrete badly damaging the back of his head as well. Poor lad spent a long time in hospital & has a long hard road to recovery, physically & mentally.
Had he been wearing a helmet he could well have walked away from this accident I feel. Given that you need hard hats on roadworks, buiding sites etc it's suprising that helmets are not required to be worn by Farriers. Even more suprising that insurance companies will cover them without a helmet being worn. After all horses are very powerful & unpredictable.
I know Health & Safety has gone mad of late but I think this is an instance where it would be justified so I am just putting this up for discussion.:)
 
Possibly machismo would play a large part on whether they were worn as well. The introduction of any compulsory safety gear is always derided until it becomes commonplace & people accept it as normal.
 
Alternatively owners should train their horses in good manners so these professionals are not put at risk!
 
POLLDARK said:
Possibly machismo would play a large part on whether they were worn as well. The introduction of any compulsory safety gear is always derided until it becomes commonplace & people accet it as normal.
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I'm not sure in this case. The farrier spends a lot of time with their head upside down. A riding helmet would in that case restrict their peripheral vision which is one of the key things protecting them (along with their feel of what the horse is doing). I think it would be pretty unsuited also to being worn for the amount of hours doing that work.

I think if a helmet was compulsory it should be something purpose designed for farriers, but TBH I think there are downsides as well as upsides.
 
pip6 said:
Alternatively owners should train their horses in good manners so these professionals are not put at risk!
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But (playing devil's advocate), all horses - well-mannered or not - can spook or react sharply and catch a handler unawares, surely?

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lachlanandmarcus said:
I'm not sure in this case. The farrier spends a lot of time with their head upside down. A riding helmet would in that case restrict their peripheral vision which is one of the key things protecting them (along with their feel of what the horse is doing). I think it would be pretty unsuited also to being worn for the amount of hours doing that work.

I think if a helmet was compulsory it should be something purpose designed for farriers, but TBH I think there are downsides as well as upsides.
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I wondered about the peripheral vision too . . . surely that's pretty critical for farriers when they work so close to the animal and in such a compromised position much of the time - most of their cues are coming from behind or very close alongside them?

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Rather than adding unwelcome extra regulations, I would first make it acceptable for farriers to wear a helmet if they want - get rid of the stigma.
 
It's an interesting thought.
Sounds like your farrier was the victim of a nasty freak accident, rather than something that was "very likely" to happen, but as you say, a helmet may have helped.
I don't think it should be compulsory, but if they chose to wear one, I would understand why.

We have bump caps for shunting trains which look just like a baseball hat, for those that feel "stupid" wearing the building site type, so maybe for the more fashion conscious farrier that would be an option?
Problem is, they don't fasten on, and have a peak. Perhaps something like a climbing helmet would help with the peripheral vision problem, and they do have a chinstrap. http://www.totalaccessonline.co.uk/...Helmet--Blue?gclid=CKLlpZ-E5rkCFQy33god-3MAUA
 
If "ifs" and "ands" were pots and pans, there'd be no room for tinkers!

Isn't it the law on the Continent that horses can only have their feet attended to if they are in a crate/crush? We don't do it here because we have a tradition of not using these things, our horses are not trained to use them, and our farriers have never used them and they don't want them.

Why is it necessary to legislate against stupidity? If farriers felt they needed to wear a hat, I am sure they would do. Which is pretty much my attitude to H&S on the farm -- so long as I am not putting any third parties at risk or invalidating my insurance, I consider myself intelligent enough to make that personal choice without some politician legislation for me to do otherwise.

I also keep a large dog who doesn't like people carrying clip boards or wearing hi-vis!
 
The nasty accidents I have heard of (I am married to a farrier) have all been with unpredictable horses and owners being dishonest in not disclosing the known history/reactions of the horse. Also a young farrier starting out is more likely to encounter 'difficult' horses, which have possibly been refused by more experienced farriers and he /she would be keen to start building up a clientelle.
My hubby is happy to work with youngsters etc - he has all the patience in the world, but a mature horse who has issues with the owner picking up feet is a different matter altogether and justifiably he would refuse wiithout a vet present to dope.

Would he wear a helmet - no I doubt it. He has had hot metal in his eye on more than one occasion, but he still doesn't use safety goggles when shaping etc.
 
I wonder whether any helmets would actually be that great at protecting against a horse kick- given that they are all more designed to protect the user when the whole head falls on the ground (apart from building ones but I cannot see them helping!)
 
As someone who took on a horse with only three shoes I couldn't warn the farrier that he was going to misbehave as didn't know how badly behaved this large horse would be, he reared when being shod and ridden, so was sent back from where he came. Thankfully neither the farrier nor myself were hurt and the farrier didn't sack me.

Whilst wearing a helmet would protect them from kicks I'm not sure how practical it would be in reality, and suspect it would restrict vision, a helmet with visor would keep head and eyes safe!
 
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If it's the same farrier as the one I know he was kicked full in the face (by a horse known to be bad to shoe) and a helmet would not have helped.

I asked once about safety gear (not just helmets) and my farrier said they would be too restrictive and prevent them getting out the way of harm plus would probably freak the horse out. Helmets are too large given the places farriers have to put their heads and they can't see enough in them so making their job more dangerous.

I had a chimney sweep charge me danger money once to put a twirling thingy on my roof. I bet if farriers charged danger money a lot of horses would be suddenly trained to stand well.

Most farriers will say no and walk away from a horse that is bad to shoe in the end. As it's just not worth them risking their lives. I know farriers who have had their neck broken, other bones broken, organs damaged (from a kick to the abdomen) and brain or head damage, comas etc.

And then you get threads on here lambasting farriers for disciplining their horses. I wonder if they ever stopped to think about it. And yes there are those who take it too far. Personally I would be in there disciplining the horse myself except mine were trained to stand properly for his safety ANDfor mine! Funny thing is the horses had with farriers... Often their owners can't pick feet out or put boots on and do nothing to train the horse.
 
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My OH is a farrier. He doesn't wear a helmet but there is a local farrier who does. I don't think anyone stigmatises him as he just wears it and that is that. You could argue vets should wear helmets too. It's down to personal choice when you are self employed.
 
horsemadmum1 said:
My OH is a farrier. He doesn't wear a helmet but there is a local farrier who does. I don't think anyone stigmatises him as he just wears it and that is that. You could argue vets should wear helmets too. It's down to personal choice when you are self employed.
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Interesting that you know a Farrier that wears one. Good for him, I'm not saying they should or shouldn't just throwing it out there for discussion (though I know how I feel about it). Even though self employed as Farriers are it's still suprising that the insurance companies haven't put their oar in as they are often looking for ways to exclude. Some interesting views here.
 
The farrier in question I believe either had or witnessed an accident which was enough to convince him to wear the helmet, and it seems to be possible to work with one. It looks a bit like a cycle helmet I think-was ages ago when i saw him on a yard. The critical thing though is the owner presenting a well trained confident horse. Accidents still happen but are much more likely with an undisciplined or frightened horse.
 
PolarSkye said:
But (playing devil's advocate), all horses - well-mannered or not - can spook or react sharply and catch a handler unawares, surely?

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Yes, I agree or the farrier could (inadvertently) hurt the horse. Yes horses should be trained but it isn't always that simple.
 
As far as i'm concerned i trust my farrier 100% with all my horses. He is doing a job which is his livelyhood, his family depend on him to bring home the money so when he is with my horse he can do what he likes to it. I know he would never harm my horse, he is a very kind, patient person so if he feels the need to chastise my horse for ill behaviour then he has my blessing. Saying that in all the years i have had him he has never had to because my horses have never displayed any behaviour to warrant it. Yes a couple of them have tried it on, but he just gets on with it. They have had a smack or growl from me which has been enough to stop them. Also if he felt the need to wear protective clothing i'm sure he would, and he wouldn't give a monkeys who thought what of him either.
 
I would say my farrier would be safer wearing a cup. Ned once ripped his hoof out from the farriers legs and he could have made "him" a "her". He laughs about it, but I was mortified! Still, I tend to let him just get on with it. Technically he's been handling Ned longer than I have and he knows him VERY well. If he wants to discipline Ned, go for it, I'm just there to hold the horse! He knows I'm working very hard to get Ned as safe as possible to shoe and we are getting there! Ned will now lift his hooves for me, where as before I'd need to force them up and use all my strength to keep them up for more than a second.

Anyway, I want my farrier to be as safe as possible and would like him to wear at LEAST gloves, but I'm sure he wouldn't tell me how to do my job. As Nix123 says, if he wanted to, I'm sure he would!
 
I think wearing a helmet for hours at a time would cause problems because the farrier is bent over for so long.
I would prefer that no farrier was left to work alone, the owner or a competent handler should be present. Other things like, cross tying, using a bridle if necessary, providing good lighting and hard standing with shelter should be a basic requirement.
Any horse known to be difficult should be either sedated or have a vet present. I bought an explosive horse that was unsafe with the farrier, so, even though my farrier was happy to work with her, I wasn't happy to put him at risk and paid for a vet to be present to sedate her for several visits until she became compliant.

As an aside, a farrier once remarked that horses on racing yards and event yards were the best behaved horses to work with. Most of his problems came from those belonging to the one horse owner.
Perhaps correct training would prevent more injuries than a helmet ?
 
I did offer our vet a hard hat once, when she was examining Big Pony's teeth. He tends to thrash his head about and it hurts if he catches me with it. Vet wore the hard hat as she'd seen the pony before and knows what he is like.
But now I juist get him sedated for teeth so ne hard hat required now!.
 
Dry Rot said:
Isn't it the law on the Continent that horses can only have their feet attended to if they are in a crate/crush? We don't do it here because we have a tradition of not using these things, our horses are not trained to use them, and our farriers have never used them and they don't want them.
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That is actually a very good point. I come from a dairy farm and no trimmer would ever go near a cow unless it was in a crush and our herd are very well handled, it is just how the industry is and what the insurance requires.

A farrier's job by nature is high risk and there is as much chance getting kicked in the head as there is getting kicked elsewhere on the body.

I agree with Ester regarding how much it would actually protect, if you get kicked close range by a horse in the head the effect to the neck is surely the same regardless of head gear.

I think a lot of the time, freak accidents aside, that it is often the owners of horses who are at fault to a certain extent. I wouldn't have any new horse shod without being there for the first few times - just to see how the horse reacts and to hold it for them. My last horse was a bit spooky abd so I stuck some calmer in him and held him every time he was shod - I think you owe it to the person with his head under your horse to ensure he is as safe as possible, and having control of the horse's head is always a good start.

My farrier has given my horse a smack before when he is being a git. I was mostly mortified I hadn't sorted his manners out myself, I wouldn't berate anyone for cracking a naughty horse when his life is compromised.
 
Freak accidents are just that, freaks, Nothing can offer absolute protection, even hat/googles/gloves. When you talk to farriers though, most danger in their work comes from ill mannered horses that haven't been trained to a sufficient level that we should be asking another person to endanger themselves standing bent over at close range. Then there are those who know their horse is dangerous & just lie, as if farrier isn't going to find out! Young farriers defo most at risk, as to build their business they often start by taking on the trash the others can afford to turn away.

It's about respect, & I'm not talking horses. You are asking a professional to do a potentially dangerous job, if you respect them you will make sure the horse is perpared to stand quietly, or as a very minimum not kick, bite or rear. The absolute least people can do is be honest about their horse. Even if you don't know, such as new horse, say it is new & you don't know.
 
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