Should unqualified trimmers be legal?

pip6 said:
I agree there should be a minimum standard & registration.

I know a farmer trims his horses. Young guy who is in his employ who knows nothing about horses is being shown by him 'how to trim' so he can take over from farmer. Heavens knows what state / balance those feet will be in. Very scary.:eek:
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True - but they are NOT charging anyone for this service, which is the difference here!!!
 
The best way is to have a recognised qualification and then have protected title. That way only those people who are eligable for registration can call themselves (insert name). This is the way it works for other professions, such as solicitors, social workers etc. The registering body is paid for by the registration fees paid by those with title. Should work for any job if it can be legislated for. Mind you it does need legislation.
 
cptrayes said:
Good point!


The organisation are:

EP (not sure of the initials he uses) US Equine Podiatry

UKEP UK Equine Podiatry

UKNHCP UK Natural Hoofcare Practitioners

AANHCP Association of American Natutal Hoofcare Practioners
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what about those who qualified under Dr Strasser and those with the Swedish hoof school.
 
Waltzing Matilda said:
Lets not include strasser. Now there's a trimmer that gives everyone else s bad name and they're s qual and registered vet!!
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why not? they did a training course just as intensive and probably far more so than many of the others. Why shouldn't they be included? They will have been trimming for many years and probably have just as much experience as any other "qualified" trimmer. If that qualification is not included on CPT's list then they must presumably be an unqualified trimmer? would that be the case?
 
Case law has pretty much established that a genuine Strasser trim, where they are trained that it is accceptable to draw blood and to leave a horse sore after a trim, is illegal in this country and you will struggle to find a pure Strasser trimmer who will admit to the fact.
 
maggiehorse said:
i would never in any circumstances have anyone other than a trained farrier trim my horses feet
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You are lucky if your farrier was trained to trim and understand horses who are eventing/hunting/long distance with no shoes on. They only get that training if the master who they trained with had horses like it on his books. That's the problem, and that's why these trimming organisations exist in the first place. Farriers are not routinely trained to do what the trimmers are trained to do - keep a horse out of shoes if at all possible.
 
I suppose the question could also be:

Should people who want to be professional trimmers also have to become registered Farriers first, and then do additional, post-qualification courses if they want to become registered trimmers?

That would seem to me to be a sensible way of bringing everything under the same banner, trimmers would also then be able to give a balanced view if a horse needed shoes (which some do, for whatever reason, including owner being unable to provide the environment required for no shoes), they would understand why farriers do what they do, and would be able to challenge accepted wisdoms from the inside.

Perhaps if the various trimming groups could get themselves together and agree a way of providing post-qualification courses delivered under the banner of the WCF, then instead of the 'us and them' approach there is now, we might get to a point where if someone wants to go shoeless, then they feel comfortable using someone who has good knowledge of both shoeing and shoeless trimming.
 
Spotted Cat are you saying that you think every trimmer should be able to shoe? If so, I'm afraid I don't agree with you. The only problem that I would ever be prepared to shoe for again would be a broken bone within the foot, and if that happened, I'd call a farrier. The ability to shoe is not relevant, in my opinion, to caring for unshod horses without broken foot bones.

I do agree, though, that the WCF need to modify their syllabus to ensure that all their trainees, no matter who their master is, works with hunters/eventers/drivers/long distance horses with no shoes on and learns how to keep horses that are marginal out of shoes instead of being taught as a first resort to put them on.

In other words, all people who can legally shoe need to know how to keep a horse working hard without shoes on. But all people who trim do not need to know how to shoe.

I am sure that one day the FRC/WCF will wake up to this, but right now they seem to be in complete denial. Though I understand that some UKNHCP training is recognised by them for Continuing Professional Development points, which is at least a start.
 
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cptrayes said:
Spotted Cat are you saying that you think every trimmer should be able to shoe? If so, I'm afraid I don't agree with you. The only problem that I would ever be prepared to shoe for again would be a broken bone within the foot, and if that happened, I'd call a farrier. The ability to shoe is not relevant, in my opinion, to caring for unshod horses without broken foot bones.
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Only in the sense that it would be a route to solving the lack of qualification issue if the various trimming groups could agree a series of post-qualification courses for farriers.....and those people could then learn to be farriers and take the post-qualification courses to specialise in not shoeing.

What you are asking for require a new act of parliment - good luck with that!

I've done an awful lot of research into trimming, spent several hours with whatever they now call KC la Pierre trimmers. Having the ability to shoe a horse does not preclude people from knowing how to trim one without shoes, but it does feel very much like people who prefer not to shoe think it does!
 
Only registered farriers should be allowed to trim horses feet and anyone else doing it should be prosecuted. So if anyone wants to be a foot trimmer they should do the full farriers course.
 
cptrayes said:
Case law has pretty much established that a genuine Strasser trim, where they are trained that it is accceptable to draw blood and to leave a horse sore after a trim, is illegal in this country and you will struggle to find a pure Strasser trimmer who will admit to the fact.
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sorry I don't understand your reply. What about trimmers who trained with Strasser and then modified their trim? (and there were some) Do they get to go on your list of accredited training organisations? or do you consider them unqualified trimmers. At one time the main trimmer in the UK was one of these who probably has more experience than many of the others put together.
 
While I agree it would be good to have 2 groups one who can shoe and trim and one that can only trim with the FRC I would like those already qualified to shoe have to prove they know more about unshod horses and how worked unshod horses need to be managed by the owner and can explain.
 
I completely agree with the original OP, and I believe that the "resonsible" associations, who include insurance for their members after undertaking training, have been trying for a good long time to be recognised in some way. I think the farriers are kicking up a fuss, which is not surprising really. But since many horses have become sound thanks to a trimmer, after going lame with issues despite being shod by a "qualified and registered farrier" it is frustrating for horse owners.

I wouldn't like anyone "untrained" let loose on a horse's foot, using any sort of tool and with proper insurance. My farrier is currently dealing with a horse that was lamed by a "trimmer" and he is a farrier who is broadly in favour of the barefoot horse.
 
cptrayes said:
My own preference would be for a two tier registration from the FRC. People who are registered for foot care without being able to shoe, and people who are registered for foot care including shoeing. They don't seem interested at the moment, they still seem to think that the barefoot movement is a flash in the pan.
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This ^^^^^, although I thought it was all set to happen, I am disappointed if it is not still in the pipeline. It makes sense, it would ensure that trimmers were to 'a standard' and that they would have to be insured to have membership. I still think it is the 'barefoot' word that is the problem, any farrier worth his salt knows in depth the importance of diet etc for improving unshod feet (and shod feet, come to that!). I think it is probably the fact that anybody can call themselves a trimmer that galls with farriers, and who can blame them!
 
I'm an Equine Sciences Academy (ESA) student as well. The three UK instructors are very established in their own right.. http://www.equinesciencesacademy.com/esa_000057.htm I'm aware Barefoot Works the only trimming partnership in Scotland (poss UK as well) has one of their trimmers whose AHA American Hoof Association accredited, as well. The AHA http://www.americanhoofassociation.org/ is for any trimmer but you need to submit a number of rigorous case studies to a panel. Something like this so differing training organisations could continue to operate with a panel of mixed people for a board? Or even the AHA stamp be acceptable, just some thoughts, Best wishes, Hannah
 
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