Show horses. Are they well schooled?

[TicTac]

Not ever having done showing above local level, I was wondering how well schooled county plus, show horse are. By this I mean do they just look nice but are a solid as a rock or are they schooled properly, ie to be light in the hand and work from behind.

The reason I ask is that I am going to have a look at a horse next week that has been produced by a professional who shows at Horse of the year etc. I really have no idea what to expect other than a well turned out horse!!

I am going to have a look at this horse with a view to doing a bit of everything on it but would like to concentrate on dressage. I appreciate that it will probably need re-educating to a point but would just like an idea of what I might be up against!

 

[JFTDWS]

reckon it depends greatly on the horse / rider/ producer, tbh. I used to ride maxi cobs which were shown at county level, and they were ill-educated plebs in my opinion. However, I imagine some of the riding horses etc are better schooled

 

[Lolo]

I think they're very well schooled. They need to be able to work beautifully into a light contact on the bit and give anyone a pleasant ride to be successful. I would jump at the chance to own one as they'll be well mannered if they're properly produced.

You get some knobbers, but the ones we've seen/ ridden have been immaculately schooled. They'd go well for anyone with half a brain. These are mostly ridden hunter/ riding horse types though...

The only thing I can think of is working them into a more 'up' frame, as it appears to be more correct to have them so they sit very light in the hand with their neck slightly more extended than in a traditional dressage frame?

 

[siennamum]

I would say that it means nothing in terms of way of going. Some producers have beautifully shooled horses but you see some at a very high level and they are fixed, stuffy and stiff. Should mean the horse is good to take out and about hopefully.

 

[floradora09]

A lady on my yard does a lot of showing on her traditional cob, all of hers have been beautifully schooled and she has regular lessons with a dressage trainer. We're always trying to persuade her to do some more dressage on them though, she took her last horse to their first dressage comp together and he swept the floor with something like 72%!

 

[LowenKi]

Is he/she old or young? From past experience it's easier to correct the stiffness often seen in show horses while they're young. Have you seen a video - in particular any lateral work? This is usually something they come a bit unstuck on.

 

[LaurenB]

Mine when I got him at 6 he had done nothing but show, he was pretty stiff and it took a lot to tea h him to bend, I hacked him out lots and jumped him before returning to the school, now he is much better but did take a while! When I think back he really could not bend very well at all!

 

[Carefreegirl]

In theory yes they should be, a judge that probably hasn't ridden your horse before will ride them for a couple of minutes and expect the horse to go correctly and properly for the type of class. Very often when magazines do 'what the judges are looking for' articles many of them will say 'we are not there to school the horse. Having done quite a few ROR classes, quite often the horses go better for the ride judge than the normal rider !

 

[GinaGeo]

Some are. Some aren't. I knew one horse - stunning - that was immaculately schooled by his then ammature rider, it paid off he won his HOYS class. And others that are very stiff and fixed, they haven't won at HOYS

As a stereotype the Hacks, Riding Horses, Hunters and Cobs ought to be the best as they have to be ridden by a judge.

ETA: The horse that won was also hacked out, jumped regularly and participated in X-Country Schooling. He lived a normal life.

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

From a producers, it depends which producer and what sort of horse it is. Either which way it will be very, very well schooled to the show ring but it may lack knowledge of anything else such as xc, hacking, bombing around like a normal horse etc. It's safe to say you are going to have a great ride but also consider how much it will take to turn it into a 'normal horse'. I'm really not trying to paint a bad picture of showing as most certainly not all show horses are like this.

 

[Oldenburg27]

My boy does county level i would say yes they have to be as judges have to ride them and they have to be mannerly!!

My boy is very well schooled and has had many wins at this level and Q for RIHS.

Not all are though you always hear a ride jugde comment on there ride!!

 

[LowenKi]

Are they selling this horse as a show horse or as a all rounder/potential dressage horse? If its been produced well and is in his 'prime' I'd question why they weren't selling it as a show horse as a lot of work goes into them and horses of a particular level fetch good money! Just a thought.

 

[TicTac]

Are they selling this horse as a show horse or as a all rounder/potential dressage horse? If its been produced well and is in his 'prime' I'd question why they weren't selling it as a show horse as a lot of work goes into them and horses of a particular level fetch good money! Just a thought.

The horse in question is being sold with the potential to make a top class riding club/ allrounder. Wont make the grade as a top show horse due to an injury sustained in the horsebox which has caused unsightly scarring. The horse is only young and has hunted and been successfully shown in sports horse and riding horse classes.. So imo young enough to iron out any problems should there be any!

 

[LowenKi]

Ah ok, yep that would be a deal breaker! The hunting sounds like it could have shown the horse the world - which is definitely a plus for any young horse. I guess you won't know until you sit on it, good luck though! Look forward to hearing how it went!

 

[DunDally]

My daughter grooms for a locally well known and successful rider/producer from county level to HOYS winners and they are all well schooled. They have regular lessons with a dressage trainer and also go to dressage comps locally

 

[AdorableAlice]

A County level winning hunter will be very well schooled. When the judges got off our horse they always had a smile and commented that they could sit on him all day. They had no idea he was working at medium, has 148 points and in the 3 years he was shown he had won over 50 dressage classes. Many show horses are not just pretty faces.

The trouble came when a judge either grabbed hold or took absolutely no contact at all. We had one judge, sadly at championship level, that hauled at the bridle and found herself going rather faster sideways that she wanted to go. Another judge, at County level, who sat on the cantle and held the buckle resulting in a rather bemused horse bumbling along waiting for instructions from above. An unbalanced judge managed to produce traver, renver and half pass pretty much at the same time.

The horse put up with everything, with the exception of the ham fisted bint, with a smile on his face.

 

[Sparkles]

To me, there is nothing nicer to ride than a correctly produced show horse.

 

[dafthoss]

Depends whos done it. I have spent the last 2 years undoing the work done by some on breaking mine with the intention of him being a show pony. He was ridden in draw reins far to much and is now very resistant of the contact but its a work in progress and he is now much better muscled and his attitude to work is beginning to change. This was a M&M so no need for the judge to ride he just had to go round with his head tucked in.

 

[QUICKFIRE]

A County level winning hunter will be very well schooled. When the judges got off our horse they always had a smile and commented that they could sit on him all day. They had no idea he was working at medium, has 148 points and in the 3 years he was shown he had won over 50 dressage classes. Many show horses are not just pretty faces.

The trouble came when a judge either grabbed hold or took absolutely no contact at all. We had one judge, sadly at championship level, that hauled at the bridle and found herself going rather faster sideways that she wanted to go. Another judge, at County level, who sat on the cantle and held the buckle resulting in a rather bemused horse bumbling along waiting for instructions from above. An unbalanced judge managed to produce traver, renver and half pass pretty much at the same time.

The horse put up with everything, with the exception of the ham fisted bint, with a smile on his face.

Stunning!!

 

[AdorableAlice]

Quickfire - thank you.

Totally amatuer produced, showjumper before we bought him aged 11, as a dressage horse. Unshown until until his was 13, took him local and had a well known judge tell us to affiliate him and we never looked back. Three years of success at County, Championship and Hoys. The judges never knew his age, the pro's wanted to buy him. We flew by the seat of our pants, learning a lot by watching pro's and asking questions.

I kept a record of all his starts in competition both showing and dressage, it sounds like we worked him to death, but he would normally do 2 tests each outing. In fours years he had 156 competitive starts, he won 135, was never less than 4th if he didn't win. 7th at Hoys 2 years running and the only amatuer. He was thrown out of the ring by the ham fisted judge at Addington for alleged bad manners and he removed himself from a dressage arena, backwards, because he didn't like being hailed on.

He is a horse of a lifetime with a golden temperament.

He is 19 this year and sadly very badly injured himself last August in the field and has been on box rest ever since, but rehab is underway and it is hoped he will enjoy hacking in his retirement. If not he has a field and a friend to enjoy in total retirement. He owes me nothing, I owe him everything and he has taken us to places most people only dream of. We did it all on a shoestring and sacrificed a lot, but it was a real experience.

 

[Auslander]

Like any discipline, a well schooled show horse is one that does the job required of him/her. It may not be what a dressage rider, or a showjumper would call well schooled, but equally, a show producer may get on a horse that's been produced to show jump, and think that it gives a horrible ride.

I've ridden two county level show hunters recently. One could have gone out and won at Medium level dressage, the other felt rather like she was on rails - only did straight lines and couldn't get her head round the concept of bend. Both had been extremely successful in the ring, so I couldn't fault the second for not feeling like I wanted her to feel - because she did the job she was meant to do

 

[Lolo]

Depends whos done it. I have spent the last 2 years undoing the work done by some on breaking mine with the intention of him being a show pony. He was ridden in draw reins far to much and is now very resistant of the contact but its a work in progress and he is now much better muscled and his attitude to work is beginning to change. This was a M&M so no need for the judge to ride he just had to go round with his head tucked in.

Al and I were discussing this because show ponies are different. They need to go in the image of an outline at the least with flashy, correct paces. Small children rarely can produce this so ponies are put in draw reins so they always go with their head in the 'right' place. Because only this small child will be riding them in the ring, they don't need to be well schooled- mannerly and forgiving, yes. But schooled, nah!

Horses, because some complete stranger will be getting on and expecting the horse to produce immaculate work, will need to be able to go nicely for anyone.

One of the top producers in our area gave Al a lesson the other night as her showing knowledge is zero. Her biggest thing was the horse has to be almost behind the bit so they're very soft in the hand, and to leg yield him round corners and things to keep him soft and bent inwards as bend produces a better picture. It was very interesting- Reg usually works into the contact with a more 'up' outline so it was almost taking him back a step in his schooling.

 

[dafthoss]

Al and I were discussing this because show ponies are different. They need to go in the image of an outline at the least with flashy, correct paces. Small children rarely can produce this so ponies are put in draw reins so they always go with their head in the 'right' place. Because only this small child will be riding them in the ring, they don't need to be well schooled- mannerly and forgiving, yes. But schooled, nah!

Horses, because some complete stranger will be getting on and expecting the horse to produce immaculate work, will need to be able to go nicely for anyone.

One of the top producers in our area gave Al a lesson the other night as her showing knowledge is zero. Her biggest thing was the horse has to be almost behind the bit so they're very soft in the hand, and to leg yield him round corners and things to keep him soft and bent inwards as bend produces a better picture. It was very interesting- Reg usually works into the contact with a more 'up' outline so it was almost taking him back a step in his schooling.

Exactly! But the odd thing is that as he is native he can be ridden by adults so the short cuts wernt really necisarry . Apart from wanting a quick sale . Its ok I'm pulling the bog brush today so no more showing for us this year.

Agree though the horses are generally well schooled as they have to deal with judges that all ride diffrently and give them all a nice ride.

I hope we get a full report of reggie show ponying.

 

[shadowboy]

There is a hoys hack in my yard and she is beautifully schooled as hacks should have a very light way of going. Also don't forget the judge should ride and the horse should carry themselves with ease for anyone.

 

[brighteyes]

The ones I have sat on - kids ponies mostly, have been so far behind the bridle I couldn't see them and were totally confused when asked to take a contact. Awful, fixed and stiff as boards.

You can't tell how much between hand and leg they are til you are on board. All that ineffectual rein-twidding and heel-flapping gets my teeth grinding.

 

[QUICKFIRE]

Quickfire - thank you.

Totally amatuer produced, showjumper before we bought him aged 11, as a dressage horse. Unshown until until his was 13, took him local and had a well known judge tell us to affiliate him and we never looked back. Three years of success at County, Championship and Hoys. The judges never knew his age, the pro's wanted to buy him. We flew by the seat of our pants, learning a lot by watching pro's and asking questions.

I kept a record of all his starts in competition both showing and dressage, it sounds like we worked him to death, but he would normally do 2 tests each outing. In fours years he had 156 competitive starts, he won 135, was never less than 4th if he didn't win. 7th at Hoys 2 years running and the only amatuer. He was thrown out of the ring by the ham fisted judge at Addington for alleged bad manners and he removed himself from a dressage arena, backwards, because he didn't like being hailed on.

He is a horse of a lifetime with a golden temperament.

He is 19 this year and sadly very badly injured himself last August in the field and has been on box rest ever since, but rehab is underway and it is hoped he will enjoy hacking in his retirement. If not he has a field and a friend to enjoy in total retirement. He owes me nothing, I owe him everything and he has taken us to places most people only dream of. We did it all on a shoestring and sacrificed a lot, but it was a real experience.

What a lovely story! and he sounds an amazing horse, and truly a horse of a lifetime, I hope he makes a full recovery! OH and well done you, that is a pretty impressive CV..

 

[neelie OAP]

Well it really doesn't mean a thing, just forget they ever said that and go and form your our opinion, good luck

 

[Inchy]

My last 'show horse' was schooled up to medium level dressage, and did compete up to BD elementry and the odd medium test during the winter when there wasn't any showing to go to.

Depends on who has produced them, but also that you expect slightly different things from a 'show' horse than a dressage horse, for example, a hack is expected to be very light in the hands, often too light from a dressage perspective.

 

[FMM]

Ours all go to dressage (and usually do very well), those that are sane enough (most of them) hunt, nearly all of them jump and all of them hack out. They are all as well schooled as they can be - they work regularly with dressage instructors and are taught to be light, obedient without losing their joie de vivre which the best show horses MUST have. A judge has to get off feeling that the horse has enjoyed themselves as much as the judge - how much more pleasurable to feel at one with your horse? They are all ridden by different people at home - so are expected to go correctly no matter who gets on board. Obviously they go better for some riders than others - but they should all give an educated ride.

No idea about show ponies - I've never ridden my son's 12.2 pony as I am too heavy - however, he has been to HOYS and he jumps, does pony club games and has never been ridden in draw reins. I guess that some producers try for shortcuts and perhaps over produce to compensate for not so good riding skills?