Showing People - a question please

[Dovorian]

When you are judged do you sometimes ask the judge why they placed you wherever and if there is anything that can be improved etc.

I'm thinking about using mark sheets when I judge at unaff shows - hunters WH and ridden and M&M's. Would you like to see where you gained (or lost) marks? Of am I simply putting my head on the block?

 

[Loupride]

I know that I would love to see my marking sheets

It doesnt particularily bother me where I am placed as I am usually just competing at local level but when I was preparing for Dublin I did chat to a few of my judges after the class; not to ask why I ws placed where I was but more to get their overall feeling on P and if I was entering the right classes etc.
I have to say they were so helpful and their experience & information proved invaluable

 

[conniegirl]

yes i ask why when im unexpectedly placed low (dont question when im placed well).
i'd love to see mark sheets at local shows, might help stop some of the ring side grumbling and the quite frankly sometimes apauling judgeing at local level. I had a bad experiance yesterday, woud have loved for there to be mark sheets just so i could see wgat was going on in the silly womans head.

 

[Lvrees]

God yeh, I ask the judge everytime for tips!! You wont improve otherwise, doesnt matter what so and so says, its what the judge thinks that actually counts!! I've found by using judges comments me and my horse and improved so much!! So yes I definatly would appreciate a brief comment on how to improve!!
The one comment through which I got last year at a local show was "I thought you were going to win, untill you stood him up and he's quite narrow" Which made me feel utterly rubbish!!!! But I've never had the same comment again and we show County level successfully!

 

[FMM]

I think that every person who shows horses should judges at least once in their life time. The reasoning why judges make odd decisions suddenly becomes a lot clearer! There is no such thing as a perfect horse, and therefore, when judging, you take into account the breed/type guidelines, then add your own preferences into the mix. Marks are great, but sometimes you can mark a class and be surprised at the winner. This turns it (in my opinion) into more of a dressage test. Part of the skill of showing is making the judge believe that you have the best horse or pony, and splitting it down into 3 lots of marks can sometimes mean that you forget to look at the whole picture which defeats the object.

I hope that this makes some sort of sense. In theory, if you add marks up, then the best horse wins, but it really doesn't work like that in real life! Honestly - try it and see.

This is why at Showing Camp, one of the most important things is learning how to "show" your horse. Make it catch the judges eye; stand it up for the conformation so that only the good points are enhanced and not the weak ones. Make the overall impression that of a winner.

Marks are great if you have a million lookalike ponies in the ring, but they should still allow the judge to be able to choose the pony that best matches with her intepretation of the class description.

 

[Evil_Cookie]

I used to know a judge who gave you a little note with your rosette, she was very nice and gave little pointers on what you could improve, without being rude. She did like my welsh though so maybe I got the nice comments

It's a nice idea, you could try and see how people react?

 

[Lvrees]

I agree with FMM with the score sheet though, i often stand outside a ring and can pick the winner before the judge has looked at them all. Its the one with the most presence, obvious manners, nice to the eye but has the most "X-factor", yet it may not be as straight moving or have the most floaty pace as one or two of the others, it just stands out... And I think just giving comments at the end would be sufficient, tell them the good points and the bad points and how to improve (bit like assessing a horse in your stage 4!!!) I think if I was given a score sheet, I'd question everything on it... so a quiet word would be best...

 

[Dovorian]

That's a lovely idea - especially for the novice classes or small children. In my own (limited) experience it is often the novice adults who are keen to understand their placings for the sake of improvement. I totally agree with FMM, if one takes a working hunter class and simply give x marks out of 60 for jumping and again x out of 40 for the 'show hunter' element, then I think that isn't particularly helpful for the novice rider/owner. Even splitting it down and marking manners, conformation, ride etc separately does not help, in dressage the mark you are given indicates what the judge thought of your performance (controversial sometines!!). My question is really levelled at those competing at lower levels who are wanting to improve and maybe compete at a higher level - plus I think that judges should be willing and able to say why they placed as they did. On the competitor side, they need to remeber that it is the judge's opinion on that day. I am quite convinced that many people don't know what they are doing wrong, hence showing clinics and the like are a super way to improve, the key of course is what happens at the show!

 

[virtual]

I'm not a huge fan of marks because there are so many factors to take in to account (type, manners, way of going, straightness, conformation etc), often they don't take account of the "go round" as much as the individual show, and what do you do with the beautiful, typey, well behaved horse who is covered in stable stains, unplaited etc or the rude competitor when others have made so much effort? It's hard to to take account of everything in a marks scheme, and using only 2 or 3 categories makes it hard for people to know where they could improve.

I think a more useful system would be for you to write some things down about each horse (positive and negative) that you see while judging and ask each competitor if they'd like some advice/opinions when you give them their rosette. Then they'd know specifically what to improve on rather than seeing a score of 32/50 for their show (for example) and wondering how they could improve.