showing - what is fair?

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NooNoo59

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Just wanted some opinions as the showing season is just about to start, yippee!!. My lovely boy is great most of the time, but had a couple of incidents in the showring last year, both were in rings next to the jumping ring and in one incident a horse crashed thru a fence just behind my boy while i was doing my individual show which freaked him and put us last in the class even though he was going beautifully to that point and the judge said that was why i was put down and at another show the showumpers did their very fast lap of honour right behind my boy as again we were doing our show. So the question is, if you are in a class and an incident affects only you, is it fair to be sent down the line when other horses if they had been in the same situation amy well have reacted the same. I can understand that say a very windy day would affect all, but these affected only me so was it fair to lose placings becuase of it. Both judges said that we would have been first if that had not happened. Sounds like sour grapes, but just interested what other people think.
 
It's just bad luck and you have to move on. The horses are generally judged on manners, conformation, and suitability for the class. If your horse spooks, his manners are clearly not as good as a horse who didn't on a very basic level regardless of why he spooked.
 
Think yes its a bit unfair but suppose they are looking for horse to be well behaved whatever.Have also seen the opposite happen tbh horse is high/stressed/naughty total a**e and is placed above one that has behaved impeccably all round arena.
We've had the same with tractor pulling in next arena when daughter was showjumping.
I also hate it when arena helpers start putting jumps up in middle of class to save time for next class.Unless they have folk wondering round arena in every ones round it is unfair.
I take it as just one of those things and chalk it up to experience and try to work on introducing pony to alsorts-even tho you can't account for everything - we certainly didn't with the tractor pulling
 
So the question is, if you are in a class and an incident affects only you, is it fair to be sent down the line when other horses if they had been in the same situation amy well have reacted the same.
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No it's not fair - but then not much in showing is.
 
vanessa roberts said:
But i was the only one who had this happen on my show, all the others had no outside influences so is that fair?
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Sadly life isn't fair. There will be other classes when other people draw the short straw by doing their individual show just as XYZ happens and you don't. It's a case of taking the rough with the smooth.
 
vanessa roberts said:
But i was the only one who had this happen on my show, all the others had no outside influences so is that fair?
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No, but then showing is entirely subjective anyway... They can only mark what they see. If your horse spooked, he spooked. The others didn't. Sure, yours had reason to but who knows how the other horses may have behaved and so the judge can't extrapolate.
 
I'm into endurance, & final grades are determined by speed & heart rate at the post ride vetting. Things happen during the ride (like waiting for a huge herd of cattle to cross at milking time) where you just loose time & there is no recourse. Also I've been in the vetting when due to high winds they decided to take the tent down next to us, you can imagine what a flapping tent did for my girls heart rate! Couple of years ago I rode a friends horse & whilst his rate was being taken a large group of pleasure riders thought it fun to gallop over the finish line whooping their heads off. Sure they were having fun, but it screwed us, we went from a good grade (vet said he was on course for a grade 1) to just a completion when it went up. Wrong place, wrong time, you just take it on the chin when you compete.
 
Thats showing I'm afraid, i've been in many classes where this has happened, and no it's not fair! I love showing and would never stop but it is so unfair a lot of the time, better look next time :)
 
vanessa roberts said:
But i was the only one who had this happen on my show, all the others had no outside influences so is that fair?
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This is why I would never do showing as a discipline. Or one of the reasons why anyway. It's so subjective. But to be fair, that element can happen in any discipline. In dressage, something may happen in the arena at the time of your test, dog getting loose etc and spook your horse, you'd lose a mark perhaps. Also, SJ, same again, if halfway through your round something happened it could spook your horse.

However showing, more than any other discipline would penalise the most IMO
 
TequilaMist said:
Think yes its a bit unfair but suppose they are looking for horse to be well behaved whatever.Have also seen the opposite happen tbh horse is high/stressed/naughty total a**e and is placed above one that has behaved impeccably all round arena.
We've had the same with tractor pulling in next arena when daughter was showjumping.
I also hate it when arena helpers start putting jumps up in middle of class to save time for next class.Unless they have folk wondering round arena in every ones round it is unfair.
I take it as just one of those things and chalk it up to experience and try to work on introducing pony to alsorts-even tho you can't account for everything - we certainly didn't with the tractor pulling
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Welcome to the world of County level showing. Your horses will also need to get used to hot air baloons, red arrows parachute team, royal horse artilliery and their gun salute, John Parker and his other 4 in hand friends, Shires in all their kit, scurry driving, trotter/pacers, donkeys, foxhound parade, lorry park (why do pony owners insist on lunging at the bottom of my ramp!), it is all character building for the horse, stress for the owner and meant to be fun.
Have a good season.
 
AdorableAlice said:
Welcome to the world of County level showing. Your horses will also need to get used to hot air baloons, red arrows parachute team, royal horse artilliery and their gun salute, John Parker and his other 4 in hand friends, Shires in all their kit, scurry driving, trotter/pacers, donkeys, foxhound parade, lorry park (why do pony owners insist on lunging at the bottom of my ramp!), it is all character building for the horse, stress for the owner and meant to be fun.
Have a good season.
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Think the above is very true, you have my sympathy though, when doing a TARRA class the steam engine display started of right next door.. there were many people muttering about lack of respect espcially when its a ring full of ex racehorses!
Its just the way things go, you just look at what happened and perhaps it will give you ideas on what you can practise at home.

Good luck for this coming season, im cant wait to get the babies in the ring :) Maybe get them to Equifest if Im lucky enough!! :eek:
 
When i went to watch Windsor to see if we would not be out of place in our class, they let the royal artillery guns off before the class, dont know how i duplicate that at home!!
 
AdorableAlice said:
Welcome to the world of County level showing. Your horses will also need to get used to hot air baloons, red arrows parachute team, royal horse artilliery and their gun salute, John Parker and his other 4 in hand friends, Shires in all their kit, scurry driving, trotter/pacers, donkeys, foxhound parade, lorry park (why do pony owners insist on lunging at the bottom of my ramp!), it is all character building for the horse, stress for the owner and meant to be fun.
Have a good season.
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I don't do showing,haven't got the nature for it-too much of a slob!!Daughter did a bit but mainly showjumped.
lol at shires !Reminds me when daughters pony was down at royal highland and didn't bat an eye at anything he saw or heard there UNTIL he saw the clydesdales in their rig out! he absolutely pooped himself!! Poor thing!
 
Life isn't fair - but in my experience, at local shows, unless your horse behaves abominably, the judges just place the ones they like anyway. I've been placed below bucking, obese welshies, who didn't strike off on the right leg at all, on my well mannered highland on some pretence, then the following week been placed above well mannered horses on the same pony who chose not to move off my leg at all during the individual show (as in broke to halt from trot to have a poo) because the judge openly confessed to liking him. Unless it's a family horse class or your horse is really dangerous, I don't think it actually affects the end placing.

I was spitting feathers once when I was doing indoor arena xc (in a very small arena) and mid way through my round they let the next horse in - my horse was distracted and took out a fence because of it. However, they apologised and I said it was ok - I clearly need to get hte beast more focussed on his job in the ring! :D
 
Find a recording of gunfire - maybe record some from the tv - then play it as you school at home. A friend recorded applause at a very big show and plays this to prepare her horse for the show ring.
 
If the judge had been kind you might have been allowed to have another go, but if this was a County Show then it was just bad luck and one of those things.

I was once placed in a show on a Novice hunter that spent half the time bucking, but luckily the judge was always looking the other way, and he did at least behave when the judge got on. I expect the other competitors were spitting, but that is showing, you just have to take it all round.
 
Thats showing! All sorts happens, you have to take it on the chin or take up racing pebbles, breeding house bricks or similar instead :D

However - boot on other foot, you'd be pretty angry if someones horse spooked (like yours did) and they WERE put up the line above those which didn't, wouldn't you? :p
 
vanessa roberts said:
When i went to watch Windsor to see if we would not be out of place in our class, they let the royal artillery guns off before the class, dont know how i duplicate that at home!!
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I've been the victim of that sort of inimitable at home kind of distraction on more than one occasion. You win some, you lose some. That's showing for us.

At Kent County show this year they had a stunt motorbike display going on during the hack classes - an excellent test of the perfect manners a hack should display ;):D

However, [tongue firmly in cheek here] last year it seemed that manners are no longer the be all and end all if a horse can give a judge the ride of their life....apparently......
 
JFTD said:
Life isn't fair - but in my experience, at local shows, unless your horse behaves abominably, the judges just place the ones they like anyway. I've been placed below bucking, obese welshies, who didn't strike off on the right leg at all, on my well mannered highland on some pretence, then the following week been placed above well mannered horses on the same pony who chose not to move off my leg at all during the individual show (as in broke to halt from trot to have a poo) because the judge openly confessed to liking him. Unless it's a family horse class or your horse is really dangerous, I don't think it actually affects the end placing.

I was spitting feathers once when I was doing indoor arena xc (in a very small arena) and mid way through my round they let the next horse in - my horse was distracted and took out a fence because of it. However, they apologised and I said it was ok - I clearly need to get hte beast more focussed on his job in the ring! :D
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love your pony!!
 
It sounds perfectly fair to me and as someone else mentioned it would have been unfair to the other competitors if you had been placed above them when there horses did not spook.

Show horses are supposed to have perfect manners no matter what is going on around them.
 
To be honest you need to expect this kind of thing to happen when showing. Our little cob tolerated the following during her career

Army tank driven alongside the ring
Paracutists landing IN the ring (they missed the marker in the other ring)
Dog racing next to her
An entire pack of hounds spilling out of the adjoining ring under her feet when she was doing her show.
Bouncy castles and roundabouts on the ring side
Loud rock music and flashing lights
Cheering stamping crowds
Kids, balloons, umberellas and other stuff hanging over the ropes
A Western roping display complete with artificial cow being towed on a sledge next to her
A JCB display team
Horse artillary, Heavy horse teams

I could go on and on. A bit of wind and jumps coming down is minor stuff.

Cant say she ever behaved badly at any of them. Because of the criteria they are judging against I wouldn't have been happy if she was beaten by something that didn't behave. I know people think showing is an easy option, but they have to put up with quite a lot at the bigger shows. Any horse that doesn't have the temperament for it would probably be better in another discipline.
 
^^^^ What she said. We have pictures of BP with motorcycles 10m+ in the air behind him and he once had to share a ring with a vulture. He was not impressed and was maybe a hand higher than before but he got on with his job.
Then there was the day with the scurry cones, wandering arena parties, etc... Yes I was pee'd off just like you but i voted with my feet and will not go back to that show.
 
Agree with all the above about what they have to put up with at county shows. If you do a class where you ride an individual show rather than the judge rides have a really good look round the ring and plan what part of ring you are using. You may be able to avoid the worst of it. What is really annoying is if bad manners are forgiven because of who is on the horse (by the way not saying spooking is bad manners).

Funny one at Edenbridge ROR, they had the plastic cows and sheep in the ring (for the working hunters) and were moving them around much to the consternation of several of the horses.
 
And to add to the above, whilst you cannot control what is going on around you (silly example someone putting up an sunshade umbrella in the hospitality area as we were trotting towards it making horse stick his head up and yes I know if he was truly working properly he wouldn't had done so)....again it is worth looking at the schedule to see what is on at the same time. I didn't go to Suffolk last year because they had a helicopter refuelling display or something like that in the main ring when our class would have been on and whilst we frequently get low flying helicopters over our yard, didn't think it was worth £100 of diesel to be in the ring at the wrong moment.
 
I have never understood the appeal of "showing" personally. I like clear-cut wins or losses based on the horse and riders competence not how pretty they look (I can hear the gasps coming from some of you now! :eek::D) Moving swiftly on ... yes I think the judges decision was fair :o I'll get me coat :D
 
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