SJers and eventers, how often do you jump?

[paddi22]

we get a lot of cobs in to train. some can be super little sporty types, but at the same time if they don't want to do something or are bored with jumping they can just down tools and refuse. a good portion also hit a ceiling on the height they are happy jumping at, a few that will happily cruise round an 80, but just can't do a 90s. The cob in the pic below absolutely flew around any 90s full height course, but just wasn't able for the metres, even though it looked very scopey.

when kids get them the main issue they seem to have is not having fitness or a proper canter. when they get the canter right, the jump is right. or else kids get into a loop of expecting the cob to refuse and tip forward, making it too hard for it to jump. also a few have surfaces in small yards that are really really deep, and it's tough on the pony to do an hours lesson or whatever in it.

 

[ihatework]

we get a lot of cobs in to train. some can be super little sporty types, but at the same time if they don't want to do something or are bored with jumping they can just down tools and refuse. a good portion also hit a ceiling on the height they are happy jumping at, a few that will happily cruise round an 80, but just can't do a 90s. The cob in the pic below absolutely flew around any 90s full height course, but just wasn't able for the metres, even though it looked very scopey.View attachment 97885

when kids get them the main issue they seem to have is not having fitness or a proper canter. when they get the canter right, the jump is right. or else kids get into a loop of expecting the cob to refuse and tip forward, making it too hard for it to jump. also a few have surfaces in small yards that are really really deep, and it's tough on the pony to do an hours lesson or whatever in it.

Getting the fitness is the difficult thing.

My big cob x TB was successful at Novice/2* but to get close to the times the amount of fitness work he did was disproportional to the level. He’d do a structured gallop at least once a week, and in the run up to 2* every 5-6 days. That’s what you might do for an advanced one day.

Compare that to my purpose bred 6yo 16hh who is out at novice and hasn’t had to do a single structured gallop set yet. He just moves and gallops within himself and his recovery rate is insane

 

[maya2008]

When we had a school and I competed SJ (pre kids!) I jumped twice a week or so. Depended on the age of the horse and upcoming competitions (sometimes less). Horses kept their fitness well. Little sports pony would jump water troughs, field fences etc if not entertained regularly!

We have a cob cross. He enjoys jumping (naps to the jumps if they are out!) but I keep it small and once a week or so. He’s too heavy on his feet for leaping around to be good for his joints.

In your friend’s case I would:
1) Check it isn’t the rider. I let my son borrow my pony for a few jumping sessions, and she refused with him. Took a couple of sessions for me to get her back to normal. He just wasn’t giving enough with his hands, even though it looked like he was. Do this by popping a good rider on for a couple of jumping sessions, then out to a comp with the same rider.
2) If there is still a problem, check for pain. Vet and/or bute trial.

 

[Caol Ila]

She was one of the kids in the lesson I watched yesterday. The trainer's "kick kick kick" approach pushes the horse onto his forehand in the canter (and being a big maxi cob, he's on his forehand anyway), so that does them no favours. Nor does careening around counterbent on the inside shoulder.

I did not see the part where the horse decided he was done, downed his tools, and sent his rider flying into the middle of a fence. Luckily, she had a body protector on. It's her third fall in a week. Definitely need to talk to mom as soon as I can, before she gets hurt. Everyone else thinks the horse is "being naughty." They are a lovely family and they care deeply for their horse - the knowledge just isn't there in the people surrounding them, including the pros.

My PRE has springs for legs and I can see that she will jump with ease when she's old enough. My Highland is heavy. He's solid and can scramble up or down vertical slopes with ease, but jumping would be bloody hard on his joints. I don't have any great desire to ask it of him.

 

[abbijay]

Heavy cobs are long slow developers. I'm a big fan of "Cobs Can" however the idea that a 7yo was jumping BE100s screams that his body has been put under pressure it isn't designed to deal with - certainly not while still maturing! On this basis alone I would be going to vet check as my first assumption.
The other thing is going from (I presume) an experienced home to a first horse family it might be worth throwing a decent jockey on board and see if it still stops. HAs it just learnt this new trick that if I chuck the rider off I get away with an easy life?

 

[Caol Ila]

If they rule out pain and arthritic changes and the like, could PSSM be a possibility? Is that something you see in coloured cobs? Horse doesn't tie-up or have muscle tremors, but I did read a thing suggesting that in mild cases, it presents as vague "poor performance."

 

[ihatework]

I presume the owners are happy with you discussing their horses performance over the Internet?
Only it’s getting less generic and more specific.

 

[SEL]

If they rule out pain and arthritic changes and the like, could PSSM be a possibility? Is that something you see in coloured cobs? Horse doesn't tie-up or have muscle tremors, but I did read a thing suggesting that in mild cases, it presents as vague "poor performance."

If it was PSSM positive (& likely type 1 in a heavy) it would have shown up before now IMO. If this horse was jumping those heights before the change of rider then it's either the rider who is the problem or pain. Ringbone / sidebone / hocks can all be issues early on with cobs purely because of their build.

 

[Caol Ila]

Okay, cool.

I just don't want to freak people out by suggesting it could be something it's unlikely to have. Not even the vets seem totally clued up on PSSM. I've only learned about it on here, and somebody else I know - a friend still in the US - had their horse tested (positive, unfortunately) after they brought it up to their vet. Vet had been scratching their head about said horse until owner mentioned it.

It's just another bloody thing to be paranoid about, isn't it? Especially when a horse is a bit NQR. Hope it's not in PREs and Highlands.

I guess the soundest horse you can buy is a Breyer.

 

[MuddyMonster]

I presume the owners are happy with you discussing their horses performance over the Internet?
Only it’s getting less generic and more specific.

I was wondering the same.

I don't think I'd be that impressed if I found another livery discussing my horse with strangers on the internet (especially regarding potential, unconfirmed veterinary issues) to pass on second or third hand 'help'. Although I appreciate the intentions are probably well intended.

 

[Caol Ila]

You are probably right. I might edit so it's very general.

 

[maya2008]

Other random thoughts
- does the saddle fit? Is the saddler trustworthy?
- Hock arthritis? The few ‘slow’ youngish ponies I have known have had hock arthritis. It’s one thing to be laid back (our cob x is) and quite another not to be able to keep up with the rest of the ride.

Pssm shows up younger than this, at age 3 my pony had signs. It can be aggravated by dropping down a level in terms of work, but all the pssm ponies/horses I have known have kept up with the ride out hacking.

 

[Caol Ila]

Can’t delete stuff that’s more than a day old. I sometimes get ahead of myself when I don’t want to see someone get hurt and just wanted to be sure I was offering the best suggestions. Happy to talk out of my a*se when it’s about dressage or other types of training, but jumping has never been a focus of mine, and there’s such a strong culture around here of assuming the horse is being cheeky.

Even otherwise excellent trainers jump to cheekiness, instead of giving the horse the benefit of the doubt (see my other thread). That’s the dominant paradigm and there aren’t really any other voices.

 

[BunnyDog]

In prior years I was staunchly 1x a week. This year, on average a jump lesson with my trainer every 5-10 days. Stretched to once every 2 weeks over the summer.

When in competing season, around every 5 days. He's 15, so not a ton of work. Just work on aspects of showing. Usually only 20-40 mins, depending on temps, of actual schooling.

Doing some poles and light cavaletti at home 1 day or so, but not excited about doing much more than that. Lots more work on strength, gallops, fitness and transitions. Much better than jump jump jump. And Cudo was squealing the jump his last couple schools.

Em

 

[SBJT]

Being a complete amateur here. I practice 1x per week at most, sometimes even going a few weeks in between. My horse is trained to jump and knows his job better than me and I’m okay with that. I always got told it’s more about the flat work in between the fences but as a hunter rider in North America, I know that’s a little less liked across the pond.

Not really sure if that helped but answered the question.

 

[MagicMelon]

Im of the sharp and keen camp. I generally rarely jump between competitions and if I do it would be gridwork to improve something rather than just popping round full courses. I might jump a little if its a young horse, but with my now-retired eventer/show jumper I never jumped him in between. I find it successful in avoiding them going stale. Usually mine are thus always keen and happy to jump. Horses get fed up really quickly if over-jumped IMO.

 

[bella0987]

Asking on behalf of a friend. Do I look like I'm jumping any of mine? LOL.

But as the title says.... I have a young friend who had a rough round in a little schooling show on Monday. Horse refused a few fences, and one of the refusals had her hitting the deck. She'd succesfully piloted him around an earlier (lower) class. In the run-up to the show, she practiced over fences several times that week. And not just one fence. Full courses. Today, she's riding in a jumping clinic, I guess hoping to sort out the stopping.

I have never been a part of hunter/jumper-land or competed in jumping disciplines or did anymore than pi$$ about over easy fences when I felt like it. But...back in the US, my friends who were very serious about it did not jump very much between competitions. They said they wanted the horses sharp and keen to jump, not bored of it. When I had easy access to jumps, I did not play with them more than once per week (if that), because I thought too much would be tough on the joints of my draft-X. And my God, she loved jumping! She would take you to the fence and fly.

Young friend and her mum are relatively new to the horse thing. And trainers here don't offer much advice on horsemanship - as Sibelius noted in her update about Sig, it's a lot of "jump, jump, jump." But mum does turn to experienced friends - i.e. me and a few others - for advice. Mine would be that the horse might jump more happily and willingly if they jumped a wee bit less (or that he has some niggling unsoundness, but let's start with Occam's Razor... he may just be becoming a bit ring sour). This isn't my area of expertise, so I was wondering how you guys who showjump or event competitively keep your horses fresh and sound, but make sure they - and you - get the practice in.

jump x2
flat x3/2
hack x1/2