Skinny dog

[skinnydipper]

I would be thinking inflammatory bowel disease especially as you say Metronidazole helped. This was one of the long term medications my last dog was on for lymphocytic plasmacytic IBD, it is anti inflammatory in addition to anti bacterial. It can be used as the sole drug to treat IBD but also in combination with steroids as was the case with my dog. Metronidazole also treats giardia.

I also gave him VSL#3 which is used to treat Crohns and ulcerative colitis in people.

If it is IBD and he is having diarrhoea then endoscopic biopsy is not likely to be helpful (they can't get far enough down). Rather than have surgery to obtain full tissue biopsies from the intestines you could maybe ask for a trial of treatment without biopsy.

IBD can be due to allergy so I would also ask for IgG and IgE food allergen testing. I asked for testing by 2 different labs to cover more foods as labs offer different panels, ie one might test for potato specific allergen and another not.

I hope you are able to access the necessary veterinary expertise in the near future.

 

[cbmcts]

Do you think he could have missed an obstruction?

It's possible but unlikely - to my uneducated thoughts it's more likely that it's IBD and/or infection, maybe ulcers. Not helped by dog being such a sensitive wuss!

Try probiotics for dogs.
one of mine who had a gurgly stomach and weird stools was put on probiotic course for a couple of weeks and really helped sort him out.

Done that - very difficult to get them into him but no real improvement.

 

[cbmcts]

I would be thinking inflammatory bowel disease especially as you say Metronidazole helped. This was one of the long term medications my last dog was on for lymphocytic plasmacytic IBD, it is anti inflammatory in addition to anti bacterial. It can be used as the sole drug to treat IBD but also in combination with steroids as was the case with my dog. Metronidazole also treats giardia.

I also gave him VSL#3 which is used to treat Crohns and ulcerative colitis in people.

If it is IBD and he is having diarrhoea then endoscopic biopsy is not likely to be helpful (they can't get far enough down). Rather than have surgery to obtain full tissue biopsies from the intestines you could maybe ask for a trial of treatment without biopsy.

IBD can be due to allergy so I would also ask for IgG and IgE food allergen testing. I asked for testing by 2 different labs to cover more foods as labs offer different panels, ie one might test for potato specific allergen and another not.

I hope you are able to access the necessary veterinary expertise in the near future.

I think the same but the improvement on Metronidazole was enough to say it was definitely that. With the referral the vet wants to do the full Monty in scans, endoscope as it is likely to be the only appointment available for some time due t lockdown. There's also the consideration that while he's so weak that avoiding repeated GAs is a good idea.

 

[skinnydipper]

I think the same but the improvement on Metronidazole was enough to say it was definitely that. With the referral the vet wants to do the full Monty in scans, endoscope as it is likely to be the only appointment available for some time due t lockdown. There's also the consideration that while he's so weak that avoiding repeated GAs is a good idea.

Just to give you some hope if it is IBD. After a prolonged course (months) it was possible to tail off and stop his Metronidazole and his steroid gradually reduced to a very low dose, he was due to stop it completely.

He was PTS for something unrelated to his gut which couldn't be sorted.

 

[satinbaze]

If a dog is reluctant to eat I always try tinned chappie (original) mixed with some warm water. The heat helps to release the smell and simulates the appetite. This worked when my friends spaniel went completely off his food due to an auto immune problem and a lesion on his face. She spread it on a lick mat so he didn't have to chew which obviously caused him pain. He is fully recovered now.

 

[cbmcts]

Well, the past few days have been a bit of a rollercoaster. The dog was referred as an urgent case to a specialist for scans who then also rexrayed yesterday. The results of that were frightening - mega colon, possibly a mass, possibly an intussusception which is when a part of the intestine telescopes or folds in on itself. There was also something showing on the spleen and enlarged lymph nodes. We had a big discussion about PTS yesterday but decided to go for exploratory surgery today, knowing that it was very likely that he wouldn't be brought round from the GA.

The surgery found that he did had the telescoped gut, a section of which was completely dead and a small growth on his spleen. Originally decided just to remove the intestine and resect and take biopsies of the lymph nodes and spleen as he was struggling with the GA but the vets called me back 2 hours later and said that since they'd stabilised his breathing could they remove the spleen too? So I said yes. He was in surgery for over 5 hours and has just come round now, not out of the woods yet due to infection and and the possibility that the enlarged lymph nodes are lymphoma. That's game over. The one thing that they reassured me about is that if he recovers he will have a good quality of life.

So if I could have all your vibes please for MacyMoo who until very recently spent his life with a lump of chain as his collar, on his own in a yard, both me and him would really appreciate it.

 

[skinnydipper]

Well, the past few days have been a bit of a rollercoaster. The dog was referred as an urgent case to a specialist for scans who then also rexrayed yesterday. The results of that were frightening - mega colon, possibly a mass, possibly an intussusception which is when a part of the intestine telescopes or folds in on itself. There was also something showing on the spleen and enlarged lymph nodes. We had a big discussion about PTS yesterday but decided to go for exploratory surgery today, knowing that it was very likely that he wouldn't be brought round from the GA.

The surgery found that he did had the telescoped gut, a section of which was completely dead and a small growth on his spleen. Originally decided just to remove the intestine and resect and take biopsies of the lymph nodes and spleen as he was struggling with the GA but the vets called me back 2 hours later and said that since they'd stabilised his breathing could they remove the spleen too? So I said yes. He was in surgery for over 5 hours and has just come round now, not out of the woods yet due to infection and and the possibility that the enlarged lymph nodes are lymphoma. That's game over. The one thing that they reassured me about is that if he recovers he will have a good quality of life.

So if I could have all your vibes please for MacyMoo who until very recently spent his life with a lump of chain as his collar, on his own in a yard, both me and him would really appreciate it.

I am so sorry to hear that, cbmcts. I hope he pulls through and enjoys the rest of his life with you, knowing that he is loved and cherished.

 

[AmyMay]

Sending all the vibes in the world xxxx

 

[Cinnamontoast]

Sending as many vibes as you can cope with. Are they doing labs on the lumps? Or were they sure already?

 

[Jeni the dragon]

Loads of vibes for you and your boy.

 

[cbmcts]

Sending as many vibes as you can cope with. Are they doing labs on the lumps? Or were they sure already?

They are, been sent by courier tonight. They wanted to remove the spleen today as if that biopsy came back as malignant they would have to operate quickly before it spread due to where it is. And of course, that would be really hard on him after major surgery today. .

 

[Cinnamontoast]

I hope you get good results.

 

[SashaBabe]

My first German Shepherd (a very skinny rescue) had a twisted gut when she was 7 years old. She had a couple of other problems and the vet decided, during the operation to fix her gut, that her spleen should be removed. I'm happy to say that she lived to 13. Sending mega vibes for your boy.

 

[{97702}]

Deleted

I’m sorry CBMCTS, I genuinely and honestly didn’t write this to be horrible or unsupportive - it spilled out without me thinking. I don’t know whether you will have read it or not, if so - it is only ONE experience and your own may be very very different.

Mine was in 2008 and I remember it like it was yesterday. It hurts so much still.

 

[fankino04]

Sending lots of vibes and hugs x

 

[PurBee]

Sorry to hear the update, at least these findings answer why he was soooo off food. Well done for keep enquiring and getting results. Itll be a long road of healing but will feel much better Now he can digest.

As a note of encouragement regarding lymphoma, my white, black spotted parsons jack russel X staffy developed lymphomas suddenly during winter 2012, age 7....now 8 yrs later he’s still around, running about the farm like a lunatic, although he’s older and exceptional for his age of 15, and has always had multiple lymphomas, the vet advised too many to practically treat so see how he goes. He’s still going!
In 2012 i googled others experience with lymphoma and many said their dogs lasted a couple of years, some up to 5yrs, so im shocked yet pleased he’s doing so well 8 yrs on.

 

[cbmcts]

Deleted

I’m sorry CBMCTS, I genuinely and honestly didn’t write this to be horrible or unsupportive - it spilled out without me thinking. I don’t know whether you will have read it or not, if so - it is only ONE experience and your own may be very very different.

Mine was in 2008 and I remember it like it was yesterday. It hurts so much still.

Don't worry Levrier

I didn't read it but I'm guessing that it was something similar that didn't end well?I'm very, very aware that this could well be the case here and I did think very hard before giving the vets the go ahead to operate - was it fair to prolong his suffering for a relatively low chance of success? There are many dogs where I would have said 'No, let them go, they've had a good life' but this one hasn't yet if that makes sense? This house is the first one he's been allowed into, it's only this year that he's met and played with other dogs ot toys, sat on a sofa, had people around that he can seek affection from...he hasn't had a good life to date so, in my head deserves a chance. It also helps that I know my vet has answered honestly when I asked if this was their dog, would you do this surgery? They said yes and also pointed out that his sterling temperament would help too. I also know that they will do everything required to keep him comfortable and pain free - last night the nurse hand fed him her dinner to get food down him when he wouldn't eat anything else, they are fantastic in their care, A friend said tonight that the splenic tumour wouldn't have been spotted so early without the surgery and that could easily have spread before it was noticed.

Even so there is a very good chance that this will not be a happy ending and while more hopeful than I was yesterday, we're nowhere near over this yet.

 

[cbmcts]

 

[cbmcts]

 

[SashaBabe]

Fingers and toes crossed for a happy outcome. He certainly deserves it. x

 

[Pearlsasinger]

Sending as many vibes as you can both cope with. I would have made the same decision as you , for exactly the same reason. If the vet has got rid of the spleen he should have a decent chance. He is a lovely looking dog.

 

[Pointless1]

Really hope he pulls through. it sounds like he really deserves a break.
Fingers and toes crossed.

 

[splashgirl45]

at least you have a diagnosis so there is a chance he could have a decent life, i understand why you have gone ahead, i would have as well just so he has a chance. fingers and toes crossed for a good outcome but if not remember he has had love and time away from a chain.xx

 

[{97702}]

Yes I lost my beloved lurcher to lymphoma of the gut in 2008 - so much of what you are saying is so familiar even after all these years ? In his case when the vet finally operated he said the whole gut was massively inflamed, so a ‘best case’ outcome was chronic IBS and ‘worst case’ was lymphoma- I didn’t wait for my boy to come round from the anaesthetic, I had him PTS with me there while he was still half under.

The vet took biopsies which proved to be positive, but even if they hadn’t been I would never have regretted my decision - for that dog, IBS was a horrible experience and he hated being dirty in the house which he couldn’t help at times.

Even after 12 years my hatred of the vet who treated him is amazingly strong - I kept taking my poor dog back saying ‘he isn’t right, DO something!’ but he prevaricated and messed around for what seemed like ages before he scanned then operated. He never touched any of my dogs ever again, I’ll never forgive him for not acting sooner ???

 

[Moobli]

I will keep everything firmly crossed and send positive vibes for your lovely boy.

 

[cbmcts]

Thanks all - vibes much appreciated.

He's still with us, not as good as could be though. White blood cell count a bit higher than the vet would like, very dozy and refusing food. Also diarrhea But he is getting up and down himself and I've delivered warm roast chicken, cat food, raw tripe and Lidl pate dog food for them to try and tempt him. He'll be tube feed if needed to get his proteins up and hopefully the antibiotics will kick in too.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

Thanks all - vibes much appreciated.

He's still with us, not as good as could be though. White blood cell count a bit higher than the vet would like, very dozy and refusing food. Also diarrhea But he is getting up and down himself and I've delivered warm roast chicken, cat food, raw tripe and Lidl pate dog food for them to try and tempt him. He'll be tube feed if needed to get his proteins up and hopefully the antibiotics will kick in too.

Sending more pro-Rottweiler vibes.

 

[SashaBabe]

Fingers crossed he will feel better tomorrow. It's bound to take a few days to get over the anaesthetic. Sending more get well soon vibes x

 

[splashgirl45]

more vibes coming your way. fingers crossed x

 

[silv]

Here's hoping for a positive outcome. He deserves a lovely life with you after having such a miserable existence for so many years. Good for you for caring so much too. Best wishes to you both.