Slight anaemia

[keepitugly]

Just had bloods run on my horse as he was a bit lethargic and they've come back as slightly anaemic. I think she said his level was 29 and it's meant to be 34. She also said one of his enzymes was a bit high, it was one to do with damaged red blood cells, but the rest normal.

She thinks he's a had a bit of a virus and has said to put on red cell for a month.

But I've been researching and I have seen several people saying that it could actually be a copper deficieny and iron overload and it can be dangerous to feed more iron.

Any advice please? I'm confused as to what to do.

 

[shergar]

As far as I know Anaemia is always secondary to some other problem,ulcers worms ect did your vet mention this to you, my friends horse had anaemia due to a heavy infestation of tape worm ,I do not recall a virus ever being the cause of anaemia.
Have a word with the vet again with regard the cause of the anaemia,I would blood test for encysted red worm and tape worm,to be sure this is not the cause .

 

[keepitugly]

She didn't actually say anemaic she just said slightly low red blood cell count and to give him red cell which I don't want to do after what I've been reading.

I'm going to ring again to discuss it on Monday now I'm more informed. My vet nurse friend also mentioned that she would discard the results as I had them done when he was feeling wiped out with the heat (hence the vet visit) and to have him retested while he's feeling normal then go from there.

I keep reading time and again about copper deficiency being a more likely cause.

He had a worm count done recently and I really don't suspect ulcers (have a lot of experience with them unfortunately), his count really was only slightly low so I think I'll ask her to retake bloods and see.

 

[be positive]

The advice given by your friend seems rather odd, you got the vet as your horse was lethargic and the bloods show a reason for the lethargy, even a minor reduction in red blood cell production could be enough to cause the lethargy, a "normal" horse will not be wiped out by a bit of warm weather and the bloods are showing a reason for it, he may well right himself if he is getting over a virus but to suggest it is just due to the weather seems bad advice in my view.

A worm count will not show encysted red worm or tapeworm.

 

[pootleperkin]

If he has had a virus, could well be run down and have a slightly lowered red blood cell count. Mine was the same last year after a lot of spring colds, just on the verge of 'anaemia' and I did, indeed, give him red cell on the advice of my vet. He was recovered after a week or two of rest; it was most likely that that completed his recovery rather than the red cell (which also contains copper I believe), but who knows.

If in doubt, check with your vet again, but if you generally trust your vet, then I would go with their advice over what you read and infer on the net - they are trained for such things you know

If you get bloods done again, it's likely if you have been resting him and he has recovered from whatever virus he had, his bloods will be better, but a tonic such as red cell might well still be beneficial as a general vitamin and mineral supplement.

 

[Leo Walker]

I wish I could remember the details, but copper and zinc are very important with regards to iron. Forage and grazing in the UK is very high in iron, to the point a "normal" horse wont be deficient unless there is an issue. I wont feed mine anything with iron in and feed a supplement with high levels of copper and zinc. I'm shattered and on my way to bed, but if I remember I'll do a bit of digging and get you the info tomorrow, if I dont give me a nudge via PM

 

[wish upon a star]

Mine was slightly anaemic and had some high enzymes and it was because of a worm burden that had been missed by a wormer that I'd done a couple of weeks before, possibly the encysted red worms that migrated after the wormer as when they are encysted they are dormant so don't take up the wormer. Could be something like that. I used Propell after worming and it came right.

 

[keepitugly]

Thanks I don't want to just feed iron as it can be damaging when they are not deficient, which is highly unlikely given the amount of iron in everything.

It's not really about trusting the vet or not, vets can be wrong and from the veterinary research and information from very experienced people I have read it is very unlikely to be an iron deficiency and it can be damaging to feed more iron.

He was showing no clinical signs when she saw him, I just thought he was a bit off that day, he was laid out in 30 degree heat, I'd be feeling wiped out too, I was concerned about heat stroke so I wanted him looked at. She wasn't particularly bothered about taking blood from him, she asked me if I wanted her to and I said might as well while you're here.

That's interesting about the worms, I'll ask.

 

[flaxen]

I would investigate why hes anaemic if he was mine. Following what seemed at the time a low level fall in october and my ponys behaviour changing ( only 1 knew something was wrong- to everyone else he was a normal welsh pony ) i ran bloods on him which showed he was anaemic, not hugely but enough and had slightly raised muscle enzymes, repeated them 2 wks later which showed minimal improvement in the anaemia but improved muscle enzymes which was a month after his fall ( we thought he had torn a muscle ) 2 weeks later having ruled out ulcers he had a ct scan ( 6wks post fall ) which showed he had a major fracture at the base of his skull and a substantial bleed at the back of his brain- this was still evident on his scan and had he had the bleed anywhere else it wouldnt have mattered but in his case it was where it was that was the issue. Despite trying everything my ponys injury proved fatal.

I guess what im trying to say is there has to be a reason for whats wrong with him you just need to find it. Not one of the vets involved were expecting to find what we found any my pony made veterinary history just by surviving the fall and walking normally as the injury he had is usually fatal at the time and his specialist told me then my pony was in big trouble and in his opinion and experience ( world renowned professor ) my pony would die. He was very much right and even made the call to the insurance himself.

 

[keepitugly]

That's horrendous flaxen I am so sorry to hear that.

I'm just waiting for the vet to phone me back.

 

[Amicus]

Is anyone suggesting you supplement with iron OP? (Horses on grass are never iron deficient in the UK as our soils packed with it)

If your worried about copper deficiency you could test your grazing/forage and supplement accordingly. Otherwise or as a stop gap you could start feeding a good mineral supplement probalance or equivita maybe which will supply a daily maintenance quantity of copper as well as other essentials.

on the other hand vet may be right and could simple be a virus that's knocked him back a bit but sorting out minerals will never do any harm.

 

[pootleperkin]

Is anyone suggesting you supplement with iron OP? (Horses on grass are never iron deficient in the UK as our soils packed with it)

This. Red cell isn't an iron supplement per se, its a multivit / mineral supplement essentially for horses in work - it is advertised as containing iron in particular, as iron is a limiting factor for the production of more haemoglobin and thus is advantageous for when you want fitness to improve. That's why lots of competition people use it. Aside from improving performance (and not all people think it works), vets often say to use it as a 'pick me up', particularly after a virus etc, not as a stand alone 'iron supplement'.

 

[keepitugly]

He's already on forage plus minerals daily which is why I'm not keen to feed him anything as a pick me up as it is such a high spec supplement already, he shouldn't really need anything else so I'd like to get to the bottom of the cause.

Red cell does have a high iron content, which isn't something that I want to feed in excess as it can be damaging.

I've spoken to another vet at the practise this morning, (other vet unavailable), he basically said not to worry as there can be so many variables and reasons and we'll retest him in a few weeks and see if they've picked up. He didn't think much to the possibility of encysted red worm as he said the bloods usually show high protein levels if this was the case? Also horse looks very well, no symptoms to anything so we're just going to see. He did say that sometimes red blood cells can clump together so you can get a false reading which has happened to him a few times before.

I've also spoken to the lady at forage plus who is happy to show the results to their vet and see if they can help with any mineral imbalances etc.

 

[Silverfire]

This is quite interesting to read about Anemia in horses:
http://www.succeed-equine.com/succe...a-horses-part-3-signs-symptoms-anemia-horses/

 

[brucea]

internal haemorrhage has to be rulled out in all cases of anaemia.

May be worth having a chat with Sarah Braithwaite about this.