So I am sat at work wondering...

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HaffiesRock

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What each aspect of a bit does?

May sound like a stupid question, but what is the difference (to the horse) of a loose ring over egg butt for example?

I have tried a few bits on my newly broken mare and so far have found the straight bar loose ring happy mouth to be the best for her. She could do with a slightly bigger bit, so my question really is do I get the same bit again as I know she finds it comfortable, or try a variation?

What difference will egg butt make over loose ring?

What difference will different joints make, lozenge etc?
What difference will cheeks make?

I ride in the school in a rope halter but don’t want to use this for hacking in case it invalidates my insurance. I tried a bit less bridle and she HATED it!
I want to keep it as simple as possible, but was more wondering what other snaffle options are available and what they are used for?

Id like to learn more about bits in general and have no desire to change what is already working. Just like some options for the future (We are only hacking in walk currently)

Thanks
 
Also just thought, what about nose band? What does that add? I rode her without last night and she went better. Current combo is no noseband and the happy mouth straight bar loose ring. The less faff the better!
 
http://www.sustainabledressage.net/tack/bridle.php

Enjoy. :D

RE nosebands

Imagine that a horse and rider come galloping across a field. In the middle of the field there is a huge log tied stuck between two trees. They are to jump this natural obstacle. The horse slips on take-off and does not manage to get the forelegs over the log, so he and the rider stoops over and down on the other side. Now, horsey has a noseband on, and even though his rider has lost all control, and is pulling on the reins with his whole weight to keep his balance, horsey cannot gape open. Such luck! Because on impact, the nose is first and it takes a real blow, but then the neck bends to the side and the horse rolls over on the side. The rider is somewhere in orbit.


The lower jaw digs into the dirt like a shovel.If the noseband had not been there, the horse might have hit the ground with its mouth wide open, and dug the dirt like a shovel. The risk is high that the weakest part may have given in, and the horse have broken its jaw, instead of just jarred his whole head before rolling over to the side. This was actually not uncommon in the times of Udu Bürger, as he relates in his book "The Way to Perfect Horsemanship".
Click to expand...

It's totally true, the plain cavesson noseband was invented to prevent broken jaws. :)
 
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Joints on the bit generally make it slightly softer for a horse for example a french link has a flat middle section so is good for horses that have a big fleshy tongue so it doesn't take up so much room in their mouth as a normal jointed snaffle would if it flexes. A losenge works in the same way its a slightly softer alternative to just a jointed snaffle as some horses don't like the nutcracker effect it can have on the roof of their mouth.

Loose rings and eggbutt are just the parts on the side and doesn't majorly affect the horse but loose rings can ocassionally pinch as the bit slides around the ring the eggbutt is fixed so it eliminates the pinching i prefer eggbutt personally but neither one is more or less harsh than the other, you can get fulmers or otherwise known as full cheeks which have long arms on the side that can aid directional aids however this again doesn't make it any harsh or soft - the link or joint in the bit is what makes it strong or not and then depends on the type ie. gag or pelham etc as to how strong and what effect it has on the horse- personally if i was you and knowing how difficult it can be to find a bit that works on a fussy horse i'd just stick to the same bit but get a larger size - hope this helps - its only a very brief description.
 
Tammytoo said:
Even after 50 years, you learn something new about horses'tack/riding every day!
Click to expand...

I was really shocked when I first read it. It had never occured to me that broken jaws were a possibility in a nose first horse fall. Then I thought about it and it does make sense.
 
Faracat said:
I was really shocked when I first read it. It had never occured to me that broken jaws were a possibility in a nose first horse fall. Then I thought about it and it does make sense.
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Really, this is beyond comprehension, so a 500kg horse hitting the ground at 30kmph, will be saved from catastrophic injury by a leather strap which is hardly strong enough to hold up a pair of jeans!!! Do the maths.
 
StormyGale said:
Loose rings and eggbutt are just the parts on the side and doesn't majorly affect the horse but loose rings can ocassionally pinch as the bit slides around the ring the eggbutt is fixed so it eliminates the pinching i prefer eggbutt personally but neither one is more or less harsh than the other
Click to expand...

I find mine tend to lean more on an eggbutt so I use a loose ring with rubbers on, they prefer the extra movement of a loose ring. This is really just another preference thing, there isn't a lot of difference between the two. Depends on the horse and the rider.
 
Miss L Toe said:
Really, this is beyond comprehension, so a 500kg horse hitting the ground at 30kmph, will be saved from catastrophic injury by a leather strap which is hardly strong enough to hold up a pair of jeans!!! Do the maths.
Click to expand...

I'd tend to agree with this.

According to wikipedia the cavesson or noseband was developed before bits:-


"A noseband may have been one of the first tools used by humans to domesticate and ride horses. The bit developed later.

The noseband was originally made of leather or rope. After the invention of the bit, the noseband was, in some cultures, demoted to a halter worn beneath the bridle that allowed the rider to remove the bit from the horse's mouth after work and leave a restraining halter on underneath, or to tie the horse by this halter, instead of by the bit, which could result in damage to the horse's mouth if it panicked. However, its ability to hold a horse's mouth shut over the bit was also recognized, as was its usefulness for attaching equipment such as a martingale, and so in some traditions it was sometimes left as a working part of a bridle. Still other cultures, such as that of Ancient Persia, developed the noseband as a tool for training young horses, called a hakma, and this training noseband evolved into modern equipment such as today's bosal-style hackamore and Longeing cavesson."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noseband


As it says on there, many of the old hunting pictures show horses without nosebands, I'd expect they would have used them if they were developed for preventing fractured jaws.
 
Miss L Toe said:
Really, this is beyond comprehension, so a 500kg horse hitting the ground at 30kmph, will be saved from catastrophic injury by a leather strap which is hardly strong enough to hold up a pair of jeans!!! Do the maths.
Click to expand...

Because the lower jaw is strapped to the stronger upper jaw (with a leather strap ;) ) the lower jaw never 'spades' into the ground, the whole head turns as the horse lands IYSWIM.

If you look at head first horse landings in horse falls at XC comps how many broke their jaws? None that I've heard of. It was apparently a well known fracture/injury (in that type of fall) before the cavesson was invented.

So it works and was invented for this purpose, regardless of whether you believe it or not. :p
 
StormyGale said:
Joints on the bit generally make it slightly softer for a horse for example a french link has a flat middle section so is good for horses that have a big fleshy tongue so it doesn't take up so much room in their mouth as a normal jointed snaffle would if it flexes. A losenge works in the same way its a slightly softer alternative to just a jointed snaffle as some horses don't like the nutcracker effect it can have on the roof of their mouth.

Loose rings and eggbutt are just the parts on the side and doesn't majorly affect the horse but loose rings can ocassionally pinch as the bit slides around the ring the eggbutt is fixed so it eliminates the pinching i prefer eggbutt personally but neither one is more or less harsh than the other, you can get fulmers or otherwise known as full cheeks which have long arms on the side that can aid directional aids however this again doesn't make it any harsh or soft - the link or joint in the bit is what makes it strong or not and then depends on the type ie. gag or pelham etc as to how strong and what effect it has on the horse- personally if i was you and knowing how difficult it can be to find a bit that works on a fussy horse i'd just stick to the same bit but get a larger size - hope this helps - its only a very brief description.
Click to expand...

Kind of but not quite......

Have a read of the sustainable dressage link for better understanding.

Full cheeks and fulmers aren't the same, although they are similar. As well as providing directional aids they can also stabilise the bit in the mouth and provide a sort of mild gag action when used with keepers.

Eggbutt and loose rings do make a difference to the horse, it has an effect on the stability and movement of the bit in response to the rein aid. A horse that can be a bit heavy in the hand or who doesn't mouth the bit can be helped by a loose ring.

Joints, and whether a jointed bit is kinder or not and they type of joint used depends mainly on the conformation of the horse's mouth and where they respond to pressure best. But you are right about a double joint giving relief from the nutcracker action.
 
Faracat said:
Because the lower jaw is strapped to the stronger upper jaw (with a leather strap ;) ) the lower jaw never 'spades' into the ground, the whole head turns as the horse lands IYSWIM.

If you look at head first horse landings in horse falls at XC comps how many broke their jaws? None that I've heard of. It was apparently a well known fracture/injury (in that type of fall) before the cavesson was invented.

So it works and was invented for this purpose, regardless of whether you believe it or not. :p
Click to expand...

Hmm, another reason for its invention that I've heard about (and just remembered) is for when the cavalry were training new recruits and the horses wore strong curb bits the noseband prevented the jaw fracturing from overuse of the curb.
 
Kat said:
Kind of but not quite......

Have a read of the sustainable dressage link for better understanding.

Full cheeks and fulmers aren't the same, although they are similar. As well as providing directional aids they can also stabilise the bit in the mouth and provide a sort of mild gag action when used with keepers.

Eggbutt and loose rings do make a difference to the horse, it has an effect on the stability and movement of the bit in response to the rein aid. A horse that can be a bit heavy in the hand or who doesn't mouth the bit can be helped by a loose ring.

Joints, and whether a jointed bit is kinder or not and they type of joint used depends mainly on the conformation of the horse's mouth and where they respond to pressure best. But you are right about a double joint giving relief from the nutcracker action.
Click to expand...


I know what your saying Kat sorry i probably wasn't very specific in wording it properly but basically trying to say what you said in leymans terms lol sorry i wasn't going into the real detail of all the different types was just trying to give a brief quick description as i was trying to not bore everyone lol :confused: but thanks for that brain is slowly shutting down today ha ha
 
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