So sad, another death

[DressageCob]

XL bullies are basically pitbulls. most of their DNA comes from pitbulls. They were then bred to bigger breeds to create the XL element, and had English bulldogs and others bred in for the frog like structure. If we are banning breeds, I don't see why something that is mainly pitbull is ok.

 

[Birker2020]

Sorry, can't do links but sadly a 34 year old man has been attacked and killed in a park in Hampshire whilst out walking his dog. The out of control dog who savaged him belonged to a 20 year old with it seems, no connection to the dead man. The dog has been siezed by police (and hopefully destroyed).

I hope the attacking dog's owner gets a custodial sentence which reflects the enormity of the crime, surely manslaughter would be appropriate.

I saw this, thought how terrifying it must have been for him.

 

[CorvusCorax]

I am urging everyone to go back and read Meleeka's post about the man who died in the park, the facts have not been established yet.

 

[Birker2020]

I'm not sure it had to be so aggressively written but fair enough, every days a school day

I think its called a Dudley nose and is more common in pitbulls.

 

[Birker2020]

I am urging everyone to go back and read Meleeka's post about the man who died in the park, the facts have not been established yet.

deleted

 

[DressageCob]

I vaguely think I have read somewhere that a pink/coloured nose as opposed to a black one indicates some pit bull in the mix - I don't know how correct that is though. The thing is that the measurement basis would only work on a 100% pit, not a mix as this dog is much bigger looking to me than the pitbulls I have seen which are more 'tall staffy' in stature.

In the US they like to describe pitbulls as blue nose or red nose. They can have black noses, but more importantly, the red nose has effectively been bred out of staffies so a dog that looks like it's in that family is more likely than not to be a pitbull.

 

[Red-1]

Not a death, but I feel for the dogs in this case. Seems they were caught up in a melee not of their making but presumably are now in danger of PTS...

Ilkeston: Dog mauls mother and two children and 'owner is arrested' | Metro News

 

[scats]

I groom the most beautiful XL bully. I met him at 4 months and he was already nearly 5 stone. He is a beautiful, friendly dog but my god is he powerful.
I can see how a child wouldn’t stand a chance if one of those attacked.

 

[skinnydipper]

Isn't it sadly a "thing" that dogs have been known to attack people who are having fits or seizures?

It is thought to be due to predatory drift.

A bit more about predatory drift here for anyone interested in dog behaviour:

"Predatory drift occurs when a dog gets aroused by a high pitch sound or the energetic struggles and frenetic behaviour of an animal or even a person in distress."

https://www.dogbitesolicitors.co.uk/news/the-danger-of-predatory-drift


"Predatory drift is considered basically a return to the original and ancient predatory sequence. In behavioral terms, it's a hard-wired, modal-action-pattern. Basically, once a trigger starts the behavior, it needs to go to completion. In simple terms, it's predatory drive in its purest form, not to be confused with aggression. While the term “instinctive drift” was first coined in 1961 by Breland and Breland, the term "predatory drift" was coined years later by veterinarian, behaviorist, and dog trainer Dr. Ian Dunbar."

https://pethelpful.com/dogs/Dog-Behavior-Understanding-Predatory-Drift


"Predatory drift is a glitch in a dog's prey drive that causes a dog to display predatory behaviour. The dog tries to stop an agitated, squirming, squealing, running thing from moving and, unfortunately, this involves using its mouth and teeth.

Dogs can display predatory drift towards anything: cats, squirrels, rabbits, chickens, etc. But for the sake of simplicity, I will keep the discussion to dog-versus-dog interactions."

https://www.nsnews.com/living/control-your-dogs-predatory-instincts-2997490

 

[Nasicus]

I believe they now have the ability to DNA test (Embark and the like), so identifying the breed should be a cinch.

 

[Birker2020]

I believe they now have the ability to DNA test (Embark and the like), so identifying the breed should be a cinch.

Maybe this will help all the dogs currently sat on death row which are costing tax payers a ridiculous amount of money, some have been kennelled for three or four years waiting to find out what their fate will be. How this is acceptable is beyond me. Just to clarify these aren't dogs that have attacked people, these are dogs that look like 'banned' breeds.

There are so many have been ruled to be not of the type that is prohibited. Given that a dogs life is so short anyway compared to humans when they have sat in cages for three or four years and then released after being found 'not of a prohibited breed' I wonder how this would affect them mentally?? Rather like long stayers in prison being released. It must be a huge upheaval for them. I wonder if they have to go through a temperament test after all that time or is the judge's ruling sufficient and that's it they are released? I think that is more dangerous than locking them up for the original reason.

EDITED TO SAY:

I think if I had a dog that I thought would have to be more than a few weeks at a kennels (and could potentially be one, two or three or more years) then I would request it was pts, but then I suppose the decision would be out of my hands. Its cruel and not necessary.

Its time this 'death row' situation is eradicated. It is truly horrific for dogs, owners and kennel staff alike.

 

[CorvusCorax]

I believe they now have the ability to DNA test (Embark and the like), so identifying the breed should be a cinch.

There has to be a quality existing database to test against, for it to be effective.
(Coming from a breed where DNA testing is the norm).
If there was one, it would be being used.
No breed recognition/no breed clubs/no registry/no concrete DNA being held = unreliable results.

I can prove my dog is the dog that his documents say he is, because there are five generations of DNA held, which can be tested against.
That doesn't happen with a lot of other breeds and certainly not in a breed that isn't recognised by a dog breed registry in a country where it is illegal.
It's madness.

 

[Nasicus]

There has to be a quality existing database to test against, for it to be effective.
(Coming from a breed where DNA testing is the norm).
If there was one, it would be being used.
No breed recognition/no breed clubs/no registry/no concrete DNA being held = unreliable results.

I can prove my dog is the dog that his documents say he is, because there are five generations of DNA held, which can be tested against.
That doesn't happen with a lot of other breeds and certainly not in a breed that isn't recognised by a dog breed registry in a country where it is illegal.
It's madness.

I know of a few examples where its been used by a local branch of the RSPCA, even resulting in a dog being PTS for being part pit. Embark seems to have a decent database, but I do get what your saying. It seems to be the best we've got currently though, better than measurements at least.

Edit: Wisdom Panel is the UK version, and does contain APBT within the test, but supposedly the Embark one is more accurate.

 

[CorvusCorax]

If there are (apparently) no proven examples of a pure bred APBT in the UK then I cannot see how it is a reliable measure, unless they are using DNA from foreign dogs.

It's more of an indictment on how dogs are bred and registered in general in the UK. The Kennel Clubs are better than nothing, but without a DNA database, can it be a proper 'registry'?

 

[AShetlandBitMeOnce]

If there are (apparently) no proven examples of a pure bred APBT in the UK then I cannot see how it is a reliable measure, unless they are using DNA from foreign dogs.

You would think that they could import the information from the US where they would hold a lot more Pit DNA

 

[Nasicus]

You would think that they could import the information from the US where they would hold a lot more Pit DNA

That's what I figured they'd do. It wouldn't be 100% accurate by any means, but it's better than nothing.

 

[sarah.oxford]

Out of the last 10 fatal dog attacks in the UK, 5 were XL Bully dogs.

i cannot understand the growing trend for these.
Any dog can be dangerous in the hands of an idiot but I don’t know any “normal” person that requires something resembling a bear living in their house, one of these dogs won’t be far off my weight.

Good grief, I had no idea about that statistic. Someone asked me recently about XL Bullys and I really don't know much.
I have seen some terrible pictures of some Exotic Bullys with dreadful bowed legs and toad like in appearance.

Are these smaller versions of a similar thing?
They don't look like they could even walk very far but the bigger ones are a totally different story.