Some people should just not be on DIY livery..

Sydney - I do sympathize - some people are just plain awful, but you point the finger specifically at diy liveries who work full time. Why do you link this with crashing into your car/running your dog over and/or breaking glass in the hay barn?
One day the people who did these things will be retired. Do you think that this will suddenly transform them into model liveries? Or could it be that they were just rubbish liveries - period - and your logic is away with the fairies?
 
Sydney that's a bit harsh! I've had my horses on DIY for nearlly 10 years now and have worked full time throughout. I spend considerably more than 10 mins per visit and have to be highly organised to keep on top of everything. Most of my friends who are on DIY are also in full time work and they cope just fine too!
 
Some people should not be on DIY & the majority of them should not own a horse as many don'e have sufficient time or knowledge to look after their animals properly.

On the other side of the coin there are some YOs that shouldn't be YOs. They have no idea how to run a business, how to interact with their clients & on many occasions are totally unreasonable in their demands. In some cases I would question their mentality.

I have experienced all of this but am now at a small DIY yard & it is bliss. The YO is a lovely lady, her husband knows nothing about horses but looks after the land & arena beautifully. They have a great partnership & it is a little piece of heaven. It is a small yard with just 5 horses, everyone works but the horses never want for time & attention by anyone.
 
Because the ones that worked full time at my yard were always the same ones driving on to the yard too fast (therefore not noticing my car was parked in a different place, or my dog was running loose), mobile phone still attached to their head, spending a rushed 10 mins doing their horse, then rushing off to their next commitment.....

In contrast the clients that do not work full time have more time to spend with their horses and therefore have a better relationship with them, never let the daily chores slip, and love spending time on the yard. These horse recieve more regular excercise and routine and appear more settled.

I personally wouldn't have a horse on DIY if I worked full time - horses are as much commitment in my eyes as a child, and need constant attention and supervision. I am not saying it is not possible, but would not attempt it myself.

Again I re iterate I am not tarring you all with the same brush, and am sure there are some very organised and committed DIY owners out there who can juggle full time jobs and horses, (especially amongst all you lovely H&H's!), but sadly have yet had one to work out here.
 
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That's really sad for you Sidney, esecially sorry to hear about your dog :(

I work full time (and more sometimes) but always make time for my girl and my friend's pony. I rent my yard from a lovely elderly lady so do literally everything myself. We have electricity and lighting so that obviously makes winter much easier, the paddocks are poo picked every day without fail even if its pitch black and blowing a storm, my friends actually make fun of how organised my barn and tack/feed room are and I have to laugh at a comment a visiting child whispered to her friend, "Oh my god, look how tidy her stables are..."

I think some of us are just better at juggling things, I in fact thrive on it. I'd be bored (and most likely irritated at anyone else that tried to look after my girls in case they didn't live up to my apparant perfectionism) otherwise. I also like to think the fact the horses in my care show that it can be done as they are both well mannered, healthy and happy :)
 
The worst ones are those that work full time???

Some of us don't have the luxury of being retired/a stay at home mum/lady of leisure who can devote the majority of our time to our horse. I really wish I could spend all day at the yard!!

I work full time, on shifts and I have an agreement with my YO as to who does what and when. I try to make it as easy as I can by making up feeds, haynets etc, mucking out once per day and leaving everything out that my horse needs, my YO is fantastic and understands I can't change my shift pattern. I did have him on full livery but felt that I had started to lose that bond I had with him and so went to part livery and now spend more time with him.

It is hard to juggle things, and I get stick at work for not doing 20 hours overtime a week (mostly spent on their iphones) like everyone else in my section but if I had a child to look after maybe that would be different!!

We've just had some people leave the yard who were not working (believed to be on benefits with two horses) and they were the nastiest horsey people I've met. They caused a lot of trouble on the yard and were moved on sharpish.

Sad thing is it doesn't matter what walk of life people come from, whether employed or not, if they don't want to look after their horse properly then they wont.
 
I don't understand this mentality some owners have that you must spend hours everyday with your horse. My horse is just as happy out munching in his field with his friends as he is being ridden, fussed etc. sometimes it's only possible for me to spend 10 mins with him some days. I don't see how this is seen as not looking after him properly. He lives a life of Riley!
 
Sidney said:
I agree - I have had numerous DIY's and the majority have become a problem.

The main reason? Not having enough time to do their horses properly with full time jobs and other commitments, with their horses often being difficult due to lack of routine and excercise, especially come the winter.

This wasn't because they weren't caring owners, but just struggled with the commitment of DIY.

My personal view is that anyone who works full time should keep horses on a minimum of part livery - a 10 min rush up to the yard twice a day around other commitments is just not enough to look after a horse properly.

Sorry if I have offended anyone but just speaking from my personal experiences as a YO!!
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This is just such a load of BS :rolleyes:

I wouldn't put my horse on full livery or even part due to the huge number of know it all YOs who think they know best about everything.

Sound familiar? :p
 
So, let me get this right....because I work full time you would deny me the pleasure of looking after my own horses???
I get as much joy and fulfillment (more sometimes) from taking care of my boys myself than from riding!



Might as well just shoot me now if that rule ever comes into play ;oP
 
I'm amused by the absurd notion that people who work full time are incapable of managing horses on DIY. In my experience, it's the liveries who don't work and who hang around the coffee rooms of DIY yards whose horses do least work and are most problematic (and this is in my limited experience of some yards, not a dismissal of all owners who are fortunate enough not to have to work!). Often people who own horses on DIY while working full time really want to have horses (because you have to, to do all the work) and often have serious competitive aspirations. Thus they make the time to exercise and look after said horse around work, rather than sitting around drinking tea and gossiping :rolleyes:
 
It really is each to their own, but......IMO I cant see the point of spending hundreds (or thousands) on a horse that you want, to get someone else to look after it! Some people do, and thats down to them. i work almost full time, my OH sorts pony in the morning and I go in the evening. I dont break anything (if I do, I own up to it) I try not to make trouble, I dont speed down the drive, I certainly dont run over anyones dog! I hate it the way full liveries are made out to be angels, and diyers are the devil!
 
My boy is on part-livery meaning that he either gets brought in/turned out and fed. I am still up at 5:30am, to turn out & muck him out, before working full-time with an hour's commute each way. Luckily my yard is 5 mins from my house but I think most full-timers are that committed to their horses they are willing to compromise sleep, and get up at the crack of dawn to do their horses.

I love (most of the time!) mucking out and dealing with my boy in the mornings. Then getting to see him at nights and ride him. I would even go as far as saying I am much more organised having to fit a horse in to my daily routine than I was without.

I don't think people who are on full livery or don't work appreciate the commitment us full-timers do to include horses in our lives. My weekends are spend socialising and drinking cups of tea with my fellow liveries - but only once I am mucked out and my boy has been seen to.
 
Yet again another thread that makes me so thankful that we scrimped and saved for all those years, did without any luxuries and certainly couldn't afford horses so that now I can do what the heck I like in my own yard without other people passing judgement.

Actually that's not strictly true, I've had a couple of liveries in the past one of whom was a nightmare and made me feel so unwelcome in my own yard that I used to hide in the house when she came. The other one was a delight to have about, she's vastly superior to me in training and experience but never commented adversely on my routines (or lack of), nor sought to change them.
 
i love my diy livery.
the horse is turned out on 18 acres with a group of mares a gelding and a foal. i pop up in the morning and bring him in for a feed and check. the bloke that owns the place is old school and his horses are a lovely settled group. My horse being very riggish has a whale of a time with his percheron mare and there are no other women there to bother me.
The problem is we all have different ways of going on..my boy slots into my busy lifestyle and takes up varying amount of time depending on the other demands in my life..sometimes he stands in the field for weeks on end and other times we get out and about a few times in a week. He looks a mess but is shockingly healthy and energetic...but on some diy yards he would probably be viewed as neglected..it really is horses for courses!
there are no horsey dudes around to view my shocking riding skills and endless mishaps... or the lipstick on his nose.
 
benson21 said:
It really is each to their own, but......IMO I cant see the point of spending hundreds (or thousands) on a horse that you want, to get someone else to look after it!
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I think there is a lot of point if you work full time and you are fortunate enough to afford it because the time you are not spending filling haynets, mucking out and poo picking is time you can spend grooming, fussing and riding your horse.

In an ideal world I'd spend less money and have time to do it all as I do enjoy the manual side of horse ownership - however as I only have a couple of hours a day I'd rather spend it all with my horse. Despite being on full livery, not being fed by me and only being ridden by me my horse still prefers me to anyone else. This demonstrates to me that doing the manual chores aren't as important for forging a bond with a horse as simply spending quality time with them.

benson21 said:
I hate it the way full liveries are made out to be angels, and diyers are the devil!
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I agree, really don't see the point in making generalizations about DIY liveries or full liveries - there are good owners and there are bad owners. End of.

I can however, see how a neglectful full livery will be less troublesome than a neglectful DIYer from the perspective of a yard owner and fellow liveries.
 
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I don't think it's fair to generalise to say that most of those who work full time, and are on DIY livery don't take care of their horses properly!!

I think this would make up a fairly decent percentage of the horse owning community! After all, owning horses is expensive and we have to work full time to keep them in the manner to which they have become accustomed! :)

From my experience, having been on a number of DIY yards over my years of owning horses, bad owners are bad owners and it doesn't matter if they are full, part of DIY liveries, or stay at home mums, retired people, full-time workers or shoft workers!! I work full-time (more than full-time hours often) and have two horses on DIY livery. But I am lucky in that my fellow liveries are my friends and if something comes up and I'm running late, I know my friends can help me out. Likewise goes for them - they know I'm at the end of the phone if they are delayed and need something doing.

I am also lucky to have a helpful husband who is a dab hand at mucking out, filling nets and doing my neddies!

On a normal weekday, I am at the yard for about 6.30am, do my jobs and away by 7.30am (or 8am if I am riding and change for work at the yard). I am back at the yard for 6pm where I ride or exercise the horses and finish up. It's rare that I leave before 7.30 - later in the summer! (good job I have an understanding husband who likes being at the yard as much as me!)

Sometiems I think I'd love to be on full livery - it would certainly make my life a lot easier, but I like my horses to be done in a certain way and there are very few people I would trust to do it! (with the exception of my ace riding instructor who does mine full livery to cover holidays etc!)

I will say that for inexperienced owners, it's important for those wanting to do DIY, that they find a yard which is suitable and can offer a good level of expertise and support.

The trouble with livery yards, particualry DIY, is that from my experience, the ones who DON'T work full time are often up at the yard all hours, drinking brews and moaning/gossiping about those who aren't there from 8am-5pm! But I think the key with any yard is the people - if it's a pleasant group of people who all get on reasonably well, things run much more smoothly!
 
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Sidney said:
Well I am not tarring you all with the same brush, but as stated before am just saying from my personal experiences.

I won't go too deep into the 'issues' I have had with DIY's, but they include my car being crashed into, my dog being run over, broken glass left in the hay barn, bounced cheques, 'forgotten' appointments for farriers etc when I have been forced to step in....the list could go on! These incidents were all came from clients who worked full time who always appeared disorganised and rushing around the yard.

I still have 2 original DIY's that have been with me for several years - one work's part time and the other is retired, and have never caused me any problems.

Maybe I have just been unlucky with the some of DIY's I have had, but they have left a bad taste in my mouth, and now rent the rest of the stables out instead to one individual, and life is a lot more peaceful.
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have you only had the those problems with DIY's coz they were around more than full liveries?
 
I work full time and I've been on DIY, part DIY and full livery. Not out of choice as that was what was on offer so take it or leave it.
The way I look at it is that regardless of what type of livery they are on, they are my horses and ultimately my responsibility.
They are on full livery at the moment which is a refreshing break for me. That does not mean that I don't see my horses only once or twice a week or only on weekends. I see them every evening after work and sometimes on a morning before I go to work.
Even though everything will be done for me, I sometimes muck them out myself out a weekend and 9 times out of 10 we bring them in ourselves on an evening and feed them as well.
I always make my own arrangements for the farrier, vet or dentist and usually end up being there for some of the other liveries horses as well.

But.... I know what you mean. :rolleyes:
Luckily the yards I have been on the last 10 years have had pretty responsible liveries and a YO with a heart of gold. :):)
 
Sidney said:
My personal view is that anyone who works full time should keep horses on a minimum of part livery - a 10 min rush up to the yard twice a day around other commitments is just not enough to look after a horse properly.

Sorry if I have offended anyone but just speaking from my personal experiences as a YO!!
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Hmm.....I, and I suspect many others.....manage 3 horses ( kept on private rented yard) whilst managing to work full time.

Although I agree...it takes commitment.

Dont get me wrong...if I had just the one I would go part-livery if I could find one that would look after him to my standards, that is.;):)
 
JFTD said:
I'm amused by the absurd notion that people who work full time are incapable of managing horses on DIY. In my experience, it's the liveries who don't work and who hang around the coffee rooms of DIY yards whose horses do least work and are most problematic (and this is in my limited experience of some yards, not a dismissal of all owners who are fortunate enough not to have to work!). Often people who own horses on DIY while working full time really want to have horses (because you have to, to do all the work) and often have serious competitive aspirations. Thus they make the time to exercise and look after said horse around work, rather than sitting around drinking tea and gossiping :rolleyes:
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^^^ This

I have had problems with DIYs in the past (mainly getting full livery a couple of times for free and then expecting it) but I've had worse ones with people on part/full livery, one last year who saw her horse twice in the space of a year (both times Autumn and nothing rugged as still warm (loved last October :D) with a native and we had to pop back into the field after to take a heavyweight of a sweltering horse). Finally convinced her to sell as pony was being absolutely wasted!

In my experience our part/full liveries are not the ones who have sat up with a horse nights in a row, or rush out with a vet the minute there is a problem, rather than asking if it can wait til after the weekend. (No the vet is on his way!)

The DIYers were the ones who knew their horses inside out. And one of the best instructors I was lucky enough to have was on DIY with us, working very long shifts. She'd come up in snow (walking miles some days) when liveries down the road did nothing, she was up the second something was amiss, she'd help on yard jobs and find things to do to help us (very nice to come back to painted jumps looking brand new!) and would take the time out of riding her horse to give me lessons on him as she enjoyed teaching. The younger riders on the yard found it fantastic having someone around who would take time out to give them pointers and confidence to move on with their horses, simply for the reward of doing it.
 
PHEW!!! Took lots of Rescue Remedy, went to the YO and sorted it (for now). I hope. Hubs backed me up (a little more strongly :eek:), bless him. I actually managed to say i haven't enjoyed being at the yard nearly as much since this all started, so that's my position known - although I do love being there if you understand me.

Thanks so much Teasle - I do try, but I do get stressed easily atm ^^ so can be a bit snappy (blush).

For what it's worth, I didn't intend to start a debate on working/diy/full livery as that wasn't my personal issue - though I have a friend with a pony on full livery simply because she works such long hours,she can afford it, although and she laments not being able to get there enough. I just say that her pony is a very lucky lad - he is loved, well cared for, etc, far far from what a lot of horses and ponies in the world have any hope of getting.
 
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Glad you got everything sorted shysmum, nothing worse than an atmosphere at the yard when you are meant to be enjoying your time with your neddies!
 
Apologies again to anyone I offended re my comment on DIY and full time jobs - it was truly not my intent to upset any fellow H & H' ers, and appreciate my lack of tact.

For those that read the part of my post re the problems I have had with DIY's, hopefully can at least understand why I formed this opinion. It is a tough job being a YO, especially when you run it from your home, and after a run of 'bad apples' I ended up rather disillusioned with the whole business.

However I am very lucky now to have a yard of lovely clients, who are fully committed to their horses, whatever contracts they are on, and long may it last.

Shysmum - I am glad you have sorted your issues out.
 
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