Spraying ragwort?

[scats]

After years of battling the stuff, I’m done. We have some money to put into the yard this year which is amazing and this is one of the things on my list. I know nothing about spraying the stuff, could anyone tell me when it can be done and how long horses need to be off the field?

 

[Highmileagecob]

If you spray, it will knock out the diversity in the field, and will only kill emerging plants. Ragwort seeds can survive in the ground for up to twenty years and germinates on disturbed soil - so digging an existing plant up, horses haring round the field, sliding stops etc.. I share your pain. We thought we were getting on top of our ragwort, and then had two or three yearlings arrive who have ripped up the ground charging around, and this year the ragwort is worse than ever. Our pasture has never been sprayed and we are reluctant to start. The best we have found is to cut off the flower heads before seeding, as ragwort dies after flowering, or to drench each plant in salt and vinegar mix. If you really need to spray, Google should be able to answer the questions about timing etc.. You have my sympathy, it's disheartening and overwhelming.

 

[scats]

Thank you. We have 2 paddocks that are just out of control. I spent 8 hours trying to sort the larger one out last year and I didn’t even touch the surface. My back just can’t take it anymore and I don’t really have the time to do it. I get one day off a week that I try to cram things into like housework and shopping.

I went in last night to fence the bigger paddock ready for the horses to go back on and the stuff is coming up everywhere.

What does the salt and vinegar mix do?

The other option is pay someone to come and pull it I suppose.

 

[Highmileagecob]

Salt and vinegar solution plus a dash of washing up liquid is an effective weedkiller with no serious effect on the land. If you can mix it in a pressure sprayer and give each plant a blast, it does work, and you can work around the horses with no chance of poisoning them. The problem with pulling and digging the stuff is that it disturbs the ground, which in turn wakes up next year's seeds.

 

[honetpot]

You have to keep them off until the ragwort is so shrivalled that they will not eat it, or wait until it works and then mow.
Spraying is far more effective, but you need a 'ticket' to do it, the course the last time I looked it was £300. I pay someone about every two years and pull the odd patch, what ever you do it would come back because the seed comes from other land.
I had a rented field which was full of ragwort and just about cleared by pulling in two months, I created a clear patch put them on that and them strip grazed when I moved the line I pulled anything in the fresh grass, so I was spending a smaller amount of time daily and you had the incentive that you see what you have done. After that yearly I divided it in four, and cleared each quarter.
Spraying is a lot easier, I always put fertiliser on first so the fresh grass is far more tasty than any shrivalled ragwort, a couple of sunny days and its just about dust.
Word of caution, make sure what ever you use kills it quickly, if it just wilts the plant and doesn't kill out right then you are left will plants you may need to pull.

 

[scats]

Our local farmer who rents some of our land can do it I think. We have enough paddocks that we can move off one and leave it for a month or so if needed.
I genuinely can’t do it anymore myself. My back is a mess and if I wreck it anymore I’m going to be unable to do my job. The little rosettes are just spreading everywhere, like they are joining together and taking over. Plus there are larger ones along the fence lines.

 

[MissTyc]

We have a local farmer do it with tractor. We do have almost 40 acres to spray and also dig it up, etc etc etc ... I think they used "Polo" last time. Something rings a bell. We do a third of the field every 2-3 years. Still have many non-grass plants and herbs in the fields, but it was waist height when we first took on the land, so it's hopeless to manage any other way.,

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

We had our fields sprayed ten years ago by a local farmer and then again the following spring, so two years running. It has not spoilt the diversity of the sward, all has very quickly re established but without the dreaded ragwort. We have only had the odd ones pop up here and there, we usually dig them out with a ragwort fork and then fill the hole with salt to kill any remaining root. I believe he used Grazon, it killed docks as well fortunately, but I do still have to occasionally spray the dock areas with a hand held sprayer also with Grazon as the hay often has some in it and it self seeds over winter.

 

[PurBee]

Another angle to look at field management to prevent any weeds is to over seed the fields with grass seed. I have consistently witnessed wherever there is patchy grass in a paddock, for ‘mother nature’ to fill the space with weeds.
I’ve done a few field trials, and wherever i’ve re-seeded with grass, even after tilling soil and doing a proper re-seed job, if i create a thick grass sward, there’s very very few weeds, even if the field was full of weeds from years previous.

I think the roots of the new grass shoots growing disarms or rots any seeds in the ground from the previous incarnation of the field. The grass ‘takes over’ the soil, and any weed seeds dont get a chance to germinate as the soil space there is filled with grass instead.
It’s like mother nature has a dictum that is “i dont care whats growing in the soil, providing something is growing there” - hence weedy paddocks are the worst due to being over-grazed and patchy.
One field i renovated was full of rushes and buttercups, i tilled it and despite the thinking that im disturbing all the roots and seeds of the weeds which will cause even more weeds - i heavily seeded that field with grass seed (16kg per acre) and grew a thick layer of grass. The weed growth was very minimal. Its was a very tricky field with bog type soil anyway, so didnt expect miracles but even that did very well. I was very surprised how few weeds grew. It was an experiment from an organic farming perspective, and i’ve over-seeded other fields and had success.

So in essence rather than kill weeds, its possible to ‘choke them out’ instead by planting something else in the space, i.e grass.

To overseed, just have a bag ready every spring of mixed horse paddock grass seed, and around late april, simply scatter seeds over the grass evenly all over. The rain will wash any seeds to make contact with the soil, and they’ll fill in any tiny gaps in the existing grass and create a thicker grass cover. Keep horses off it for 12 weeks if possible while the seedlings grow.

It helps hugely to not overgraze the field/s. It will undo the reseeding work.

So although a field full of weeds needs starting again - if we fill the soil with grass seeds, weeds are automatically vastly reduced. It’s ‘competitive planting’ type farming. Sow what we DO want, and automatically what we dont want reduces re-germination of yesteryears weed seeds. Having done it, i know it works. My fields were full of bunches of rushes when i started, barely any grass! I cut and tilled and reseeded - some areas just got cut over and over again and grass took off.

If spraying is carried-out, where the weeds die, other plants will by forces of nature grow there, likely more weeds, so after the ragwort has died off from spraying, the patches could be heavily over-seeded with grass seed to compete with and prevent previous ragwort seeds germinating.

You can spread grass seed in autumn too, providing its not a ‘winter trash field’, for horse turn out. The horses will destroy the young tender seedlings. If its the summer field overseeded in autumn ready for next years summer, autumn (september) germination happens and good regrowth starts as soon as temps get over 5 degrees the following spring, ready for late spring turnout.

 

[scats]

Thanks PurBee. One of the fields has become overgrown with buttercups, but we are on rye grass, which has been a nightmare for good doers (one with EMS) so I’ve sort of embraced the weeds in the hope that it makes the grazing a bit more suited to my horses.
Obviously the ragwort is a big problem though.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

Local farmer did mine a few weeks back horses have to stay off it for a week, I just go round getting rid of the dead plants.

I also spot spray with Barrier H ragwort killer I find that pretty good it killed most of what I had last year, I didn't find the vinegar and salt did much to be honest the barrier h was much better in my opinion.

 

[PurBee]

Thanks PurBee. One of the fields has become overgrown with buttercups, but we are on rye grass, which has been a nightmare for good doers (one with EMS) so I’ve sort of embraced the weeds in the hope that it makes the grazing a bit more suited to my horses.
Obviously the ragwort is a big problem though.

To be honest buttercup needs to be viewed more accurately as a toxic plant we dont want in paddocks too. Its oils are very volatile and any part of the plant eaten causes a blistering of mucous membranes, including the g.i tract which can cause colic/gastro issues.
Animals walking over a field laden with buttercup will be causing some crushing of the leaves of buttercup and release some of its oils onto surrounding plants.

Here’s some info, its toxic to all livestock, not just horses. Ive come to learn over the years its not a benign weed:

Buttercup Management in Pastures

Buttercup: Pretty little flowers and a definite problem Hairy buttercup is a weed and has dark green stems with very bright yellow flowers with five petals. This

extension.illinois.edu

My gelding a few years back had a very acute toxic event from trying new mixed meadow haylage that contained buttercup. Because it was wet/damp when wrapped for haylage, it still contained the volatile oils and caused toxicity. Its believed these compounds dry out to be safe in fully dried-out hay.
Further research since that happened to him has shown its a real toxic bugger of a small pretty flower!

Calcium/lime addition to buttercup paddocks will help the depleted calcium soils that usually grow buttercup.


If you are able to not need to use your ryegrass/buttercup field for 8 months, that’s worth a tight low cut down to stubble, then rotavate/till the top 4 inches, then re-seed with mixed grasses, roll and wait re-growth of new paddock. Add lime after grass established, or before tilling.

But you’re right to prioritise ragwort, and get them killed-off before flowering and seedhead develops.

If all your land is mainly ryegrass, overseeding bare patches with mixed seeds of fescues/timothy/cocks foot etc will really help take over the ryegrass and bring its % down.

Any fields that are ‘cow grazing’ ryegrass fields full of buttercup are well worth starting again with than battling the problematic issues of ryegrass/buttercups for years on end. A contractor would get it done fast if you dont have the machinery yourself. Well worth the investment.
I was so chuffed with my new renovated field, the horses looked so great eating from it that season - my black mare looked the blackest she ever had! Their weight/health/temperament really thrived.

My fields were mainly ancient tall fescue fields used once upon a time for cows. My pregnant mare looked at me bereft as i put her on it to graze, and she ignored the majority of it and ate other sparse grasses. I ended up feeding bought in hay as she was ignoring my fields of grass! After foaling she bizarrely then started eating the tall fescue long lush green leaves. I was perplexed by this behaviour and that started my grass/plant journey of learning, as i soon found out tall fescue naturally grows an endophyte that causes abortion in livestock. Thankfully the mare had the instinct not to eat it, had more wisdom than i did at the time and a very healthy foal was born!

Grasses all have a purpose and nutrition, but if we have just 1 species of anything growing it can be problematic. A mixed grass species field satisfies the needs safely for most grazers.

 

[scats]

To be honest buttercup needs to be viewed more accurately as a toxic plant we dont want in paddocks too. Its oils are very volatile and any part of the plant eaten causes a blistering of mucous membranes, including the g.i tract which can cause colic/gastro issues.
Animals walking over a field laden with buttercup will be causing some crushing of the leaves of buttercup and release some of its oils onto surrounding plants.

Here’s some info, its toxic to all livestock, not just horses. Ive come to learn over the years its not a benign weed:

Buttercup Management in Pastures

Buttercup: Pretty little flowers and a definite problem Hairy buttercup is a weed and has dark green stems with very bright yellow flowers with five petals. This

extension.illinois.edu

My gelding a few years back had a very acute toxic event from trying new mixed meadow haylage that contained buttercup. Because it was wet/damp when wrapped for haylage, it still contained the volatile oils and caused toxicity. Its believed these compounds dry out to be safe in fully dried-out hay.
Further research since that happened to him has shown its a real toxic bugger of a small pretty flower!

Calcium/lime addition to buttercup paddocks will help the depleted calcium soils that usually grow buttercup.


If you are able to not need to use your ryegrass/buttercup field for 8 months, that’s worth a tight low cut down to stubble, then rotavate/till the top 4 inches, then re-seed with mixed grasses, roll and wait re-growth of new paddock. Add lime after grass established, or before tilling.

But you’re right to prioritise ragwort, and get them killed-off before flowering and seedhead develops.

If all your land is mainly ryegrass, overseeding bare patches with mixed seeds of fescues/timothy/cocks foot etc will really help take over the ryegrass and bring its % down.

Any fields that are ‘cow grazing’ ryegrass fields full of buttercup are well worth starting again with than battling the problematic issues of ryegrass/buttercups for years on end. A contractor would get it done fast if you dont have the machinery yourself. Well worth the investment.
I was so chuffed with my new renovated field, the horses looked so great eating from it that season - my black mare looked the blackest she ever had! Their weight/health/temperament really thrived.

My fields were mainly ancient tall fescue fields used once upon a time for cows. My pregnant mare looked at me bereft as i put her on it to graze, and she ignored the majority of it and ate other sparse grasses. I ended up feeding bought in hay as she was ignoring my fields of grass! After foaling she bizarrely then started eating the tall fescue long lush green leaves. I was perplexed by this behaviour and that started my grass/plant journey of learning, as i soon found out tall fescue naturally grows an endophyte that causes abortion in livestock. Thankfully the mare had the instinct not to eat it, had more wisdom than i did at the time and a very healthy foal was born!

Grasses all have a purpose and nutrition, but if we have just 1 species of anything growing it can be problematic. A mixed grass species field satisfies the needs safely for most grazers.

Thank you. That’s really interesting.
My knowledge of grass and weeds is sadly lacking so happy to learn what I can.

 

[SussexbytheXmasTree]

I wrote a response to a similar question so copied it below. Don’t underestimate how long it takes for the plants to die off and importantly disappear completely otherwise you’ll need to remove by hand anyway. Good thing though it was a nightmare it did work in the long run and became much more manageable. I also don’t know how well the spraying was done.

“Usually you need a leaf for the herbicide to be absorbed by. You’ll have to leave the horses off for quite a long time especially if the plants are large. If they are at the rosette stage then it works best. They sprayed too late at my yard a few years ago and I had to fence part of my field off as it took forever for the mature plants to die and I had to spend ages removing the dead plants as dead are more likely to get eaten. The previous person in the field hadn’t pulled the ragwort properly and there were hundreds of plants. I left them as they kept saying they would spray and by the time they did the plants were mature. It was a nightmare to clear.”

Anyone spraying will need to be qualified to do so.

 

[Irish-Only]

We thought we needed the spraying qualifications so OH did the course for knapsack spraying about 4 years ago. We also have a pto sprayer for the tractor. Not once have we been asked to supply the certificate, and recently bought 16 litres of weed killer from an online supplier.

 

[PeterNatt]

I use Barrier H. Spray the plant on the first day then again three days later. I then wait until the complete plant has died and put it in to a heavy duty plastic refuse bag and then burn them. If you pull Ragowrt out one leaves filaments of the roots in the ground which regenerate to form more plants. The other alternative is to get a contractor in to spray the whole field with a tarctor and sprayer and then safely remove the dead Ragwort.

 

[SpotsandBays]

Salt and vinegar solution plus a dash of washing up liquid is an effective weedkiller with no serious effect on the land. If you can mix it in a pressure sprayer and give each plant a blast, it does work, and you can work around the horses with no chance of poisoning them. The problem with pulling and digging the stuff is that it disturbs the ground, which in turn wakes up next year's seeds.

Does this work on docks also?

 

[Highmileagecob]

Does this work on docks also?

We haven't tried it on docks, so I am not sure. It did work well on the ragwort, but given the amount of emerging ragwort that we have on our pasture currently, we probably need to do the job properly and use something like Barrier H. Our farmer leaves us to it, and fellow liveries are reluctant to help. It's a nightmare.

 

[MagicMelon]

I cant imagine salt and vinegar works on docks. Docks are so strong, I think only Graze On kills them. Even then mine seem to shrivel down but new ones pop up underneath straight away!

 

[suestowford]

Grazon doesn't kill docks really, they might look ill for a while but they soon come back. I have used Roundup on docks with some success, but that's just the odd one that seeds into concrete or tarmac, where I can't dig it out.