Auslander
Well-Known Member
I bet he wants a duvet too...
Stable bankings
- Thread starter Rockman
- Start date
I bet he wants a duvet too...
Tess Love
Well-Known Member
Oh that's so cute bless him.
*hic*
village idiot :D
He's not getting one, he's like a flipping yak. He's learnt that rugs are acceptable to have put on you and that only grown up horses wear them, even in the most horrendous weather.
xgemmax
Well-Known Member
I just use banks to store excess bedding, its faffy having to put half a bale in or whatever and pull some down half way through the week 
MotherOfChickens
MotherDucker
I just use banks to store excess bedding, its faffy having to put half a bale in or whatever and pull some down half way through the week
me too when I was on shavings.
Tnavas
Well-Known Member
If the bed is nice and deep the horse is above the draughts as they whistle through at ground level.
Khalswitz - straw provides drainage, so yes it will be wet on the bottom. For a really good deep litter bed: a deep layer of shavings/sawdust under a deep layer of straw works best.
khalswitz
Well-Known Member
That's exactly what I hate about pure straw beds!! They don't absorb much. Leaves the stable very smelly. But with a shavings/pellet,sawdust base I can imagine it much better. Still would rather stick to my pure shavings deep litter for winter though...
Tnavas
Well-Known Member
Outside there are no draughts!
Draughts whistle through gaps under doors and in winter have the ability to freeze the hot water pipe of a central heating system (father was a plumber and had this happen to a customer)
Unless you stable door fits like a glove and has draught excluders fitted you will have a draught under the door.
Try lying on the floor and you will feel the draught. The deep bed allows your pony to lie above the level of the whistling draught.
Tnavas
Well-Known Member
That is lovely, dinner and breakfast in bed
ILuvCowparsely
Well-Known Member
No your right
there is damp grass
stony ground
gust
wind
rain
snow
etc etc
draughts are not a big issue, they stand with their heads over the door and draughts under the door.
A horse is not bothered by draught, its the human perception of a horses stable being a problem if their are no banks to keep a so called draught away.
I have never seen any health issues related to horses being in a stable which has a draught, be it stable or lean to shelter with 2 sides.
khalswitz
Well-Known Member
To be fair there are equine behaviour studies that show horses choose to stand out of draughts when in barns and stables, and show increased signs of discomfort in draughty scenarios. A draughty stable reduces ability to move to keep warm and to find shelter from wind etc that they have outside. I'm generally warm when walking around on the windy hillside where my horse lives, but if I sit around, even in my warm outdoor clothes, in our stable canteen with the door constantly opening and closing, I feel the cold.
However, I don't think bedding has much to do with avoiding draughts unless it physically blocks the bottom of the door. Bedding absorbs urine, and provides a comfortable place to lie avoiding things like capped hocks. Big banks can help stop horses getting cast. However, I just don't see how they can stop a horse feeling a draught in a stable.
PolarSkye
Well-Known Member
I actually don't care whether or not there is a draught under the door or whether (or not) Kal would lie down outside on the stones and in the wet (he's a bit of a priss so he probably wouldn't) . . . I like him to have a nice deep straw bed to keep him off the floor and to stop him getting capped hocks (no rubber mats) . . . and I know he rests his head on the banks, so I make them for him. No skin off my nose
.P
Auslander
Well-Known Member
Too right! I pulled rank when I moved to my current yard, and gave Alf the corner stable - no draughts blowing into the bedded down bit of his box. He has a lovely thick bed in the winter, and I'm sure he appreciates it!
Rockman
...
I think this thread could get as heated as the 'do you wash out your feed buckets' thread of 2004 or whenever it was
Haha I've never had this many replies to anything I've posted!!
I did exactly the same! My conclusion has been I don't have a stable big enough for anti cast banks (12x12) so they can go but he does still like his pillow at the back so that can stay
and I don't think it's that drafty as he's in a barn so hopefully don't need to worry too much about that! Interesting stuff!
Tnavas
Well-Known Member
The horse in the wild can run around to keep warm. Can find a hollow or side of a hill protected from the wind.
Inside your pony cannot run around so feels the cold more, why do you think we rug horses that are stabled?
When there is a gap under the door you will get a draught and as I suggested earlier go and lie on the floor of your stable! Then maybe you will feel how cold they can be.
Horses are bothered by draughts, they will not lie down so willingly, they need more food and are more restless when stabled.
You do not get draughts in the top open door, or open sided sheds as someone else remarked. Draughts originate through small gaps when air is drawn through by ventilation.
Best time to find draughts in your home is when you light an open fire. The fire sucks in the air forcing more outside air to flow through. Each winter I go through my living room stuffing paper towel into the gaps around my elderly house's windows. The temperature in the room changes dramatically when the windows are all done.
ILuvCowparsely
Well-Known Member
What are you actually trying to achieve by the above???
try and convince me to make my beds bigger?
try and justify your views?
trying to convince us that your views are correct?
try and convince me that the tiny bit of air that gets into a horses stable will effect them health wise? (not the horses choice to move out the way if he/she chooses)
Your views above are like the tabloid someones writing which will have no effect on me at all. It just one members views, I stand by my views and my practices. Like others here we do not like big banks some of us like big beds some thin beds down to a sprinkling no choice is wrong (unless the thin/sprinkle are on concrete) and we will continue to do our own private stables the way we want to and the way we want our horses to live.
Every stable here is rubber matted which it itself is supposed to be used on its own without bedding, so some are just that no bed just a sprinkling.
My horses are healthy and happy as are my liveries who choose to have their horses stables bedded down the way THEY want to regardless if you like it or not.
We don't have to justify are actions or the amount of bedding or choices in the way we do the beds.
When you own a yard and have to muck out every horse in the place you come across different choices from the liveries and abide by what they want.
Just for the record all the horses lie down every night sometimes 2-3 times draughts or not, some are even snoring. (have it on CCTV). So they are not bothered about any "so call bit of air flowing about"
Not all horses are rugged
nuff said
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Blythe Spirit
Well-Known Member
i put in cosmetic banks - just because i think they look nice! I have straw day beds - ie I do a full muck out every morning after turning out. my stables are small - wish they were bigger but the livery yard has other virtues - so no room for big banks. I don't personally believe they serve any purpose as I do them except to please me when I lay my beds every day!
MerrySherryRider
Well-Known Member
I'm not understanding this concern about draughts under the stable door. Horses are designed to stand in snow and freezing mud. I doubt they worry about having cold feet. Even when lying down, they are well rugged or have a thick hairy winter coat and hopefully lie on a bed deep enough, to protect their joints and keep them dry.
Any draughts above chest height are called ventilation and are pretty essential.
Regarding banks- what is there to say ? Don't have them, the horse will be fine. Or have them if you like the look of them.
Stable size is more important if you don't want your horse to get cast.
Any draughts above chest height are called ventilation and are pretty essential.
Regarding banks- what is there to say ? Don't have them, the horse will be fine. Or have them if you like the look of them.
Stable size is more important if you don't want your horse to get cast.
MerrySherryRider
Well-Known Member
Double posted.
Tnavas
Well-Known Member
As I posted earlier - a draught has the ability to freeze a HOT heating pipe and burst it. This particular pipe froze one winter, there was a small crack in the exterior cladding and the draught actually froze the water in the hot pipe and burst it. This shows just how cold a draught can be.
Those who don't believe or comprehend - Lie down on the floor inside your horses stable, with the door shut and feel the draught and how cold and debilitating it is.
MerrySherryRider
Well-Known Member
The pipe to the water trough in the field froze and burst during the freezing, snowy winter a couple of years ago.
The horses living out 24/7 through out the temperatures of -10 did not have frozen legs.
Your comparison is not a relevant one.
OldNag
Wasting my time successfully....
Draughts notwithstanding, can report that I only survived one day of no banks (well not quite, still had one along the back). I just can't do it . Not with a straw bed. Clearly I need help ....
Tnavas
Well-Known Member
Oh Dear!!! What I am trying to get across is that a draught is extremely cold and very focused on a small area. and that for a horse stuck in a stable unable to move away from it can be very uncomfortable.
Have you never felt a draught - its really cold and can really chill you even though the ambient temperature may be warm. In winter I block all the gaps around my windows in the living room as when I am working at the computer there is one that can have me absolutely freezing and shivering despite the room being heated.
Surely if people care that much for their horses they will ensure that their horse is not having to sleep with a draught whistling under the door. I certainly wouldn't do it, my horses have deep beds that keep them out of the draught. I dfo so to ensure that they are in the maximum of comfort possible.
dogatemysalad
Well-Known Member
A draught under a stable door isn't a problem for a stabled horse. As far as I know, they manage quite well in the coldest weather without wearing wellingtons. They also manage to endure cold hosing without too much discomfort. They are not human, they don't get frost bite in theiir feet from frozen conditions.
What they do need is air circulating around the stable. Apart from being susceptible to respiratory conditions, their sense of smell is far more acute than ours.
That's one of the reasons, top stable doors are left open, during weather that would have us rushing to shut the windows and doors at home.
Laying a bed deep enough to protect the horse from urine and capped hocks ensures enough warmth until they go back out into the ice and mud.
Sometimes caring about your horse means recognising that their needs are different to human beings' needs.
So sealing the stable door is not something I'd do. I'm not fond of banks in stables, they are unhygienic unless pulled down regularly, although each horse has individual needs and preferences and if one likes a bank to use as a pillow for his head, then I'd probably give him one.
What they do need is air circulating around the stable. Apart from being susceptible to respiratory conditions, their sense of smell is far more acute than ours.
That's one of the reasons, top stable doors are left open, during weather that would have us rushing to shut the windows and doors at home.
Laying a bed deep enough to protect the horse from urine and capped hocks ensures enough warmth until they go back out into the ice and mud.
Sometimes caring about your horse means recognising that their needs are different to human beings' needs.
So sealing the stable door is not something I'd do. I'm not fond of banks in stables, they are unhygienic unless pulled down regularly, although each horse has individual needs and preferences and if one likes a bank to use as a pillow for his head, then I'd probably give him one.
ILuvCowparsely
Well-Known Member
I find it really strange that someone in NZ is asking UK members if they have ever felt a draught!! Hey this is the UK damn cold in winter, I bet every UK resident has felt / has draughts in winter.
Most horses can move away from a so called draught in their stable if they choose, but most choose to stand near the door where a draught comes under it.
How someone can say its uncomfortable for a horse, when they are not one, its as I said your thinking from a humans perception, we do not know what they are actually thinking.
A horses leg is designed for cold weather, they get thicker hair and can withstand extreme cold as previously mentioned when they are cold hosed. I fail to see how a little cold air wafting into a stable can make it colder, too cold for a horse without bedding across, when I go in and check them at 10pm and they are warm as toast, and are standing near the door.
Most horses can move away from a so called draught in their stable if they choose, but most choose to stand near the door where a draught comes under it.
How someone can say its uncomfortable for a horse, when they are not one, its as I said your thinking from a humans perception, we do not know what they are actually thinking.
A horses leg is designed for cold weather, they get thicker hair and can withstand extreme cold as previously mentioned when they are cold hosed. I fail to see how a little cold air wafting into a stable can make it colder, too cold for a horse without bedding across, when I go in and check them at 10pm and they are warm as toast, and are standing near the door.
Tnavas
Well-Known Member
I also find it very strange that you don't notice that as well as currently living in New Zealand I COME FROM THE UK - I trained in the UK, took my BHS and ABRS exams in the UK and know very well what a draught is. I moved here to New Zealand when I was in my late 30's having spent around 15 years working in top yards in the UK. I'm now in my 60's and only gave up working with horses a few years ago.
As I said earlier, go and lie on your horses non-existent bed and with JUST the bottom door shut feel the draught that comes under the door. Your pony CANNOT get away from a draught and lie down in comfort!
NOTE they are STANDING by the door and I bet you don't go in to check them at 3am in the morning which is the coldest part of the night.
WHY do we put rugs on them when they are stabled? - BECAUSE they get cold when made to stand in one place for so long.
Cold hosing is a lazy modern trend and is not comfortable for them - even here in NZ the racehorses get really upset when they are cold hosed and the winters in the area I live in aren't that cold.
ILuvCowparsely
Well-Known Member
I was not referring to whether or not you were born in the UK or NZ I was referring to the climate.
You carry on your quest to covert some into your idea that horses are bothered by draught or not.
And FYI I have been out at 3am many times with colic cases, and been on the rd to Potters bar at 2am with a horse so don't go telling me I have not as I own this livery yard and have done so since 1996, so know what the weather is like early mornings.
Why do most put rugs on? Because they clip them in winter you remove a layer you have to replace a layer.
My pony is contented your passion for converting us to draught excluders for the stable is a strange one, why don't you go into business and create draught excluders for the stable.
I think most have left this post due to you not actually adding any more Proven/ or conclusive fact that a horse is better of with bedding to the door.
So sorry your going round and round. My horses and liveries will continue to be bedded down how I want and my liveries, which obviously is not doing any harm as some are well into their 30;s and still ridden. And if you look at my profile I too am BHS qualified. So unless you have concrete proof we need to change our old ways. I bid you adieu and move on to a more interesting post as all the others have bye bye...........................
khalswitz
Well-Known Member
As I said, scientific studies have shown that horses (and other animals including, but not limited to, cattle, sheep and especially pigs) do not like draughts. Whether they cause health problems is another matter, but they do not like them, and show increased tendencies towards 'uncontent' behaviours. It is an accepted fact in terms of equine behaviour.
Temperature has nothing to do with it - like has been said they can live out in sub zero temperatures. However in turnout conditions they can display behaviours such as finding shelter, turning their back ends to the wind, keeping moving to keep warm, rolling, etc. In a stable these behaviours are limited, and in the case of draughts in a stable (draughts being different than higher level ventilation which is necessary) the horse faces a contrasting cold air flow that they can't escape. It has nothing to do with bedding, but with making sure your stable isn't draughty by for example having your stable door properly fitted to the ground, or using a wooden bottom frame.
It is fact that draughts really do affect indoor kept farm animals, horses included, but bedding has little to do with it really.
Temperature has nothing to do with it - like has been said they can live out in sub zero temperatures. However in turnout conditions they can display behaviours such as finding shelter, turning their back ends to the wind, keeping moving to keep warm, rolling, etc. In a stable these behaviours are limited, and in the case of draughts in a stable (draughts being different than higher level ventilation which is necessary) the horse faces a contrasting cold air flow that they can't escape. It has nothing to do with bedding, but with making sure your stable isn't draughty by for example having your stable door properly fitted to the ground, or using a wooden bottom frame.
It is fact that draughts really do affect indoor kept farm animals, horses included, but bedding has little to do with it really.
Tnavas
Well-Known Member
Thank you kahlswitz
khalswitz
Well-Known Member
Thank you kahlswitz
I know I disagree with you on a lot of things Tnavas, and I personally don't use banks and only have thin layer of bedding over my rubber matting, but in terms of draughts bothering horses I completely concur.