Stabling with no bedding

[Tiddlypom]

Bit of an idiotic comment given that's NOT what I said :rolleyes3:
But hey ho, just pick out whatever part of a post you like and take it out of context, why bother with sensible discussion?

Well, that is how it read to me. I'm always up for a sensible discussion, let me know when there's one starting !

 

[samlf]

not for me, I have used rubber mats and wood pellets + shavings and that works really well. Would never have just mats unless it was in a field shelter. My horse is really, really dirty too.
I must admit I also wonder about the ethics of keeping a horse in such a small area for over half of their day, when in the field they would always choose to poo/wee somewhere and lay down somewhere else.

 

[Patterdale]

I might have misread Patterdale's original post, but I think her horses live out and therefore don't usually come in over night - if that is the case it's hardly detrimental to the animal's comfort if it spends one evening out of 50 in a stable stood upright.

There are always those people who truly believe the only way to do horses is their way, and everyone else must be completely devoid of any knowledge and common sense.

No, you're right
They do live out, if they come in for the farrier I have no problem leaving them half a day in the large concrete sheep pens with a bale of hay, and if its a particularly bad night then same again. It's a big enough area that they don't have to stand in muck.
If one was in for a while I'd bed down but for the odd night I'm just not prepared to waste the money when they're really not bothered.

 

[Equilibrium Ireland]

Well if my large rounds cost me 50pds then I'd be a bit less on the beds. Geez that's an awful price. Three large rounds of clean straw here for 50euro. It's about 30cents per horse per day.

As far as muck heap, the straw breaks down quickly. This spring the very well rotted stuff will be taken for free by a farmer. The end of the heap that is shavings does not break down as quickly and needs paid for to take away. We have 6 on straw and someone else has 2 on shavings. Her end is catching up to the straw.

Terri

 

[Moomin1]

I have them on rubber matting. The big chap is in the 12x12 with rubber matting and a light sprinkle of wood chip over. He is happy to wee on the mats and they drain well. He is also very untidy and having no bedding means it is very quick to do his stall in the morning. They wear rugs and if its very cold their outdoor ones. He doesn't like to lie down anyway but sleeps happily with his head over the door.
The pony has the double box as he is very tidy. He has a little patch of wood chip where he does all his poops and he usually wees next to this or by the door. He likes to lie down at the back of the stall which is his clean area, again no bedding.

They are both happy to come in at night and will stay stabled during the day too if the weather is terrible.

From my point of view its cheaper, the heap doesn't fill up so fast and they are both happy and healthy. Yes you can smell the wee in the morning as it runs to the front of the stable, but a quick sweep out and I'm done in 10 mins.

It's absolutely imperative that horses get some sleep lying down. If they don't get enough REM sleep it can be dangerous. When I first got my mare, I tried her on matting with a small sprinkle of shavings on top. One day she literally fell to her knees when dozing off in the stable - through lack of decent REM sleep because of not wanting to lie on the mats. Needless to say they were got rid of and she went straight on deep litter shavings. Never had a problem since.

 

[Meems]

Well in theory a horse on rubber matting shouldn't need much bedding at all, as the rubber stops them standing/lying on a cold, hard concrete floor. However, you do need a certain amount of bedding to soak the wee up, certainly more than a little sprinkle.

What personally drives me nuts is when you see a horse on full rubber matting with a really deep bed, I mean what's the point of having the matting in the first place if the bed is so deep they can't even feel the mats. Might as well just be on concrete with a really deep bed!

 

[Goldenstar]

Well in theory a horse on rubber matting shouldn't need much bedding at all, as the rubber stops them standing/lying on a cold, hard concrete floor. However, you do need a certain amount of bedding to soak the wee up, certainly more than a little sprinkle.

What personally drives me nuts is when you see a horse on full rubber matting with a really deep bed, I mean what's the point of having the matting in the first place if the bed is so deep they can't even feel the mats. Might as well just be on concrete with a really deep bed!

That's how my stables are matted with shavings beds .
The horses never stand on concrete that's why the mats are there if the beds are up and the horse are in they are standing on the mats not concrete .
The beds are up every day as I dont like deep litter .
You can make the beds a bit thinner with the mats there they have a minimum eight inch deep beds not the foot plus I used to use and I am happy that I know no matter how much they dig and mess about they will never endanger them selves by rolling on the concrete .
Why on earth would someone else's bedding system would drive you nuts is beyond me .

 

[Meems]

Why on earth would someone else's bedding system would drive you nuts is beyond me .

Because I've worked on various yards and, to me, it just doesn't make sense.

 

[Angus' yard]

Our boy is rugless, but comes into a deep straw bed every evening. The straw gives his feet and legs a good chance to dry out, he has a good sleep and goes out smelling fresh and refreshed each morning ready to face the elements. It takes ten minutes to skip out the manky bits each day with a proper muck out once a week or so.

 

[Goldenstar]

Because I've worked on various yards and, to me, it just doesn't make sense.

When you work on yards you do what the YOer wants I certainly would never base my bedding desisions around what the staff would like.

 

[Queenbee]

I have rubber matting, I love it, for me it is a fail safe, if my horse messes up his bed and expose a big chunk of floor then I know when he lies down it's still comfortable for him. Rubber matting is not an excuse for no bedding, that in my opinion is lazy and cruel. Ben has as much of a bed as he would without rubber matting. The only bedding I ever use less of with rubber mats is wood pellet and even then I probably use more than most people use when they don't have rubber matting. It's not just a hygiene thing, it's a comfort thing, I want my horse to be happy in his stable environment, Ben loves zonking out on his bed, why shouldn't he have a nice bed to do this. Yes they may lie down on the ground in the field but they don't choose a spot to lie in where they've just peed or pooed to do this, furthermore, urine soaks away in a field. I buy one big round bale of straw for £23 this will last two months, with a deep bed, and banks.... That's no cost whatsoever for my boys comfort. Even before this it was only one bag of shavings a week. If I ran my own yard no one would be allowed to not provide their horse with decent bedding.

 

[Queenbee]

That's how my stables are matted with shavings beds .
The horses never stand on concrete that's why the mats are there if the beds are up and the horse are in they are standing on the mats not concrete .
The beds are up every day as I dont like deep litter .
You can make the beds a bit thinner with the mats there they have a minimum eight inch deep beds not the foot plus I used to use and I am happy that I know no matter how much they dig and mess about they will never endanger them selves by rolling on the concrete .
Why on earth would someone else's bedding system would drive you nuts is beyond me .

This

 

[Tern]

I think it's unacceptable, yard where I used to keep my horse has about 100 horses and yes okay they haven't got LOADS of bedding but they have enough and get a top up every week - sometimes they do run out of straw so need to wait but the beddings have a full muck out in morning then one or two skip outs in day so are kept glean and the WHOLE yard is rubber matted, mine would never be on no bedding if I ran out then they'd be outside

 

[Tern]

Adding to above - if a huge yard with not much money can afford bedding then I think one owner with one horse can too.

 

[ester]

not had mats before where I am now but given that Frank likes to dig and roll it does mean that he'll always be on the rubber and that in his oversized stable I only need to be a bit big enough for him and his poo!

 

[pinkypug1]

Fully matted stable, 2ft high banks and full very thick white shavings bed daily. I can't bear to keep my horse on dirty shaving & most I the liveries (30) have clean white beds too. I'm lucky my mare is very clean & so I only need 3 bales per week to keep it prestine! I'm a bit ocd and poo pick the little bits left over with gloves.

 

[Mike007]

When I bought my horse,I made a promise to him that he would never again have to try to sleep on a two foot strip of shavings at he back of some cold hard rubber matting soaked in piss and ****.In return he has been the kindest most loyal friend. Some things are non negotiable!

 

[Patterdale]

Why on earth would someone else's bedding system would drive you nuts is beyond me .

Thats a funny comment, isn't that the basis of most of the posts on this thread....?

 

[Goldenstar]

Thats a funny comment, isn't that the basis of most of the posts on this thread....?

No most people don't get worked up about what other people do and think .
In the post I was responding to the poster explained she's a groom unfortunatly for her when she works she has to conform to her employers standards .
Why it you drive her nuts I can't imagine that's part of a grooms job .

 

[Patterdale]

Why it you drive her nuts I can't imagine that's part of a grooms job .

What, so because she's a groom she's not allowed an opinion?

I worked as a groom when I was younger and saw plenty that wound me up. What a silly comment.

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

Has anyone heard of this/done it? I am just curious because there is a person at my barn whose horse is kept this way and I'd never seen a stabled horse kept without some kind of bedding.

This isn't any kind of dig at the owner - the horse seems healthy and doesn't have bedsores (my mare would - she gets them if she doesn't have a huge, thick bed). The owner is out daily to clean and exercise. It's just alien to me so I wondered if anyone else had seen the same.

The horse is in a stall and small paddock combo (both about 12x12) so he's not just in a stall. But he is messy so the stall gets quite nasty, and he is an older horse (in his 20s) so I'd be concerned about either slipping, getting sores, or being reluctant to lie down.

I'd ask the owner but I don't know her well and I don't want to come off as being judgmental - I'm really not, just curious.

I have done this in the past and my pony is more or less on just rubber mats

 

[Blurr]

£50 for straw is v. expensive. But if they're only in for the odd night, it's not going to cost much is it? If they were in every night for 6 months I'd certainly have to consider bedding options at that price.

They may not nest in the wild, but they do know how to be comfortable. Anyone who's put a large round of hay in the field with no feed ring around it will know what happens there. Even ponies who've never been stabled or known a straw bed prefer to lie on the hay. And some in Spain use caves for shade in the hot weather. Their nature is to adapt to their environment, which is very handy for us.

 

[Goldenstar]

What, so because she's a groom she's not allowed an opinion?

I worked as a groom when I was younger and saw plenty that wound me up. What a silly comment.

She allowed of course to have an opinion as funnily enough am I and in my opinion being driven nuts by something that is in no way impacting a horses welfare is silly .
If an owner what wants their horse to have mats and a bed that's what the owner wants .
If she worked here and voiced an opinion on the beds I would explain why I did want I did and then I would expect her to get on with it .

 

[Moomin1]

She allowed of course to have an opinion as funnily enough am I and in my opinion being driven nuts by something that is in no way impacting a horses welfare is silly .
If an owner what wants their horse to have mats and a bed that's what the owner wants .
If she worked here and voiced an opinion on the beds I would explain why I did want I did and then I would expect her to get on with it .

See, when I tried mats with my mare, it WAS impacting on her welfare, which is why they were got rid of immediately.

I do think that they can impact on welfare where certain horses are concerned. I have seen some stables in which they work fine with some horses, but the others are in a heck of a state and not lying down at all. Ok of course if they are only in a couple of hours a day, but not when they are spending large amounts of time in there.

As I said earlier, my mare actually fell onto her knees when dozing off in her stable because she wasn't lying down and getting REM sleep.

 

[Goldenstar]

See, when I tried mats with my mare, it WAS impacting on her welfare, which is why they were got rid of immediately.

I do think that they can impact on welfare where certain horses are concerned. I have seen some stables in which they work fine with some horses, but the others are in a heck of a state and not lying down at all. Ok of course if they are only in a couple of hours a day, but not when they are spending large amounts of time in there.

As I said earlier, my mare actually fell onto her knees when dozing off in her stable because she wasn't lying down and getting REM sleep.

I don't get your point the poster who said my approach to bedding drove her nuts said it because my horses have bedding and mats .
Hence my post about the welfare aspect of being driven nuts by things.
I have been pretty clear including posting about the need for rem sleep at the beginning of the thread about what my view is about apporiate ways to bed horses .

 

[Annagain]

See, when I tried mats with my mare, it WAS impacting on her welfare, which is why they were got rid of immediately.

I do think that they can impact on welfare where certain horses are concerned. I have seen some stables in which they work fine with some horses, but the others are in a heck of a state and not lying down at all. Ok of course if they are only in a couple of hours a day, but not when they are spending large amounts of time in there.

As I said earlier, my mare actually fell onto her knees when dozing off in her stable because she wasn't lying down and getting REM sleep.

Surely it was the lack of bedding on top of the mats that caused that, not the mats themselves? I would have just used a thicker bed on top rather than take the mats away. As I said my boy has matting throughout his very large stable and a medium thickness bed on the back third for weeing on and lying down. I wouldn't leave him with just a sprinkling but I do use less bedding a a result of the matting as otherwise he'd have to have all his 18' x14' stable bedded down to cover the concrete.

 

[Shutterbug]

We have a yard nearby where liveries are provided with a minimal sprinking of shavings as the YO spent a fortune on mats - they do full livery. I would not have my horse there because of that. My horses are all on mats, all have half a bed and its a good sized thickness. They get a full muck out every day, beds left up and I go through a bale a week for each of them. Wouldnt have it any other way. I dislike seeing horses on mats with a sprinkling of shavings - my WB won't pee on mats and even if I leave the bed up if hes in during the day, I still have to leave a pile of shavings down for him at his pee spot as he hates splash back. My youngster loves to lie down and he wont lie down on anything other than a nice thick bed and my other boy is 23 so needs all the softness of shavings for his legs.

 

[Moomin1]

Surely it was the lack of bedding on top of the mats that caused that, not the mats themselves? I would have just used a thicker bed on top rather than take the mats away. As I said my boy has matting throughout his very large stable and a medium thickness bed on the back third for weeing on and lying down. I wouldn't leave him with just a sprinkling but I do use less bedding a a result of the matting as otherwise he'd have to have all his 18' x14' stable bedded down to cover the concrete.

She did have a layer of bedding on top. It was ringing wet and stinking every morning - used to take me double the time to shovel out, rinse and get rid of the horrendous smell, and I was using twice the amount of bedding as I was having to replace the whole lot each day. She's a huge 16.3 hunter type who is very messy. Since having her on deep litter, she lies down every night, and her bed is spotlessly clean and takes half the time to muck out each morning.

Personally, I just don't see the point in having mats with a meium/thick bed on top. May as well just put the bed down without the mats IMO.

 

[holeymoley]

I know of so,some who boasts about the fact it takes her 2minutes to clean out her stables because she uses rubber mats on half of it and a sprinkling of cheap sawdust from the sawmill.
Personally , I wouldn't do this for various reasons - wouldn't use sawdust , surely it's hardly absorbent? , smell must be awful in stable and on rugs etc

My boy has a fairly large bed out of shavings but he doesn't have rubber matting. If your horse is absolutely terrible in a stable then rubber matting with enough shavings to soak up wee is acceptable IMO, but in general even if you use rubber mats I like to see a decent bed ! I know even if I leave the bed up after mucking out and I've brought my horse in, if he needs a wee he pulls some bedding down, so surely with hardly anything down it could cause reluctance to pee?! Also capped hocks etc

 

[Goldenstar]

She did have a layer of bedding on top. It was ringing wet and stinking every morning - used to take me double the time to shovel out, rinse and get rid of the horrendous smell, and I was using twice the amount of bedding as I was having to replace the whole lot each day. She's a huge 16.3 hunter type who is very messy. Since having her on deep litter, she lies down every night, and her bed is spotlessly clean and takes half the time to muck out each morning.

Personally, I just don't see the point in having mats with a meium/thick bed on top. May as well just put the bed down without the mats IMO.

I really disagree with this view the mats provide protection when the horses pile up their beds and roll about shifting the bedding all over the place .
They are warm .
They provide concussion protection should the horse be in the box when the bed is not down here that would be in the morning I between the girls mucking out and putting the beds down .
Mine are very non slip much more so than concrete .
My horses lie down and sleep a great deal one will lie in rem sleep during the day in summer .
My latest purchase was on mats with a small amount of straw in his previous home he stank .
He spend the first three weeks here lying and sleeping .