Standing martingale - taken it off and now what?

[Angelbones]

Hi, recently bought a hunting pony for my 9 yr old daughter (to have next year after the current one). Lovely pony, not strong, well behaved, knows his job. He has been ridden for 4 years with a standing martingale on - doesn't need it as far as we can see and would rather not use one. However - having taken it off he is chucking his head around all over the place, and I'm thinking that he is just 'finding his head / neck' after all this time. He also seems to be very sensitive in the mouth - having been ridden/relying on the noseband basically for all this time. What to do? Have tried running martingale but it has to be very short to come into play (hes quite close coupled with a good neck, and carries himself quite upright), have had teeth done (they were really awful) and am sticking to his old bit for now as it's what he used to (rubber Kimblewick but have taken chain off). Daughter has very light hands but obviously needs to take a check, turn, halt etc at some point and he doesn't like it. My plan was to have a good year of calm hacking out, basic schooling (he doesn't seem to have done anything other than hunt, gung ho, in a straight line!) and let him settle, before anyone takes him hunting. I'd like to get him sorted not just for hunting but for pc stuff too.

Just wondered if anyone else out there has had to retrain a neddy after taking off a standing martingale and how they got on? Any suggestions? I really don't think this is a headshaking problem, just adapting.

He is 13.3 and I'm too big to ride him so also thought about getting in a small capable adult to do some flat work with him - he doesn't need anyone getting tough with him, just gently teaching to accept leg aids, hands etc. He is 8 now, but hasn't done anything like that before - just hunted since coming from Ireland as a 4 yr old so he's missed a bit of his education I think.

 

[angiebaby]

I'm in exactly the same position at the minute! except mine is a 16 year old 15.1 tb x who has spent years team chasing.
My ri has given me some exercises; mostly stretching, in circles with a loose contact. He just doesn't seem to bend at all! Out hacking on my own he's not too bad, but with someone else he gets so excited the head comes straight up and he hollows. I am getting his back looked at next week , so you could look into getting your ponies done. I would probably get some private lessons too

 

[Damnation]

Maybe you should get a small adult to school the ponio, or a good Riding Instructor that can help you and your daughter school him and give you some exercises just to chill him? They will be able to give you a better opinion about whats going on with your new one because she will see what the pony is doing.
Hope this helps

 

[Orangehorse]

If the standing martingale is only coming into use when the pony gets his head too high, which is how it should be fitted, then keep it on. It is fitted to a cavesson noseband I take it. Much better than a bang on the face which is mighty painful.


If he has been pulling against it and has a very over-developed muscle underneath his neck, then it is going to be a long process, and might never really get right, although it has been done.

It could be a good idea to get a small adult to come and school him (I think it would be better if they came to you rather than you send the pony away), and then teach your child what she does. You might be able to improve the pony sufficiently to do a dressage test, for instance, but I expect that when he gets excited, doing jumping or cross country, he is going to revert to "head up."

I had a mad pony from Ireland and I can remember schooling him by doing circles round and in between tiny jumps, keep changing direction and then popping him over a jump, it certainly slowed him down and made him listen to me more, although when the blood was up it was a case of point and steer and trust to luck. He won quite a lot though.

 

[1alex1moose]

You could alway try a standing martingale with an elastic insert - a little more freedom but still can't break your nose! Might be a good half way house between standing and running?

Have you got someone who could school him in a Market Harborough or similar to teach him to stop throwing his head? Or maybe ride him in a grass rein type set up?

Ponies are clever devils so he's probably learnt that by throwing his head around he can pull the reins off a child and zoom off wherever he likes!!

 

[Angelbones]

Fortunately he's not the type to zoom off, and in fact although gets very 'busy' when he's frustrated or wants to head off, he doesn't actually go anywhere / do anything, other than toss his head a bit. He gets more 'tossy' when we touch grass or bridle path as I think he is still in the hunting zone, but this I'm sure we sort out by just keeping it calm for the foreseeable future until he learns to disassociate the two. So far he hasn't chucked his head so far back that he's been in danger of headbutting the rider but of course this is always a possibility. My niece hacked him the other day for me, he was an angel, we even took him up the gallops and he was on the buckle the whole way and all she had to do to stop was sit deep, but he danced a tad before setting off up the hill and we told her to put her leg on and ride him through it, which seemed to help as he can get a bit bouncy when he tosses his head as he loses forward momentum whilst the back end is still working (does that make sense?). Anyway, I think I've found a tallish but lightweight dressage rider who may be able to come and school him for me and give me her opinion / tips. Gosh I wish it was still the school hols so we could work on it daily with my daughter but have to wait for half term now to get her stuck in again.

I have no problem putting the standing martingale on again for hunting, espesh at first, so daughter has good safe day out. She won't be jumping in it (I'm not keen on the idea of jumping in a standing or am I overly concerned)) as she hasn't got the courage to jump whilst hunting yet, but it may give her a quieter ride, though I'd really like to have him weaned off it by then in an ideal world.

Orangehorse - He does have a thick neck with muscle underneath so perhaps I'm doomed afterall!

Alex_buster - I've seen those attachments (to breastplate which I have) and I agree it really could be a good compromise, but haven't found one in a pony size and he is so short I think a cob would swamp him. If you see one about, please let me know!

Many thanks guys, any more ideas please keep them coming!

 

[dieseldog]

I think that the Standing Martingale was probably doing a lot more than you thought it was as he is now 'chucking his head all over the place'. If he went well in it I would put it back on, as long as it is fitted properly they are fine to jump in as well.

The last thing you want to do is scare your daughter and if he is safer and your daughter feels happier riding him in a standing why take it off?

You can still do all your reschooling and calming him down because as long as the standing is fitted properly it won't come into play if he behaves.

 

[Angelbones]

DieselDog you make very good sense! And obviously if it comes down to it for safety/confidence reasons the pony will still wear it. I don't know why I feel so anti the standing martingale except that you don't see them used on kids ponies much, and I hate people who use all the kit in the world on ponies without good reason, experience or results and I tend to go the opposite way I guess. I've only ever heard people talk about standings with derision. I know this is the insecure/snob in me but I don't want people to look at them out and about and think the pony must be a nutter 'strapped down like that' or that we are fools for using one in the first place. I also feel sorry for the poor pony who came over from Ireland aged 4, was allegedly just stuck in that tack as that is what all their hunters wear, and ridden that way until now, without any opportunity to mature and learn and prove himself without one. At 8 I'd like to think that he could be re-educated but perhaps that's foolish of me. Thanks for your post - I could do with you here tapping me on the shoulder and saying 'get a grip' more often than I'd like to admit!