Still struggling with weeing dog

Penny Less

Penny Less

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Posted some time ago about rescue spaniel who wees indoors. Tried all the suggestions from posters. Standing out in the garden with her until she goes, didnt work and now its been raining non stop so Ive given that up! Getting another dog to wee in the garden so she smells it and it encourages her. Didnt work.
Currently she goes for a walk at about 8.30am when she wees and again about 2 - 3 when she wees, always out on a walk off lead. I have been skulking in the local park at 8 - 9 in the evening in the dark to see if she'll go and she very rarely does, so during the night she wees in the conservatory instead ! Im at a loss to crack this, she doesnt drink a lot . Any other ideas welcome!
 
When my dog was doing this I taught her to wee on command. Every time she did squatted to wee I said “go for a wee” and then plenty of praise when she’d been. Eventually she got it and knew the routine of going just before bed.

You also need to stop her using her ‘toilet’. If it even remotely smells she’ll just think it’s ok to go there. Are you able to stop her going in the conservatory overnight? We had a mat that our dog weed on. After she’d done it once it became a bit of a habit. we threw the rug out and the problem was solved.
 
Its difficult to tell her its not OK when she is doing it overnight, its no good telling her in the morning ! Meleeka, Id rather she went in the conservatory on the tiles rather than on the carpet like she used to. Ive tried the praising when she does wee when shes out. Never had this with a bitch before. Im wondering if I should speak to a behavourist or if they would just tell me to do what Ive been doing anyway.
I need to sort this before she has to be rehomed as its a big no no with most people.
 
Sounds as if she’s been scorned for peeing in the past by a human, hence why she freely goes when off the lead on a walk, but wont go when youre near her in the garden, or on lead.
Also shes holding it to wait for you to go to bed, and then she does it while youre not looking...when she *thinks* its safe and wont be scorned.
The pattern here is she wont pee near or in eye sight humans, theres a reason for that. All dogs ive had are fine peeing right close by. Young and old dogs.

My brother had a rescue that would hold it all day despite walks on lead, and then at night relieved herself on the kitchen tiles, 2-3 pools, it was everywhere. She went back to the centre. He had 2 rescues, that became too much for him. Another dominant dog was in the household, adding to her anxiety. Very timid dog.

The old fashioned way to scorn for messing in the house is still used today, learnt visually down the generstions, thats how you ‘train a dog’. I dont want a dog to be well behaved because its scared of me, loyalty and fabulous behaviour is earnt by helping the dog trust you, and wanting to be in your pack.

Can you let her off lead in your garden? Im presuming not due to you having to go to the park..or am i making assumptions?
If you can let her off lead in your garden, allow her to go out every four hours. Alone. Everytime you let her out say happily, encouragingly, ‘go for wee’ or some short phrase like that.
She’ll do her business if needed. Try to spy on her to see if she goes. When she does open the door, call her, and praise her avidly. Give her a treat even, to try to replace peeing is wrong belief with peeing is good.
Within a short while youll find her sitting by the garden door to tell you she needs to go out to pee.

If she continues in the conservatory during the night while the outside training is ongoing, dont say anything to her or react. soak it up with plenty of absorbant kitchen towels and then without her seeing/being with you, put those urine scented towels outside in your garden, where you want her to pee, where its a good distance from the house door.

You and her have breakfast as usual, morning routine stuff, then put a lead on her if she cant be loose in the garden, and take a stroll around the garden, passing the kitchen towels you previously put out there. She’ll smell them, smell her own smell, you in that moment say ‘good girl’ , she’ll link her smell in the garden with praise. It may induce her to pee, smelling her own smell. Allow her to go where she wants, react how she wants. Continue the walk around, maybe passing the towels again, repeat praise. She may or may not pee on this first go, But it gives you a chance to ‘re-write’ her memory of her peeing OUTSIDE as good, while the indoor pee events she perceives no emotional or verbal reaction from you, no annoyance nor praise. Dogs pick up our moods instantly. A scorned dog particularly will sense annoyance easily.

Just know there may be pee in the conservatory in the morning, or maybe it will remain clean and dry some nights. Have unconditional patience about it in your attitude towards this, literally even try to make is no big deal in your own mind, and not an issue. I bet before you go to bed the thought crosses your mind about her peeing in there! We, in our reactions to animals,are the key that closes the circle for the behaviour to repeat if we get bothered by it.

I know animals messing in the house is not our preference, nor theirs once they learn to do it outside. It just takes some time to re-train an animals mind who associates their toileting actions with angry humans and possibly pain/fear.

Let me know about your garden being enclosed or not as option 1 suggested above needs altering if not.
 
I have a terrier who was an unclaimed stray. She will pee in the kitchen if she is left loose in the house overnight. I started having her in her cage overnight. Now she comes up to the bedroom overnight but the door has to be shut. I have now had her 6 years and she will still go down and pee in the kitchen if the bedroom door is left open.
 
Hector was not house trained when I found him 5 years ago (5 YEARS, how did that happen???).

We crated him whenever we could not be closely watching. He did not like to sit in his own wee so learned to do it outside. Only took about a week, and he was already a mature dog. He is now reliable inside his own home, but still pees everywhere if we take him elsewhere.
 
I would go back to house training as if she were a pup. Take outside often. Every time she's fed Every time she wakes up. First thing in the morning. Last thing at night and anytime in between. Reward like mad anytime she she goes in the right place. You can put a cue to it. When she goes just say your chosen word as she performs. It will take a whi!e and will take effort but it's the best way. If she does have accidents make sure you clean up well afterwards as any lingering smell will encourage her to go there.
 
Purbee, I can let her loose in the garden but its only a small courtyard. She has the opportunity to go out several times a day.
I will try your suggestion of transferring the peed on newspaper to the garden. She came from a puppy breeding establishment so was never trained and probably just had to go in the kennel/cage , she is nearly 10 now Ive had her just over the year!
 
Is the dog a nervy sort? We have a highly nervous Italian Greyhound. It took me 2 years to get her to be clean at night.Eventually, she had a small carrier to sleep in with newspaper that was shredded as bedding (she used to pee her bed and lay in it) she had a nightlight and the radio on switched to the world service. Having tried all these things independently it wasn't until we brought them all together that she finally relaxed and went outside and came in and slept. Over time we dropped all the bedtime things and she happily sleeps with our other dogs now. I wonder if a similar regime may help your dog to relax and get the message.
 
Penny Less said:
Purbee, I can let her loose in the garden but its only a small courtyard. She has the opportunity to go out several times a day.
I will try your suggestion of transferring the peed on newspaper to the garden. She came from a puppy breeding establishment so was never trained and probably just had to go in the kennel/cage , she is nearly 10 now Ive had her just over the year!
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Great idea, you have her peeing on newspaper already, put the newspaper out.
As has been suggested, concrete/hard surface area may put her off...maybe theyre like horses and the splashing and getting their back feet accidently peed on puts them off! Concrete doesnt absorb pee, it becomes a puddle that can run onto their feet.

Once she sniffs the peepaper outside, have times throughout the day to let her out on her own, praise her greatly when she does pee outside, a tasty treat to affirm the message would help in this case.
She will realise that the indoor peeing doesnt earn her praise or treat and only outside peeing does..eventually. Then she should go to the garden door by herself to be let out to pee...and youll have cracked it. Continue with praise, treats after she does start to sit by the door to indicate she wants to go out...and gently phase out the treats when its a firm, fixed behaviour and she’s been weeks not peeing in the house. When letting her back in there’s no reason to not say ‘good girl’ praise...but eventually she wont need the praise because pee and outside is a combined reality fixed in her mind, new behaviour habit engrained.

She’s been in a kennel 9 yrs at a breeding farm?...then that kennel mentality is driven deep into her. They say you cant teach an old dog new tricks due to repeated conditioned behaviour, but with perseverance its possible. Shes peed where she has slept, her whole life. Its no surprise shes continuing that behaviour, despite in a house.

A dog doesnt have a concept of inside/outside as being any different. She was allowed to pee where she lived and slept her whole life. She cant be told at 10yrs old thats wrong, itll seriously confuse this particular dog. She just needs to be encouraged to instill a new habit.

Some better kennels allows dogs out several times a day to run around, toilet, play and exercise. Most dont unfortunately and those dogs end up with ‘kennel brain’.
Do you know what was on the floor of the kennels for them to pee on? Normally concrete and kennels hosed out regularly.
If youre able to mimic the flooring she had to pee on, it could help.
Or get some turf rolls as suggested, rolled out to a small square to encourage her if she was a dog let out on grass to toilet at a kennel.

When you let her out in the garden, and she doesnt go and shes sat at the door wanting to come in, dont overly praise her, just say hiya and be happy to see her, but no overt praise.
Give the full on praise and treat only when you definitely see shes had a pee outside.
Youll be so happy full of eureka energy, itll be easy to praise her! :D
 
Penny Less said:
Posted some time ago about rescue spaniel who wees indoors. Tried all the suggestions from posters. Standing out in the garden with her until she goes, didnt work and now its been raining non stop so Ive given that up! Getting another dog to wee in the garden so she smells it and it encourages her. Didnt work.
Currently she goes for a walk at about 8.30am when she wees and again about 2 - 3 when she wees, always out on a walk off lead. I have been skulking in the local park at 8 - 9 in the evening in the dark to see if she'll go and she very rarely does, so during the night she wees in the conservatory instead ! Im at a loss to crack this, she doesnt drink a lot . Any other ideas welcome!
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Check for a uti. Treat her like a pup and take her into the garden every hour and encourage a wee (regardless if it’s raining). OTT praise when she pees. Stick a coat on her in case she’s getting cold?
 
Nothing useful to add except i'm feeling your pain!
Little Miss Collie came to stay end of August. We're still struggling with it. I'm now off for two weeks so hoping that we can really work on it in the meantime!
 
Another weeless trip out to the park . 7 hours since her last wee so she should need one .Im beginning to wonder if she doesnt like being out in the dark ! Sandstone, I have a roll of artificial grass outside but she wont go near it. I can actually live with her peeing in the conservatory myself its the rehoming that is driving the need to crack this! Its a year on and still its happening. In the summer months when I have left the conservatory door to the garden open all night she did start going outside, but really dont want to do this for security of course, and also at the moment it leaves the house blimming freezing. I will keep at it and hope fora miracle.
 
Penny Less said:
Another weeless trip out to the park . 7 hours since her last wee so she should need one .Im beginning to wonder if she doesnt like being out in the dark ! Sandstone, I have a roll of artificial grass outside but she wont go near it. I can actually live with her peeing in the conservatory myself its the rehoming that is driving the need to crack this! Its a year on and still its happening. In the summer months when I have left the conservatory door to the garden open all night she did start going outside, but really dont want to do this for security of course, and also at the moment it leaves the house blimming freezing. I will keep at it and hope fora miracle.
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it would be worth trying real grass. Artificial isn't going to have the same smells. If you put it down and get another dog to wee on it if possible. A couple of squares of turf would probably be enough. It's not surprising shes weeing overnight if she's hanging on so long. Sounds like she's not ever been house trained properly.
I'd honestly try the turf and going right back to basics with house training.
It's not good for her to hang on so long that she's desperate.
 
Our young rescue took 4 months to settle before she was fully house trained. We decided it was because she felt safe in the house to drop her guard & wee. She would never wee outside if she was on a lead.
 
I think that you may be right that she is afraid of the dark. Don't know how you would deal with that, try feeding her just outside door in the dark and gradually move food further into garden ? Try throwing a handful of kibble out into garden for her to sniff for, that might also activate need to pee ?? (Is she food orientated?)
 
gunnerdg cant put a flap in my patio doors I dont think, can you install in double glazed panels ? Mind you not worth the expense for the next few months. Ill keep on with the other methods and see what happens.

Nice but naughty. Actually just sold my dog crate, but would have hesitated to use it as she may have spent a lot of her life in a crate or cage.
 
My pup does NOT like going outside for a wee/poo late at night, particularly if it is raining so I have found a solution in putting on the yard lights and letting him go in the straw shed; clearly feeling straw under him is enough and the lights help too! I wonder if providing a 'pen' with some straw in might encourage her though it may be untidy for you. Otherwise I would use puppy mats (I wouldn't for a pup but for an older dog possibly) and once you have success with those, gradually move the mats/pads outside or just use them in the conservatory so that any mess/smell is minimised. She will be a creature of habit and once you start to create a new habit you may find progress is swift. It is lovely that you are persevering with her so!! :)
 
Penny Less said:
cant put a flap in my patio doors I dont think, can you install in double glazed panels ? Mind you not worth the expense for the next few months. Ill keep on with the other methods and see what happens.
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Just to let you know that, yes, it can be done.
https://www.theglazingpeople.co.uk/dog-cat-flaps-double-glazing-glass-upvc-patio-doors/
No idea on cost, but could be worth the cost of a phone call to find out.
Just thinking, if she is happy with it, it may improve her chances of being re-homed.

Sorry you find yourself in this situation.
 
get yourself a small crate - or even better one of the fabric ones. Make it super cosy and initially have her in it beside you for short spells, eg when you are eating lunch. Once you see she is happy , take her beside you in your bedroom at night in it. I would put decent money on that stopping the problem and in time... you can transition her out of it.
 
So sorry just to get this straight - and I may very well have got things wrong so I apologise in advance if I have - this is a (??)10 year old ex-puppy farm brood bitch who you have had about a year now and have failed to house train in that time, but who you are now looking to re-home again? I think I read you had her spayed fairly recently too, did you ask the vets about the house training issues you were encountering?

I would hope that the rescue charity that you got her from (assuming that was the route, again I may be very wrong so many apologies if I am) would be able to give you help and support about the house training and the re-homing?

You can pick up a dog crate second hand for about £10 on local selling Facebook pages and the like, I'm afraid you have no chance of training her without using one of those. Also I'm really not surprised she is peeing in the house overnight if she gets taken out at 8.30am and 3.30pm, my lot would never cope with that. I see you have added in an 8.30pm outing, it really is a matter of you taking as long as it needs for her to go whether it is cold dark and raining or not - ah the joys of dog ownership :D
 
Levrier I will be rehoming her because I have terminal cancer and there is nobody to take her over. I have managed to get her from pooing and weeing in the house to overnight weeing in the conservatory. She gets a late walk but does not wee however long I stay out in the pitch black in the park. The summer was not a problem, I think she doesnt like being out in the dark.
 
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