Strikes and riding at xmas

[MrsMurs]

I haven’t heard this official advice, but I won’t be doing anything different. Personally, I always risk assess for prevention, I always make my riding as safe as possible for myself and my horse, I never take unnecessary risks.
sadly it seems our system is broken, but in which case it needs fixing, not this continued ideation that people need to be nannied or restricted continuously.

 

[blitznbobs]

I guess the way i look at it is the problem is not going to go away any time soon. People need more money to live. Liz truss tried just giving people more money snd it sent the whole economy into a spiral which would have caused mega inflation …To give the nurses 1 % pay rise costs 800 million pounds a year 19% = 15
Billion. If we do this because there are so many nurses and other nhs employees (nhs is one of the biggest employers in the world) then this would cause more inflation thus everyone else ends up paying more tax and earning less money in real terms.
There is no easy solution that a national government can impose. The answer is that the NHS is unsustainable without massive reform but no government is willing (or able) to do this because its political suicide. So everyone suffers. The NHS will collapse - it has relied on the good will of staff for way too long but that will is basically dead. I left the nhs from a senior position 5 years ago because I couldn’t and wasn’t allowed to do my job to a standard that I was happy with and i had the means to quit…

Im not sure how bad the NHS has to get before people can see that it is no longer fit for purpose but until the will of the people is to see a fundamental change then we will have strikes and unrest for a long time.

 

[Abi90]

I guess the way i look at it is the problem is not going to go away any time soon. People need more money to live. Liz truss tried just giving people more money snd it sent the whole economy into a spiral which would have caused mega inflation …To give the nurses 1 % pay rise costs 800 million pounds a year 19% = 15
Billion. If we do this because there are so many nurses and other nhs employees (nhs is one of the biggest employers in the world) then this would cause more inflation thus everyone else ends up paying more tax and earning less money in real terms.
There is no easy solution that a national government can impose. The answer is that the NHS is unsustainable without massive reform but no government is willing (or able) to do this because its political suicide. So everyone suffers. The NHS will collapse - it has relied on the good will of staff for way too long but that will is basically dead. I left the nhs from a senior position 5 years ago because I couldn’t and wasn’t allowed to do my job to a standard that I was happy with and i had the means to quit…

Im not sure how bad the NHS has to get before people can see that it is no longer fit for purpose but until the will of the people is to see a fundamental change then we will have strikes and unrest for a long time.

Excellent, realistic response

also, I’m sure that I heard on the radio this morning that the Paramedics Union are planning on postponing further strikes until after Xmas but I might be wrong

 

[Skib]

From another perspective, I ride every Tuesday and unless it is icey, I intend to ride next Tuesday as usual. I ride a safe horse, whom I know well and we ride a track which both mare and I also know well. Riding prevents the winter depression which used to plague me and also (together with walking) helps to keep me physically fit and agile. I have ridden for 21 years without once requiring an ambulance. So the odds are that my ride will be OK.

I always think how lucky I am to be out there on a horse. It is a childhood dream come true.

 

[Jenko109]

Not entirely related, but remember when Covid first started and loads of people stopped riding out as they would have to touch gates etc and the risk of ended up in hospitals which were overwhelmed.

I recall reading countless stories of people pulling up to riders in their cars and yelling abuse at them for 'selfishly' riding. People lost the plot. There were posts all over facebook and indeed on here of people condemning those who were still riding as the devils spawn.

I'm glad this post hasnt gone in the same directions.

 

[oldjumper]

The largest number of accidents occur in the home. So, no housework for me in the foreseeable! Happy Christmas

 

[Abacus]

Some of the examples above of ‘when you don’t need an ambulance’ seem wrong to me. A broken bone needs proper stabilising. An appendix, ideally, needs the rapidity of travel that ambulances are meant to provide (assuming they don’t then have to wait at the doors for hours). As a sensible but non-medical person, I don’t want to judge whether my friends fall has destabilised her neck and she should be professionally handled. I believe that the cases of calling an ambulance unnecessarily are different to these above and are more:- children with fevers, non-urgent conditions, minor falls. And actually these excessive calls are only part of the problem - the hospital backlog and full beds make ambulance responses slow and ineffective. My understanding is that the strikes (at least among paramedics) are as much about the broken system as about pay rises.

 

[Burnttoast]

I guess the way i look at it is the problem is not going to go away any time soon. People need more money to live. Liz truss tried just giving people more money snd it sent the whole economy into a spiral which would have caused mega inflation …To give the nurses 1 % pay rise costs 800 million pounds a year 19% = 15 Billion. If we do this because there are so many nurses and other nhs employees (nhs is one of the biggest employers in the world) then this would cause more inflation thus everyone else ends up paying more tax and earning less money in real terms.

Truss may have cut taxes but she didn't put any more money into the pockets of people who would have used it in the real economy. The issue was that she had no way of paying for any of it, which spooked the markets. Anyway, wage rises now are not going to cause inflation. It's supply led, not demand led this time, and almost all wage rises have so far been well below RPI. The only people getting above inflation pay deals are CEOs. And no one expects 19%. It's what's called a negotiating position and gives you some idea of what would be required to actually get nurses back to where they were a decade ago in real terms. The government is not prepared to actually enter negotiations. Hence the current situation.

 

[Ample Prosecco]

The problem is the use of the ambulance service is totally wrong. If you have appendicitis, why would you call an ambulance if you could be driven to the nearest hospital.

Similarly a broken boke that's simple ie not totally mangled or a bone sticking out. if you can be driven to the hospital, you should.

Because it was 2am and she was writhing on the floor in agony so couldn’t possibly drive herself and they have 3 very young children. And no family close by. It is not a misuse of ambulance services for critically ill or significantly injured people to use then. And it is much easier for A&E Departments when people come in by ambulance because they ring ahead and give a good handover. Seriously ill people making their own way actually cause more problems. As no one knows anything about them

 

[blitznbobs]

Because it was 2am and she was writhing on the floor in agony so couldn’t possibly drive herself and they have 3 very young children. And no family close by. It is not a misuse of ambulance services for critically ill or significantly injured people to use then. And it is much easier for A&E Departments when people come in by ambulance because they ring ahead and give a good handover. Seriously ill people making their own way actually cause more problems. As no one knows anything about them

I was an A and E doctor for the best part of 20 years and can categorically state that we don’t care how people get there. There is no advantage to us of people arriving in an ambulance except you have an extra pair of hands to carry them in, A and E medics and nurses are trained to expect the unexpected, once in the department people are triaged again and just because you came in an ambulance doesn’t give you any priority nor does coming in a car put you at the back of the queue. the advantage of an ambulance is only to the patient in as much as they can have O2 on board or sometimes start some treatment on board or occasionally take to a more appropriate destination (like if having a heart attack take to a centre where they can do emergency angios / stents) but as a medical professional I’d rather the person was in the department than waiting 2, 3 , 4 hours for an ambulance.

 

[Ample Prosecco]

Also re broken bones, when Izzy broke her arm I drove her to z local hospital. It needed surgery so we had to wait for an ambulance transfer to a bigger hospital with operating theatres. They would not allow me to drive her as their risk protocols made it clear that the bone needed to be stabilised and she then needed to be kept still.

 

[Ample Prosecco]

I was an A and E doctor for the best part of 20 years and can categorically state that we don’t care how people get there. There is no advantage to us of people arriving in an ambulance except you have an extra pair of hands to carry them in, A and E medics and nurses are trained to expect the unexpected, once in the department people are triaged again and just because you came in an ambulance doesn’t give you any priority nor does coming in a car put you at the back of the queue. the advantage of an ambulance is only to the patient in as much as they can have O2 on board or sometimes start some treatment on board or occasionally take to a more appropriate destination (like if having a heart attack take to a centre where they can do emergency angios / stents) but as a medical professional I’d rather the person was in the department than waiting 2, 3 , 4 hours for an ambulance.

Plenty of A&E staff were quoted in the press on a strike day saying they were concerned about the advice for people to make their own way there because they would have no idea who was turning up. I was once sat in A&E for ages having made my own way there when I should have been seen critically as when I finally passed out and my blood pressure was barely registering I was immediately upgraded to resus where I should have been all along. And I had a suspected broken back. So they freaked about that too and got me on a board after I’d been sitting on chair for several hours. Feedback: next time phone an ambulance!

I would now of course make my own way there. But the point I’m making is that broken bones, serious illness are not misuses of ambulances. And it should NOT take hours and hours to get help.

 

[Barton Bounty]

It shouldn’t but sadly it does, I am in between two hospitals, one is a minor injury unit that people should be fully aware that, serious emergencies etc cannot go there. The other hospital is an A & E and will deal with broken bones etc.. but no ENT unit, the ENT is 21 miles away. So when I had a quinsy and ended up with blood poisoning, I knew there was no point in going to the local hospital as they would only transfer me.
I think if the public were educated in where to go with their types of injuries and illnesses, it would make life so much easier.

 

[cauda equina]

But people don't always know what is wrong with them, especially when panicked and frightened
Expecting lay people to triage themselves efficiently is unreasonable imo

 

[Barton Bounty]

Im not saying they should triage themselves ?? but dont to to a minor injury hospital with a broken leg , i dont think thats rocket science. ?

anyway its only my opinion that people should know where to go. They had no problem knowing what to do through covid when it was advertised every 4.5 minutes on tv. The government should be responsible for educating like they did through covid.
If its your ear nose and throat… then a hospital with that department. You wouldnt turn up to a local doctors with a broken bone ?.

 

[AmyMay]

To be fair, for appendicitis etc it would take less time to drive/taxi to a and e than it would to wait to speak to someone at 111! At least then, if you pass out in the waiting room, you can see a doctor immediately (as happened to two people while I was there recently).

We never considered calling an ambulance when I had suspected appendicitis. My oh just drove me to hospital, where I had surgery the next day.

 

[catembi]

But even with a broken leg, it's still tricky to know what to do... I fell over chasing one of the dogs a couple of years ago & was driven to A&E because I thought that my ankle was broken. I am not a dramatic person but it had blown up like a football. The hospital thought it was broken as well, but it wasn't. Soft tissue damage only, although they found a bone chip that I didn't know about from a previous accident 20 years ago...

So as it wasn't in fact broken, I could have gone to minor injuries, or indeed have strapped it up myself & taken OTC painkillers. But the thing is that I *didn't know* that it wasn't broken... And what I did 20 years ago was strap it up myself & crack on because I'd done it coming off my new 4 yo & didn't want a cast on it...and it healed stiff, whereas it might not have done if it had been treated properly at the time...?

 

[Tiddlypom]

The comparison with pressure being put on people to avoid horse riding or other risky pastimes early in lockdown #1 and the situation during the recent ambulance strike does not bear out.

Please remember the huge death toll from Covid amongst medical and nursing staff. It was completely understandable pre the vaccination roll outs to try to keep hospital admissions for any reason as low as possible when the staff were putting their own lives on the line as they continued working.

This time round, the risk is taken more by the injured party, not the hospital staff, except that the NHS is buckling under the pressure of impossible expectations leading to much burn out of those who work in it.

 

[Ample Prosecco]

And also to say be careful because there is a global pandemic and health services need us all to pull together to cope with it is one thing. Saying don’t live a normal life because we can’t fund or run remotely adequate health care services is very different.

 

[criso]

Im not saying they should triage themselves ?? but dont to to a minor injury hospital with a broken leg , i dont think thats rocket science. ?

anyway its only my opinion that people should know where to go. They had no problem knowing what to do through covid when it was advertised every 4.5 minutes on tv. The government should be responsible for educating like they did through covid.
If its your ear nose and throat… then a hospital with that department. You wouldnt turn up to a local doctors with a broken bone ?.

Here where to go changes depending on which hospital is least under pressure and if the paramedics don't know where they should go till they pick up, I don't see how the public can be expected to.

Someone downstairs got mugged and I called 111. I just called for advice, I didn't ask for an ambulance. They decided to send someone out though in the end they decided not to hospitalise. No one has a car, I had no money for a taxi, victim had no money having just been mugged.
Anyway they said if needed they wouldn't take him to the nearest hospital but another and they don't know till they pick up where they are going out of 3. None are particularly easy to get to and if we'd had to make our own way, I'd have headed for a 4th which though further away is on a decent tube line, no changes and not too far a walk from the tube station. However that wouldn't be an option with a broken limb.