Struggling so much with PTS

[Janah]

My boy had three issues going on and I chose to PTS after a long conversation with the vet. I could have gone down the route of more treatment, I choose not to go into more detail here.

I did think I made the right decision, and at odd moments am filled with guilt. Only you know your horses and only you know what is right for them. Only people who don't care PTS without a backwards glance. Your decision, your horses, who I am sure you have their very best interests at heart. A month too early is better than a day too late!

 

[Annagain]

I've been following your story too and agree that you need to try this option, as much for your sake as theirs. If it works, that's great, but if it doesn't at least you know you've tried everything and hopefully it will help you to feel less guilty (not that you should in the slightest as you've only ever wanted the best for them.)

A vet friend once said to me that the moment to PTS is when you move from the point of prolonging their lives to the point of prolonging their deaths. This has stuck with me and although it's been a question I have very fortunately not had to ask myself yet, it's something I hope I will be able to stick to.

Why do we do it eh? They come into our lives, cause us years of 6am starts/soakings/freezing toes and fingers, ruin our social lives, steal all our money, chuck us off, make us worry if they're wet/cold/hot/getting sunburn/too fat/too thin and then break our hearts at the end of it all.... and most of us take a deep breath and do it all over again!

 

[Luci07]

Do this for you and for your peace of mind. You have done so much, I think you need time to reach your own conclusions as the work and impacts will all be with you. If it doesn't work for you and your horses then so be it.

What about seeing if having them out overnight is enough? And in during the day for a short period? Pump more food into one and restrict the other? Seen various liveries keep this routine even in winter with horses that needed as much time out as possible without going out 24x7 and it did work.

 

[Zebedee]

Life would be so much easier for me if I PTS. I could get myself a new horse (or two) and could enjoy the fun parts again. Also it would be far cheaper. My mare costs me a fortune to keep going. Yes, it would be devastating at the time to go through with it, but I know that it would also be a relief and I could move on.

Could it be this aspect that's making the decision even harder for you? That there will be a sense of relief? If so you wouldn't be alone in experiencing those feelings. I've known people who put themselves through hell when having lost an elderly family (who had been requiring high levels of care) those feelings of relief start to creep in. It's a normal reaction & you shouldn't feel guilty over it x

I am not sure how the turn out is going to work TBH. Practical things like having to feed them in the field and my gelding (who's the boss, chasing my girl off her feed which has her al important meds). I can't bring them in for feeds as the sand turnout blocks the way to the fields and the others go out at 7 am. I also have the problem that they have completely different nutritional needs. My gelding is a TB who needs plenty of forage. My mare cannot have too much.

I feel really down at the moment, having thought it all through as I don't think it's going to work.

There are practical aspects here which will limit how much you are able to do. However as suggested could you make a small corral for feed times? How about using a low energy forage for them both & supplement the gelding via his hard feeds?

 

[touchstone]

This is where a track system could work for you - electric fence a strip around the perimeter of the field, have your mare in that and the gelding in the centre for more grass. Feeding is simply a case of putting feed/forage either side of the electric fencing and doesn't create any extra work as they are together and still separated.

I hope it gives you a bit more time with them, but don't feel guilty if it proves to be unworkable or not in their best interests. I think you are right to try for a while and see what happens or else you will always be wondering 'what if', but knowing when to draw the line is sensible.

 

[Wagtail]

Right, things have moved on somewhat. I am going to put my gelding out 24/7 in the field with the yearling. It will be better for the youngster as both myself and his owner have been concerned that 21 hours in a stable are not great at his age. This will mean that the other horses will be able to have more time out too (including my mare). They can have day long turnout instead of 3 hours. Hopefully this will help my girl too. Obviously, if my gelding does not get back to his usual frisky self and start moving better, then he will have to be PTS. Fingers crossed that this works for him.

 

[AmyMay]

Good plan. Good luck xx

 

[Wagtail]

Thanks Amymay.

And to everyone who has answered. I know I must drive you mad with this whole saga and the PTS/don't PTS. I am sorry. But your support is so appreciated. It really does help when I am struggling with guilt etc. I think I can say that if I try what the vet suggested, I can honestly say I have exhausted all options and if/when I have to make that final call, I will perhaps have no 'what ifs' haunting me.

Thank you.

 

[babymare]

I for one dont think You have driven us mad and you certainly have no reason at all to say sorry.Good luck as it sounds a plan. x x x

 

[Nitro mouse]

Hi Wagtail, I am usually more of a lurker, but I didn't wanted to read n run. Firstly a massive hug to you love it's a horrid situation for you to be in xxxxx
I sincerely hope the suggestions from the vet work, good to hear of the solution for turn out for your gelding.
You really are doing all you can for these guys, and I think all of us (despite differing opinions) all feel for your situation. Non of us can be in your shoes or see what is actually in front of you, so going on your vets advice and also what those who are also on your yard who see your horses daily should be able to help you too.
But you really have nothing to feel guilty about if things don't work. You have given your horses a lovely life and tried so hard to help them. Fingers crossed for you and your horses.

 

[LauraWheeler]

So glad thing are looking alittle more positive for you. I hope the new plan helps them. The worst thing with Lucy was that although she was so ill she still seemed so happy, so I know full well why you feel guilty about making that desition. As you say if this doesn't work then atleast you can say hand on heart you have tried everything to help them and to make them better. You know your horses and you will know when the time comes to say goodbye.
Please keep us updated on how you are all getting on. As I said before if you want to PM me anytime feel free (If you are driving everyone mad with your saga I hate to think what they thought of me when Lucy was ill.)
Sending you more ((((((((hugs)))))) and your two beautiful horses lots of ((((((((vibes))))))) xx

 

[SatansLittleHelper]

No advice just a huge hug...its a tough call and I respect your decision to try all things first..when its really time you wont need to ask and you wont feel bad because it will be right xxxxxxx

 

[AmyMay]

I just wanted to say one last thing Wagtail.

A few years ago I had a horse who was struggling with a few issues and I was struggling with what to do.

I called the vet and we discussed the situation. I told him my thoughts about putting the horse down.

He gave the horse a thorough examination, commented on how magnificent he looked and then told me that putting him down would not be the wrong decision.

The vet was a horse man through and through and endlessly practical.

I hope this is useful - I took enormous comfort from it.

 

[Wagtail]

I just wanted to say one last thing Wagtail.

A few years ago I had a horse who was struggling with a few issues and I was struggling with what to do.

I called the vet and we discussed the situation. I told him my thoughts about putting the horse down.

He gave the horse a thorough examination, commented on how magnificent he looked and then told me that putting him down would not be the wrong decision.

The vet was a horse man through and through and endlessly practical.

I hope this is useful - I took enormous comfort from it.

Thanks AM. The vet did say to me that she would PTS if for any reason it did not work out, or, indeed if it proved impractical or even financially not viable. I said if I could afford two ridden horses I could afford two non ridden horses but that I was concerned for their welfare above all other things. She also would PTS without question should I simply request it. However, as a vet she felt duty bound to suggest anything that she felt may help. I asked her what she would do if they were hers. She said she would try what she had suggested before putting to sleep and that was her honest answer. She does have a huge soft spot for my gelding though and I think she would find it very hard emotionally herself to put him to sleep. When I heard it was this vet coming, I was a bit worried I may not get a totally unbiased opinion regarding my boy. She has always said what a genuine and kind soul he is. Mainly because she saw him through all of his painful veterinary treatment and he was always so impeccably behaved and gentle at all times, despite the pain he was going through.

I do sometimes think that vets try to keep them going, not just for their own financial reasons but because it must be the worst part of the job having to PTS.

 

[Wagtail]

So glad thing are looking alittle more positive for you. I hope the new plan helps them. The worst thing with Lucy was that although she was so ill she still seemed so happy, so I know full well why you feel guilty about making that desition. As you say if this doesn't work then atleast you can say hand on heart you have tried everything to help them and to make them better. You know your horses and you will know when the time comes to say goodbye.
Please keep us updated on how you are all getting on. As I said before if you want to PM me anytime feel free (If you are driving everyone mad with your saga I hate to think what they thought of me when Lucy was ill.)
Sending you more ((((((((hugs)))))) and your two beautiful horses lots of ((((((((vibes))))))) xx

No advice just a huge hug...its a tough call and I respect your decision to try all things first..when its really time you wont need to ask and you wont feel bad because it will be right xxxxxxx

Hi Wagtail, I am usually more of a lurker, but I didn't wanted to read n run. Firstly a massive hug to you love it's a horrid situation for you to be in xxxxx
I sincerely hope the suggestions from the vet work, good to hear of the solution for turn out for your gelding.
You really are doing all you can for these guys, and I think all of us (despite differing opinions) all feel for your situation. Non of us can be in your shoes or see what is actually in front of you, so going on your vets advice and also what those who are also on your yard who see your horses daily should be able to help you too.
But you really have nothing to feel guilty about if things don't work. You have given your horses a lovely life and tried so hard to help them. Fingers crossed for you and your horses.

Thank you.

 

[Mahoganybay]

I think that the fact that you are on here voicing your concerns about pts indicates that you are not yet happy with the decision to do so. Not in a selfish way you must understand but in a way that your horses have not told you it is time.

I too struggled with the decision to put my lovely mare to sleep, she had various injuries / issues (i won't bore with the details) suffice to say i spent £5k on my insurance, spent 18 months trying everything, again won't bore with the details, but you name it and i tried, i felt that i had to give her every chance.

I too did not know how i could plan her death, i kept putting it off and off, then one day last year she had been getting stiffer and stiffer, she was on 3x bute a day and she had to come in for a couple of days due to the terrible weather. She had been in overnight and i led her out of her stable to the tie up ring, and she bit me, really really bit me. If i hadn't have had three layers on and a winter coat she would have done some serious damage. She was in pain and it was her only way of telling me (this mare had never put her ears back at me in all the time of owing her).

That was it, doubts gone, guilt gone, i made peace with it as i knew it was time, she had told me, i rang the the vets there and then, how i spoke on the phone i do not know and they came the next day.

In a long winded way, what i am trying to say, if it doesn't feel right, don't do it, if it does feel right, do it.

 

[Wagtail]

Mahoganybay, thank you. I think you are right. My head says it is time, and maybe it would be for any other horse, but my girl is not ready. In the vet's words 'she isn't in severe pain and is coping extremely well with the small amount of pain she has. It has not made her at all depressed.' I am not so sure about my gelding though. He is in quite a bit of pain when he moves. I will have to see if the turnout helps him.

Your mare certainly did tell you she was ready! I am pleased that it gave you the certainty you needed.

 

[Spring Feather]

And to everyone who has answered. I know I must drive you mad with this whole saga and the PTS/don't PTS. I am sorry. But your support is so appreciated. It really does help when I am struggling with guilt etc. I think I can say that if I try what the vet suggested, I can honestly say I have exhausted all options and if/when I have to make that final call, I will perhaps have no 'what ifs' haunting me.

Don't be silly :smile3:. It's a life you are talking about here (well two lives). Anyone who just has a horse killed without a second thought cannot be a compassionate or true horseman in my book. I've never personally struggled with making that decision, I've been lucky I guess in that I've always known when the time is right and done the deed without guilt. But, like you, I've always tried everything so that when it has been their time I know in my heart I have done all I could possibly do for that horse.

 

[MiniMilton]

I recently agonised over getting a young pet goat PTS. The more I agonised about the decision, the more I asked opinions, the more conflicting advice I got (from people that didn't see him in a daily basis)
When I was finally sure I was making the right decision I didn't feel the need to consult with anybody. I kept my mouth shut and called the vet. I didnt ask the vet his opinion (although he gave it and thankfully it was to say I was right)
You will know in your heart of hearts when the time is right. And remember the only one who will suffer when that time comes is you!
Fingers crossed you see improvement. If not at least you can sleep easy knowing you tried

 

[Holly Hocks]

Don't know what to say, but whatever you do will be the right decision for your horses as I know from reading your posts that you put your horse's welfare first. I hope things improve for you x

 

[delly&zo]

I haven't read all the posts, too sad.. i had to make the decision this time last year. i was worried about knowing when the time had come for her , she had ems cushings and laminitis. If you're thinking about it then it must be time, All i can say is will break your heart but after a couple of days you will know you made the right decision. A day too early is better than a day too late. A big hug for you x

 

[Wagtail]

My boy is out in the field today with the yearling and he looks very happy. He even had a couple of short gallops and bucks which I have not seen him do for a long while. He is on two bute a day for five days and then will be reduced to one a day.

My mare is pretty lame on her left fore, which she had her abscess in. I think when she comes in I will poultice it again as I think the abscess is brewing. My farrier is away for a week, but I need to make sure there is absolutely no sign of an abscess before getting her shod.

I have to say I am not keen on nailing shoes on her again. It didn't go well last time. And I don't like heart bars. But, I am prepared to give them a go and see what happens. Very dubious...

 

[Adopter]

Wagtail, it is your call, go with your gut feeling. If you have tried things before and they do not work it is a very hard decision to go through it all again.

Sending hugs, you have certainly done everything you can
Glad your boy seems happy.

 

[Spring Feather]

Heart bars crippled my ex-laminitic pony within hours of them being fitted. I had them removed immediately the following day. It's not something I'd ever try again if my animal was not happy in them previously but it's your call. I do hope you find a workable solution to it all with whichever decisions you take.

 

[Wagtail]

Heart bars crippled my ex-laminitic pony within hours of them being fitted. I had them removed immediately the following day. It's not something I'd ever try again if my animal was not happy in them previously but it's your call. I do hope you find a workable solution to it all with whichever decisions you take.

Oh heck. I just don't know what to do. Last time she was shod was a year ago and with normal shoes. She went super lame straight away. I told the vet this and she said she is more stable now than she was then. It's a good thin my farrier is away as it gives me more time to think about it.

My gelding has been stressing to come in since 4pm despite having plenty of haylage. He is fence walking. I think he misses my mare. The yearling is really chilled.

 

[touchstone]

I'm afraid I'm another who wouldn't go down the heartbar route after giving them a try years ago. Would hoof boots not be an option? It would make treating any abscesses easier, although I do think that cushings horses can tend to develop abscess after abscess which may be an issue in itself. I hope your gelding settles into his new routine soon, he's bound to wonder what is going on initially.

 

[Vetwrap]

Just wanted to send you a hug. We had our old boy pts at lunchtime today, and although we are broken hearted to be without him, we know we did right by him.
It's so hard, I know. You'll do whatever the right thing is. Of that I'm sure.
Big hugs to you.

 

[MrArnie]

Know exactly how you feel. My boy developed laminitis in the summer having never had it before. Eventually I had no choice but to make that decision as following improvement he deteriorated significantly and no pain relief was enough. I would have done anything to save him but ran out of options. It has torn me apart. People tell me it will get better in time but that is hard to see. My rational brain tell me I couldn't have done anything else, but emotionally it still kills me. A horrible decision to have to make.

 

[Wagtail]

I'm afraid I'm another who wouldn't go down the heartbar route after giving them a try years ago. Would hoof boots not be an option? It would make treating any abscesses easier, although I do think that cushings horses can tend to develop abscess after abscess which may be an issue in itself. I hope your gelding settles into his new routine soon, he's bound to wonder what is going on initially.

Thanks. I do have hoof boots for her but they have made no difference to her lameness. Also they bruise her heels. She ha odd front feet and one hoof does not fit ay of the boots on the market being 15mm wider than it is long. So to fit the width means the length is too long and the boot rubs even with gaiters.

Know exactly how you feel. My boy developed laminitis in the summer having never had it before. Eventually I had no choice but to make that decision as following improvement he deteriorated significantly and no pain relief was enough. I would have done anything to save him but ran out of options. It has torn me apart. People tell me it will get better in time but that is hard to see. My rational brain tell me I couldn't have done anything else, but emotionally it still kills me. A horrible decision to have to make.

That is so awful. I am so sorry. My mare has not ever been so bad that I could not help her with danilon. It is very lo grade. The worst she got was her first attack before I realised what it was. She would not come out of her stable. Thankfully, it has neer got that bad since.

 

[Wagtail]

I am so sorry to hear this. I am pleased you are at peace with your decision. It obviously was the right one.