Sue dysan - made up expert

[Gingerwitch]

?
I hope it's not true !

 

[ihatework]

What do you mean?
I assume you are talking about Sue DysOn?

 

[Gingerwitch]

What do you mean?
I assume you are talking about Sue DysOn?

Sorry yes, flipping phone.
She's up in front of a disciplinary panel to explain where the expert is for a letter supporting her heavy rider claims
I hope it's untrue

 

[Bernster]

Can’t get the full story as it’s behind pay walls for news but yes can see there is a disciplinary charge related to the heavy rider/horse study.

 

[Goldenstar]

Where is the story .

 

[Goldenstar]

Just found it it’s in the Daily Telegraph .
Oh dear is all I can say .

 

[ihatework]

Yes just googled, can’t get any detail without paying.

I hope it’s not true. But what an utterly stupid woman if it is, will just discredit years of achievement

 

[Littlebear]

She must have felt so strongly about the subject and the impact to have gone to that length if that is the case (not defending) just seeing her POV from the position she’s been in.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Oh heck . This is not good.

Can read this much without going beyond the Telegraph paywall.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...ng-expert-greenlight-heavy-horse-rider-study/

Vet accused of inventing expert to greenlight heavy horse rider study
Sue Dyson will appear before a disciplinary panel at the Royal College of Veterinary Surgeons after allegedly forging a letter

This is a very serious accusation. The heavy rider study has been much quoted and referred to since it came out.

 

[ester]

The times have run the story too but also behind paywall
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/...-about-dangers-of-heavy-horseriders-n207lks55

 

[LEC]

I have read the article on The Telegraph
Allegedly wrote a letter from Dr JC Butler insisting there was no need for the normal Home Office licence on the project. There is no surgeon with that name.
Accusations are about undermining a govt system designed to promote animal welfare and research ethics.

 

[Tiddlypom]

According to The Times Sue Dyson is charged with ‘Disgraceful conduct in a professional respect’.

 

[ester]

That confirms my impression from the readable bit of the Times thanks LEC.

You can't really do a welfare based project, and then skirt round getting a welfare licence.

 

[shortstuff99]

That is very naughty if true! Also means it can't be published either as the journals also have to conform to all of the ethics rules and licenses etc.

 

[Goldenstar]

That confirms my impression from the readable bit of the Times thanks LEC.

You can't really do a welfare based project, and then skirt round getting a welfare licence.

Quite .

 

[Tiddlypom]

You can't really do a welfare based project, and then skirt round getting a welfare licence.

This. A very, very silly thing to do if it is proven. She would surely have got approval if she’d jumped through the right hoops, but you can’t start forging permissions.

 

[ester]

It always was a bit of weird one iirc with the weights chosen, and the saddles used but because it had her name before it the prelim results were given more weight than they would have been otherwise.

 

[9tails]

It always was a bit of weird one iirc with the weights chosen, and the saddles used but because it had her name before it the prelim results were given more weight than they would have been otherwise.

Wasn't it heavy riders with saddles that didn't fit?

 

[Goldenstar]

Yes the heaviest rider rode in an saddle that did not fit her .

 

[Tiddlypom]

 

[conniegirl]

Yes the heaviest rider rode in an saddle that did not fit her .

Surely though if you are a very heavy rider and aware that you are, you would get a saddle to fit both your horse and your arse.

I’m on the heavy end for my pony (though not over recommended), im very careful to makesure my saddle fits both of us!

 

[Goldenstar]

Yes , but the tests where done in same saddles for all the riders now I am not rubbishing the results but to me it’s obvious that saddles unsuitable for riders will make horses sore .

 

[shortstuff99]

Yes , but the tests where done in same saddles for all the riders now I am not rubbishing the results but to me it’s obvious that saddles unsuitable for riders will make horses sore .

I haven't ever actually read her study, but this would be a variable within her results which she should have accounted for by either stating that it could increase the issues shown or having an experiment where she accounted for saddle fit to make it purely about weight.

 

[ester]

It was a pretty small prelim experiment, from which rather a lot of significance has been taken.

 

[Annagain]

Yes , but the tests where done in same saddles for all the riders now I am not rubbishing the results but to me it’s obvious that saddles unsuitable for riders will make horses sore .

I understand the need for the same saddle to be used so you don't have too many variables but surely the best option in that situation is a saddle that fits the horse and the heaviest rider and is potentially too big for the other riders rather than one that fits the lighter riders and is too small for the heavier ones. That is less likely to a) do damage to the horse and b) change the way the rider sits. Given a choice between a saddle that's too big for me or one that's too small I know I'd be more comfortable and more effective a rider in one that was too big.

 

[windand rain]

It was totally flawed in every way. Sample too small, ill fitting tack, lame horse ans several other significant defects in reasoning I am not certain why anyone would have paid it much attention but they did

 

[9tails]

Those images show a saddle that only fits a light or medium rider, so effectively a fat shaming exercise, no?

 

[AmyMay]

so effectively a fat shaming exercise, no?

Well yes, wasn’t that the point?

 

[ester]

It was totally flawed in every way. Sample too small, ill fitting tack, lame horse ans several other significant defects in reasoning I am not certain why anyone would have paid it much attention but they did

Being desperate for some rider weight data because it comes up *all the time*. The same reason people hang onto the 20%/15%/whichever one is in vogue currently.
And the name, the name stood for a lot.

 

[dorsetladette]

Do we think this is why she retired last year?