Surfaces for laminitic ponies?

[weebarney]

I'm interested in starting a small livery business aimed at laminitic or potentially laminitic horses and ponies. I am really interested in the track grazing system and was wondering what sort of surface is best and does a pony suffering from laminitis require a different maybe softer surface until adequately recovered? I have emailed rockley a few days ago but I havent heard back and I'm impatient sort so so thought i'd ask on here.

 

[barehoofhannah]

Pea gravel.. Don't know sizes off top of head. I'm guessing lots of textures around a track but a soft section running down the middle of track so if in main can walk on it..

 

[weebarney]

Yeah I was going to have a small section of pea gravel, just not sure about the rest, someone has said to make the rest of it like a road but that will be very expensive and not sure whether it will be too much for sore feet?

 

[Crackerz]

At what stage of recovery?

The ponies/horses should be box rested on a deep full bed of shavings advised for atleast 6 weeks. Grazing inhand and then on a track system is only recommended once the horse/pony is sound in a straight line & on the turn on concrete.
Then normal ground will be fine as it's not advised to graze or walk a laminitic who has sore feet still...

Lots of different views but I worked at the Lami Clinic for a while, great experience & lots of fantastic advice drummed in to me.

 

[amandap]

I think you might need a variety of areas as well as surfaces as some need much tighter dietary management than others ie. some might not be able to have any grass or only soaked hay etc.Mind you as a livery you may be able to buy tested hay or get it tested to ensure low sugar starch levels.
As well as pea gravel, grass, earth, concrete, some areas of bigger round gravel and flatish rougher surfaces. Remember you might have horses with a variety of capabilities and needs even though they all are prone to laminitis.
Some will be fine on a grass track but others may not. I am at home but I have got a sort of yard track around my buildings so something like that, as grass free as possible would be another useful space.
Don't make the track too wide but it will need wider areas for feed and resting.

Building a hardcore track may well be cost prohibitive in drainage, materials and work. It is a seriously major job and would need a suitable topping for compromised horses.

Here's some ideas http://paddockparadise.wetpaint.com/page/Paddock+Paradise

Also have a look at Equine Market Watch. They use PP systems in their santuary.

and here. http://www.performancebarefoot.co.uk/page63.html

 

[weebarney]

Well i wouldnt be offering stables just a field shelter so probably either pre laminitis or once they are back on their feet. I dont have any real knowledge of the recovery at the moment but i realise if you get a horse or pony who has laminitis attacks it must be very stressful if you are struggling to find somewhere where there is plenty room to exercise but also not much grass. In which case im hoping maybe a bare track will be acceptable as opposed to laying some sort of road.

 

[Fii]

With one of ours he was in a stable on deep shaving until he had recovered enough, then he was allowed to free range the yard, concrete with a grass centre with access to his stable ! Are you thinking of taking in ponies in with full on lami or ones in recovery as such!

 

[weebarney]

I think you might need a variety of areas as well as surfaces as some need much tighter dietary management than others ie. some might not be able to have any grass or only soaked hay etc.Mind you as a livery you may be able to buy tested hay or get it tested to ensure low sugar starch levels.
As well as pea gravel, grass, earth, concrete, some areas of bigger round gravel and flatish rougher surfaces. Remember you might have horses with a variety of capabilities and needs even though they all are prone to laminitis.
Some will be fine on a grass track but others may not. I am at home but I have got a sort of yard track around my buildings so something like that, as grass free as possible would be another useful space.
Don't make the track too wide but it will need wider areas for feed and resting.

Building a hardcore track may well be cost prohibitive in drainage, materials and work. It is a seriously major job and would need a suitable topping for compromised horses.

Here's some ideas http://paddockparadise.wetpaint.com/page/Paddock+Paradise

Also have a look at Equine Market Watch. They use PP systems in their santuary.

Ive actually got the paddock paradise book but only thing is it doesnt really take into account how wet it is over here, I did attempt a big track for my lot but it hasnt worked out as overun with mud. Ill take a look at the equine market watch thanks!

 

[Fii]

Well i wouldnt be offering stables just a field shelter so probably either pre laminitis or once they are back on their feet. I dont have any real knowledge of the recovery at the moment but i realise if you get a horse or pony who has laminitis attacks it must be very stressful if you are struggling to find somewhere where there is plenty room to exercise but also not much grass. In which case im hoping maybe a bare track will be acceptable as opposed to laying some sort of road.

can i ask.. if you dont have any knowledge as such why you want to do this? or are you just offering the facilities ?

 

[weebarney]

With one of ours he was in a stable on deep shaving until he had recovered enough, then he was allowed to free range the yard, concrete with a grass centre with access to his stable ! Are you thinking of taking in ponies in with full on lami or ones in recovery as such!

I wouldnt really be looking at full blown lami as I dont live onsite so wouldnt want someone locked in a stable when i'm not there but who knows in a few years if things go well i could look down that avenue. I suppose maybe once they have got over the initial serious stage then i could look to taking them on for a short or long time as the owner wants them to stay.

 

[amandap]

can i ask.. if you dont have any knowledge as such why you want to do this? or are you just offering the facilities ?

This is a good question as ponies prone to laminitis can change very quickly and their needs change. You need to have a variety of options in case of the slightest deterioration if you are providing facilities for laminitic ponies specifically.

 

[weebarney]

can i ask.. if you dont have any knowledge as such why you want to do this? or are you just offering the facilities ?

Im not looking to be a rehabber just yet! I just realise their is a gap in the market for people who are seriously worried about exercising their horse or pony without allowing too much grass. Initially would just like to offer a track where diet is controlled and put out hay twice a day to encourage movement round the track, a field shelter for chilling in and pea gravel for a bit of foot massage.

 

[Fii]

I like the idea of the track system and may use it this summer, i wonder if wood bark would be a good surface if you have really muddy areas, not for the whole track but just for the worst bits!

 

[weebarney]

This is a good question as ponies prone to laminitis can change very quickly and their needs change. You need to have a variety of options in case of the slightest deterioration if you are providing facilities for laminitic ponies specifically.

Wouldnt have to be specifically laminitis sufferers but just horses who need more exercise and less grass, or maybe just owners who want a more natural environment. However Im guessing often it takes a horse to get laminitis before an owner does anything about it hence why i'm wondering about recovery and surfaces for them. I know a yard i used to keep mine, there was a humongous pony owned by the yo and i would say 'maybe it needs a diet or less feed' but they didnt take it on board then pony got terrible laminitis not long after, luckily it survived but now im in a position where i can help to make a difference to some and also earn some money from my land.

 

[Fii]

I wouldnt really be looking at full blown lami as I dont live onsite so wouldnt want someone locked in a stable when i'm not there but who knows in a few years if things go well i could look down that avenue. I suppose maybe once they have got over the initial serious stage then i could look to taking them on for a short or long time as the owner wants them to stay.

Im not looking to be a rehabber just yet! I just realise their is a gap in the market for people who are seriously worried about exercising their horse or pony without allowing too much grass. Initially would just like to offer a track where diet is controlled and put out hay twice a day to encourage movement round the track, a field shelter for chilling in and pea gravel for a bit of foot massage.

A lot of laminitics do need to be in though at least for part of the time, and as amandap says they need to be assessed regularly and routines changed accordingly! And as a livery owner taking in laminitics you would need to have more than a bit of knowledge.....i like the idea dont get me wrong, i just think you need to have a bit more knowledge on the subject before you start out!

 

[weebarney]

A lot of laminitics do need to be in though at least for part of the time, and as amandap says they need to be assessed regularly and routines changed accordingly! And as a livery owner taking in laminitics you would need to have more than a bit of knowledge.....i like the idea dont get me wrong, i just think you need to have a bit more knowledge on the subject before you start out!

I am trying to get the knowledge. I have to start somewhere though. I wouldnt be rehabbing just offering somewhere for the owner to keep them, they would still be their responsibility. I find it so sad that animals are dying everyday from this when they need'nt be. There must be laminitic ponies up and down the country on yards that dont have a clue what to do with them apart from stable and muzzle them.

 

[WelshD]

It's a good idea for DIY livery and the sort if facility that I would use, it's not easy managing grass, you need it to be eaten down but not by the pony, if you top it you encourage new short sweet grass, if you dont top it it's lush etc etc...

So a yard offering a different approach would be good

The thing that immediately sprang to mind is planning - it's hard to get PP and anything even semi permanent can get the local council chuntering.

Personally I think your idea of starting smaller and simple is a good one, maybe you could have the tracks as thinly grasses as possible perhaps by pre-grazing areas with sheep or something

I'd maybe give each area an outdoor stable type of arrangement like a pen or field shelter with a gate

I could see a yard like this working well with people with similar types of pony/horse being able to advise each other

A problem could be price, id pay more for that type of facility but only so much more

A really knowledgable YO would be the real added value I think

 

[weebarney]

It's a good idea for DIY livery and the sort if facility that I would use, it's not easy managing grass, you need it to be eaten down but not by the pony, if you top it you encourage new short sweet grass, if you dont top it it's lush etc etc...

So a yard offering a different approach would be good

The thing that immediately sprang to mind is planning - it's hard to get PP and anything even semi permanent can get the local council chuntering.

Personally I think your idea of starting smaller and simple is a good one, maybe you could have the tracks as thinly grasses as possible perhaps by pre-grazing areas with sheep or something

I'd maybe give each area an outdoor stable type of arrangement like a pen or field shelter with a gate

I could see a yard like this working well with people with similar types of pony/horse being able to advise each other

A problem could be price, id pay more for that type of facility but only so much more

A really knowledgable YO would be the real added value I think

Thanks for your input, I think when I write on this site i come across as a bit of a numpty but im not honestly i'm just not very good as coming across intelligent when my brain moves faster than my hands and english was my worst subject at school. Yes getting a proper track is possibly going to cause planning issues so something grazed bare would be better for me, but then ive put up 2 mobile field shelters without anyone from the council checking that they are mobile.
I know some are advised to be kept with zero grass which is where the road type track would come in but I am wondering maybe the amount that 'need' that wouldnt be enough to justify the cost. I already have gates fitted to one of my shelters for my lot and i find it works very well for converting it into a stable when i need to.