Sycamore...

[paddy555]

I think another factor which was not so important until last Autumn is tree size. Up till then we had a large tree which we had kept pollarded for years. It had mostly behaved but last Autumn went mad. Got the chop. Also we probably had around 15/20 young sycamores in various hedges. We had lived with them, they had never had seeds, checked each year and no problems. They were small. Trunk no bigger than a human wrist.. No more than 10ft high. Just babies. Never a problem. Yet last Oct. everyone of those young trees was overwhelmed with seed pods. They all had to come down.
The thing is that if left they would have doubled our seed pods available for wind dispersal. So not only toxic with the stress etc but twice as many and I think people are seeing a lot more quantity.

Anyone who lets their horse eat out riding also needs to check. We let ours eat off the moorland yesterday. We ended up picking seedlings. That is seedlings that have wind dispersed onto Dartmoor. So many of the banks and road edges around here are covered in them, not just the fields.

 

[webble]

So sorry for your loss

@paddy555 your post has got me thinking has there been deaths in wild ponies I wonder

 

[paddy555]

So sorry for your loss

@paddy555 your post has got me thinking has there been deaths in wild ponies I wonder

interesting question, I have no idea. Not sure how anyone would know unless the pony was standing close to the road. I would suspect if they were dying they may just go away. Also I would suspect no one would bother too much to find out.
We do have rhododendron on several walls etc all within easy access of the ferals. Death from rhod. for an equine is horrific. I watched it in a donkey. (not mine I hasten to add) We also have a lot of laurel on road banks. Again poisonous.
If we ride past our horses can be guaranteed to try to grab rhod. If left to their own devices I can be sure they would try to commit suicide with rhod.

I did think about the ferals when I posted about seedlings on the moor. The ferals, in our part of the moor, also have access to all the side roads with lots of grass verges/banks where the seeds are in abundance. I can't see the new foals would have much resistance to the seedlings.

 

[PurBee]

Interesting to hear your experiences with rhododendron. That, and laurel, were literally the only 2 toxic plants my VERY mouth curious colt foal wouldn’t sample. I was amazed, as he really did try to kill himself daily breaking out of fencing with discovering braken/ferns/ivy/oak/fly agaric mushrooms even!/ horsetail/fir tree gluttony/ivy berries…everything went in his mouth, but one sniff of rhod. turned his nose onwards and he has ghosted it ever since!
There’s a fair amount of it here, and i was well prepared to hack that down completely, but thank the lord, he left it alone, always has. The deer dont eat it here either, but they will eat laurel in winter only as other green food gets very lean. The deer eat pretty much everything except rhododendron and thick rushes, also they leave the ferns alone.

Sadly the sycamore seem tasty to many horses - i had a pallet of haylage from a regular supplier - reputable uk supplier unusually loaded with sycamore leaves and seed-pod bunches, i had thrown a flake at mine, while sorting other haynets out and pulling apart flakes, discovering the sycamore. Looked at the horses happily munching on it, before grabbing it back off them. They were eating them happily. Thankfully i noticed in time. Supplier was excellent and sent out another clean batch. They had one mature sycamore in neighbour farm field that had blown literal branches in severe autumn winds further than usual onto a small portion of their hay fields. The branches/pod bunches were swept-up when haylage making the following summer.
It was a close call for mine to survive as this supplier is usually 100% excellent and i didnt usually need to deep check the supply, and usually could throw solid flakes as feed. The colour and smell seemed different so i curiously inspected closer to find loads of sycamore in every bale.

I really hope hay/lage makers this year are scouting their fields to ensure its clear of sycamore saplings. It’s a tragic situation.

 

[anguscat]

Maya…so sorry you lost such a special horse And thank you for your warning.

 

[ycbm]

So sorry Maya, the pain and shock must be almost unbearable.

 

[ycbm]

Is anyone mapping the spread of hypoglycin A? Are there areas of the country where the infection is worse than others?
.

 

[Gloi]

I wonder if some of the cases diagnosed as grass sickness in the past were actually this.

 

[maya2008]

So sorry Maya, the pain and shock must be almost unbearable.

I have never lost a young horse before, and never one without a gentle decline. It’s horrific, he was an integral part of our lives, and now he’s just gone. He was an active, vital part of our daily routine, so loved and so full of life.

We need another asap from a logistical point of view but none of us will be in the frame of mind to do that for a while, which leaves my mare not only grieving her brother (who she’s known from birth) but having to be ridden twice a day as we have two sets of small ponies to be exercised and no school.

Have pencilled in the NF sales date in June, hoping we’ll be in the right frame of mind by then to come home with something. Even a temporary something will ease the logistical issues.

 

[meleeka]

I have never lost a young horse before, and never one without a gentle decline. It’s horrific, he was an integral part of our lives, and now he’s just gone. He was an active, vital part of our daily routine, so loved and so full of life.

We need another asap from a logistical point of view but none of us will be in the frame of mind to do that for a while, which leaves my mare not only grieving her brother (who she’s known from birth) but having to be ridden twice a day as we have two sets of small ponies to be exercised and no school.

Have pencilled in the NF sales date in June, hoping we’ll be in the right frame of mind by then to come home with something. Even a temporary something will ease the logistical issues.

It must be awful at any age, but to lose one as you say, in his prime, it’s just awful.

The local vet posted the other day that she’d diagnosed one within an hour of him grazing a field with them in, so it sounds as if it’s a very rapid onset. I have friends who haven’t even concerned themselves with it, despite my advice. I saw seeds in their fields a few years ago, so they must have them. Most of those horses are teenagers so I can only hope that makes it slightly better, otherwise there could be some very upset owners soon

 

[Kaylum]

Please also check your hay/haylage my friends died after eating some mature seeds from hay. The vet said they can blow in the wind for miles. And this was a couple of years ago now.

So sorry for your loss x

The more we talk and spread the word the more horse owners will be aware.

 

[ycbm]

I have never lost a young horse before, and never one without a gentle decline. It’s horrific, he was an integral part of our lives, and now he’s just gone. He was an active, vital part of our daily routine, so loved and so full of life.

We need another asap from a logistical point of view but none of us will be in the frame of mind to do that for a while, which leaves my mare not only grieving her brother (who she’s known from birth) but having to be ridden twice a day as we have two sets of small ponies to be exercised and no school.

Have pencilled in the NF sales date in June, hoping we’ll be in the right frame of mind by then to come home with something. Even a temporary something will ease the logistical issues.

Many years ago my then 6 year old dropped dead. I fully understand the shock and pain you are going through. Its quite a diffeent things when you have no time at all to prepare, and no warning at all. I hope you find a way through.
.

 

[ycbm]

Please also check your hay/haylage my friends died after eating some mature seeds from hay. The vet said they can blow in the wind for miles.

This window is down an alley in the middle of a town which doesn't have a tree, never mind a sycamore, anywhere in sight.

 

[paddy555]

Many years ago my then 6 year old dropped dead. I fully understand the shock and pain you are going through. Its quite a diffeent things when you have no time at all to prepare, and no warning at all. I hope you find a way through.
.

this.
In April 2001 I found my healthy donkey had died overnight. That was before the large sycamore tree was removed. Suppose I thought it was a heart attack but now, with the timing and a lot more knowledge, I am starting to wonder.
I guess some others will also be looking back and wondering about sudden unexplained deaths.

I totally understand how you are feeling Maya.

 

[skint1]

@maya2008 I am so sorry for your loss, i can imagine you are absolutely devastated and sadly I know how you feel. I lost my mare to EAM in 2015, there were so many that year, so this year is bringing it all back. Losing a horse suddenly is very traumatic, and EAM is particularly cruel. My heart goes out to anyone whose horse is bought down in this way. Good to share information though, that's how we can learn to protect our horses

 

[Sossigpoker]

There's a small paddock at my yard with a good amount of grass in it. And a sycamore tree over hanging and several only a few meters away. Yesterday I picked up about 30 seedlings from there.
Today two horses have been put in there.
Because "it's never been a problem before". No one seems to care but me.
This was initially my horse's paddock but thankfully i was able to get him into another one.
I hope they're still alive tomorrow.
I just can't believe this attitude !!

My horse for sure will not he putting a foot in that paddock ! (Yes I keep checking his paddock as well )

 

[maya2008]

I just got the vet report - normal muscle enzyme range would be 110-250 iu/l. Our poor boy's levels were 63,000 iu/l in the morning when she took blood at 10am, and had risen to 580,000 iu/l by the time he was pts. Poor thing didn't stand a chance. The vet told me that you can have a whole herd in a field, and only one will get ill - or none at all. They have to both choose to eat them, and be susceptible to the toxin.

We've found the trees - a street away - a line of 5 in a row. If you stand by the trees, you can see a kind of wind tunnel gap to the field. I dread to think how many they shed if we got such a lot down that small gap between the houses!

 

[paddy555]

I just got the vet report - normal muscle enzyme range would be 110-250 iu/l. Our poor boy's levels were 63,000 iu/l in the morning when she took blood at 10am, and had risen to 580,000 iu/l by the time he was pts. Poor thing didn't stand a chance. The vet told me that you can have a whole herd in a field, and only one will get ill - or none at all. They have to both choose to eat them, and be susceptible to the toxin.

We've found the trees - a street away - a line of 5 in a row. If you stand by the trees, you can see a kind of wind tunnel gap to the field. I dread to think how many they shed if we got such a lot down that small gap between the houses!

I liked your post for the helpful info. but sadly that is all. So sorry.

 

[Marigold4]

Is anyone mapping the spread of hypoglycin A? Are there areas of the country where the infection is worse than others?
.

Interesting question. Is it an infection though?

 

[Sossigpoker]

Interesting question. Is it an infection though?

No it's not. It's a toxin in the sycamore that makes them sick. Nothing infectious.