Talk to me about stringhalt please

[PurBee]

Just asked Dr Google - stringhalt can be caused by weeds such as Dandelion have also been implicated. and some horses may recover spontaneously in cases of plant poisoning or intoxication, ... never knew this, just a thought!

I'd never encountered this term before... Picky Weedia tells me that the French term for it is "harper australien"

And the French article for that condition claims that it's caused by eating cat's ear, also known as false dandelion.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypochaeris_radicata

Yes, ingestion of cats ear can cause stringhalt. Cessation of eating it eases/eliminates symptoms, if owner realises thats the cause of the stringhalt and stops feeding it, or remove from grazing paddocks - but can sometimes cause permanent damage, if eaten consistently.
Its sometimes found in grazing/hay fields.
I came to know about it after getting a load of hay with more cat’s ear in it than grass, so did a fair bit of research at the time. Threw the lot out before feeding any.

Cat’s ear can look very similar to dandelion, but the leaves are not sharp pointed like dandelion, are often slightly hairy, and the flower head stems are usually longer/thinner/greener than dandelion ,bearing multiple flower heads per stem Usually, whereas dandelion has one flower per stem.

The paralysis of the nerves also can cause larynx paralysis causing ‘roaring’ in horses.

I wonder if the few mentions online of dandelion causing stringhalt are to do with its common mis-identification with cat’s ear, or whether there’s any truth to it?
Dandelion is far more common than cats ear, and i would have thought we’d see a lot more stringhalt if true dandelion was a serious risk/cause as its often in paddocks and hay.
My horses eat a bit during growing season, regularly, are never affected. I even pick a couple of massive bunches of dandelion leaves and throw them into them, without any adverse symptoms.
Dandelion is often in commercial horse feeds (but so are many unsuitable plants so thats probably not worth relying on it being ‘safe’!)
Perhaps if true dandelion does have potential to cause stringhalt, it must be after consuming a large dose, regularly….whereas with cat’s ear, the affecting dose is from a relatively small amount

more info:
https://www.horsetalk.co.nz/2020/10/28/curse-cats-ear-horse-pastures/

 

[LadySam]

Cat's Ear, also Fireweed or Flatweed in my neck of the woods. And apparently, my neck of the woods is the world's capital of pastural stringhalt.

Do bear in mind that there are two distinct, different kinds of stringhalt. There's the toxic, pasture based one (Australian Stringhalt) and what is called Classical Stringhalt. Australian Stringhalt is usually both hind limbs and is directly linked to eating certain toxic plants, while Classical Stringhalt is often just one hind limb with no known cause (though there are theories linked to injury). It sounds like this horse and the other examples mentioned here are the latter, which also sounds very mild compared to the Australian kind.

The only horse I knew who had stringhalt was a lovely big unit KWPN gelding. He got a very bad case of the toxic grazing kind, he'd been on it for about 3-4 weeks. Prior to that he'd been very fit and healthy with no issues at all. The vet's initial diagnosis was that it would take him 12 months with physio to recover to proper movement but he went downhill to the point where he collapsed and was unable to walk so was PTS. Just awful. From what I've been told, this one was an unusually bad case of the Australian pastural variety.

 

[Keith_Beef]

Cat’s ear can look very similar to dandelion, but the leaves are not sharp pointed like dandelion, are often slightly hairy, and the flower head stems are usually longer/thinner/greener than dandelion ,bearing multiple flower heads per stem Usually, whereas dandelion has one flower per stem.

We have a lot of cat's ear in our garden, and for years thought it was some odd variety of dandelion that just grew flat to the ground. We run the lawnmower over it when the flowers are out, to stop it from going to seed and spreading even more.

 

[Lois Lame]

Yes, ingestion of cats ear can cause stringhalt. Cessation of eating it eases/eliminates symptoms, if owner realises thats the cause of the stringhalt and stops feeding it, or remove from grazing paddocks - but can sometimes cause permanent damage, if eaten consistently.
Its sometimes found in grazing/hay fields.
I came to know about it after getting a load of hay with more cat’s ear in it than grass, so did a fair bit of research at the time. Threw the lot out before feeding any.

Cat’s ear can look very similar to dandelion, but the leaves are not sharp pointed like dandelion, are often slightly hairy, and the flower head stems are usually longer/thinner/greener than dandelion ,bearing multiple flower heads per stem Usually, whereas dandelion has one flower per stem.

The paralysis of the nerves also can cause larynx paralysis causing ‘roaring’ in horses.

I wonder if the few mentions online of dandelion causing stringhalt are to do with its common mis-identification with cat’s ear, or whether there’s any truth to it?
Dandelion is far more common than cats ear, and i would have thought we’d see a lot more stringhalt if true dandelion was a serious risk/cause as its often in paddocks and hay.
My horses eat a bit during growing season, regularly, are never affected. I even pick a couple of massive bunches of dandelion leaves and throw them into them, without any adverse symptoms.
Dandelion is often in commercial horse feeds (but so are many unsuitable plants so thats probably not worth relying on it being ‘safe’!)
Perhaps if true dandelion does have potential to cause stringhalt, it must be after consuming a large dose, regularly….whereas with cat’s ear, the affecting dose is from a relatively small amount

more info:
https://www.horsetalk.co.nz/2020/10/28/curse-cats-ear-horse-pastures/


View attachment 85805

There's nothing wrong with true dandelion, which is a very good herb. It's false dandelion -- cats ear -- which is no good.

True dandelion has a hollow stem. This stem (flower stem) is wider than that of cats ear. There is only ever one flower to each stem. Cats ear has many flowers per stem.

But the most obvious difference I think is the furry leaves of cats ear, and it's really quite flat to the ground, smaller, not as lush looking.

True dandelion has smooth leaves which are heavily 'serrated' or 'cut' - I don't know how to describe it. Jagged. Every part of true dandelion is edible.

 

[PurBee]

Cat's Ear, also Fireweed or Flatweed in my neck of the woods. And apparently, my neck of the woods is the world's capital of pastural stringhalt.

Do bear in mind that there are two distinct, different kinds of stringhalt. There's the toxic, pasture based one (Australian Stringhalt) and what is called Classical Stringhalt. Australian Stringhalt is usually both hind limbs and is directly linked to eating certain toxic plants, while Classical Stringhalt is often just one hind limb with no known cause (though there are theories linked to injury). It sounds like this horse and the other examples mentioned here are the latter, which also sounds very mild compared to the Australian kind.

The only horse I knew who had stringhalt was a lovely big unit KWPN gelding. He got a very bad case of the toxic grazing kind, he'd been on it for about 3-4 weeks. Prior to that he'd been very fit and healthy with no issues at all. The vet's initial diagnosis was that it would take him 12 months with physio to recover to proper movement but he went downhill to the point where he collapsed and was unable to walk so was PTS. Just awful. From what I've been told, this one was an unusually bad case of the Australian pastural variety.

Flatweed/cat’s ear grows here in drier ground areas, sandier soils, and in gravel, so it doesnt surprise me Australia has it as a very common weed….and there’s more of these stringhalt cases there. Most resources online about it are australian.

I’ve only ever seen vids and info on toxic plant-caused stringhalt, with a severe gait disturbance and i’d definitely wouldnt ride, let alone compete that type. Many do recover apparently, but its a long recovery, months and months, upto 18month.
Sadly, like your gelding mentioned, i imagine it can become very severe and lead to pts.

Apparently stringhalt and the condition ‘shivers’ are similar. They look very similar, with shivers affecting 1 or both back legs. Like you say, toxic pasture caused stringhalt tends to affect both hinds and quite severely.
I havent delved into shivers, but wonder if thats the neuro-injury type of whats called Stringhalt in the uk?

I wonder what the management of a neuro-horse would be? Would pain killers be needed for life?
There was a youtube video where they cut the nerve but the gait was still the same, weirdly! Muscle memory?

With human ‘restless leg syndrome’, the involuntary twitching/striking of the leg is preceeded by nerve sensations that culminates with a ‘bolt of lightning’ type nerve sensation which then causes the twitching/fast involuntary movement of the limb. I had this temporarily a few yrs ago due to b vitamin deficiency…likely b12. It was worse at night laying flat in bed.
I never vocalised the discomfort, no-one would know i experienced it, so equally, it would be hard to know if a neuro condition in a horse is uncomfortable or painful, as you kind of get used to the weird nerve sensations.

I dont think i’d buy a mild stringhalt horse for any type of work, knowingly. Nerve conditions, unless resolved, only deteriorate usually, which i imagine would shorten the years a pony would normally be ridden for. It would be interesting to know what happened to competing horses with it, whether they were retired early due to it, or how their condition progressed?

Many horse buying threads on here advise “dont knowingly buy a problem”….i’d go with that, especially a neurological problem.

 

[PurBee]

There's nothing wrong with true dandelion, which is a very good herb. It's false dandelion -- cats ear -- which is no good.

True dandelion has a hollow stem. This stem (flower stem) is wider than that of cats ear. There is only ever one flower to each stem. Cats ear has many flowers per stem.

But the most obvious difference I think is the furry leaves of cats ear, and it's really quite flat to the ground, smaller, not as lush looking.

True dandelion has smooth leaves which are heavily 'serrated' or 'cut' - I don't know how to describe it. Jagged. Every part of true dandelion is edible.

Some stringhalt websites online state that true dandelion and sweetpea aswell as cat’s ear plants can also cause stringhalt. So i was questioning reasons why as ive always known it to be safe, in fairly sane amounts. Possibly dose. The difference between a healing herb and poisonous one is dose of it. Maybe grazing a field absolutely loaded with true dandelion would cause toxicity ?‍

Theres also smooth cats ear, without hairy leaves. Cats ear leaves, and true dandelion leaves are vastly different once youve got both types in hand…a quick glance may cause a mis-identification but close up all parts of both plants are vastly different.

 

[HappyHollyDays]

If it’s the same advert I have seen that’s a lot of very well bred horse for the money and possibly worth a gamble.

The only horse I know with stringhalt was a huge 18.1 which evented without any issues whatsoever in his younger years. The Farrier was very patient with him but as he got older he got more difficult to shoe would regularly stand in the box resting his heels on the wall so I’m assuming he was starting to find it harder to pick up his hinds.

 

[nagblagger]

Any update...?

 

[EmmaC78]

My old horse had stringhalt, it was noticeable when he first came out the stable but apart from that caused no problems and I did a variety of low level RC stuff with him with no issues.

 

[HeyMich]

Any update...?

Nope, unfortunately no update. I asked the vendor for some trot-up videos but I've not had anything sent through yet. The horse is about a 3hr drive for us but we could actually make time to go view it tomorrow, but I'd like the videos first. Keep your fingers and toes crossed for us folks!!

 

[HeyMich]

Nope, unfortunately no update. I asked the vendor for some trot-up videos but I've not had anything sent through yet. The horse is about a 3hr drive for us but we could actually make time to go view it tomorrow, but I'd like the videos first. Keep your fingers and toes crossed for us folks!!

Update... I just called the vendor and, after a good chat, we've arranged to go and see the horse tomorrow. I'm actually ridiculously excited! We've seen a lot of horses lately, but I've not been as excited as this for any of them so far... Must stay calm. Must stay calm. Must stay calm.

 

[southerncomfort]

Oh good luck!!

 

[millitiger]

Good luck.

my big boy has stringhalt, not noticeable on his movement, really only when you want to pick his back feet up.
he is such a super horse, I know it is degenerative, however it tends to be very slow moving.
There are so many successful jumping and racing horses with it, it doesn’t concern me at all.

 

[HeyMich]

Update... It's a no I'm sat to report. Nothing to do with the stringhalt either, which wasn't actually as bad as I was expecting. It just wasn't a good fit. So in summary, after seeing the horse and with all of your helpful comments, I would be happy to look at another horse with mild stringhalt again. Hey ho, on with the search...

 

[nagblagger]

Sorry to hear that it 'wasn't a fit', but pleased you went to see it so you could stop wondering what if.....?