Talking about stallion grading

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JanetGeorge, the day that using such foul language is acceptable is a very poor day, please take your potty mouth and bullying elsewhere. You intimidate people here and don't allow anyone else to have a point of view.

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Gee britbreeder - you've been here 5 minutes (or have you? I too note a similarity in style with a recently departed contributor)) and already you're an expert on who intimidates whom on this forum - AND think you have Admin priveleges. Funnily enough, I have a lot of friends on this forum - of which I have been a member for 5 years as against your stay of less than 24 hours - so I think I'll stay if you don't mind!
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There's no point getting into that debate, simply because the medal counts in both modern jumping and dressage do not support your findings, and I don't want to be attacked for providing facts.

If, in your opinion, you're stallions are such super movers (which was the basis of this promotional thread) which type of mares do you suggest they are crossed with in order to produce offspring that will have the ability to compete at the highest levels (not "advanced" eventers or "Grade A" jumpers who have scrubbed their way through thousands of low level classes over ten years to get their money up)?

BTW, I've been lurking here for years
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If, in your opinion, you're stallions are such super movers (which was the basis of this promotional thread) which type of mares do you suggest they are crossed with in order to produce offspring that will have the ability to compete at the highest levels (not "advanced" eventers or "Grade A" jumpers who have scrubbed their way through thousands of low level classes over ten years to get their money up)?

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1. It was not a 'promotional' thread as neither colt is graded yet - and neither is for sale. I liked the photos and wanted to share them with FRIENDS on this forum.

2. Neither of them will be crossed with ANYTHING unless and until they grade. IF the grey colt grades RID - and I'm not as confident with him as with the bay colt - then I suspect his job in life will be producing good heavyweight hunters and being used on RID mares who need extra bone added to the mix. But that depends on what talent he shows once backed. The bay colt I HOPE to keep and aim at a dressage career - maybe if he can make it to a high level he will be a very good stallion to use on 'hot' mares (of any breeding!) to produce more rideable and trainable offspring without sacrificing movement. But the biggest demand will initially come from Irish Draught breeders because he is - first and foremost - very correct and 'typey'!

As the former member you remind me of also forgot, not EVERYONE is aiming to breed top level competition horses.

And re your last gratuitous insult aimed at the breed, do you REALLY think Virtual Village Hopes Are High qualifies as one of these horses who have "scrubbed their way through thousands of low level classes over ten years to get their money up"????
 
Well you got the gender wrong (not that I'm ken's mother!), and I've a sneaky suspicion he's in the middle of the channel right now, on a boat on route to England (prior to that he was on the road for three hours, you can do the math). This I know because he's crashing at mine tonight. Shall I get him to say hello when he gets here?

Anyway, Janet..........................................?
 
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What incredible arrogance to look down your nose at someone, and assume they don't know what they're talking about. Just because I chose to breed and enjoy another type of horse does not make me inferior or my opinions invalid.


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Ummmm... pot... kettle... black...
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Janet, you'd answered whilst I was posting, but certainly you answered fully. The crack is this then; your stallions are suitable for breeding hunters and Irish draughts (your own words). So nothing mind blowing or unusual there, just breeding what they are supposed to, and I don't think Ken or anyone else here is going to argue about how to breed ID's or hunters (although I find the hunter's job fairly revolting).

I do not understand why you embroil yourself in arguments about dressage and jumper breeding, it seems facile to me for you to get yourself so angry and worked up, when you're essentially comparing apples with oranges, especially when it's not your subject. I wouldn't have thought that Ken would suggest Jaguar Mail as a good mix to produce a hunter or ID. By the same token, were you suggesting that one of your stallions was capable of either going to the Olympics or genuinely producing an olympic prospect? No because that would be just plain silly.¨

Personally I thought Ken was a dick (and I told him that, so you don't need to take the cheap shot) for getting involved in an argument you and the other non performance breeders who know their subject (ie. not performance horse breeding), where the people who are breeding for performance (particularly jumpers) agreed with him 99% of the time.
 
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Shall I get him to say hello when he gets here?

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LOL.....he is not THAT important!!
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In fact he is not important at all.....did you see anyone cry without him here!

Come on now, we all know its Ken (wireless laptop and the fact that he has logged onto here before when crossing the chanel)....and if its not, then its someone who is his parrot and just typing what he is telling them to type!!

Scotsmare....admin dont work a weekend which is why BB probably joined today...
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Isn't Royal Concorde, Shane Breens Hickstead speed derby winner, an Irish Draught Sports Horse??? Just shows the ID crosses well with Warmbloods too
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Janet, you'd answered whilst I was posting, but certainly you answered fully. The crack is this then; your stallions are suitable for breeding hunters and Irish draughts (your own words). So nothing mind blowing or unusual there, just breeding what they are supposed to.

I do not understand why you embroil yourself in arguments about dressage and jumper breeding,

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LIKE Ken, you do not read posts before responding.

I said that Rambo (the grey colt) would probably be a sire for pure-breds - and those breeding HW hunters - but qualified it with: "But that depends on what talent he shows once backed."

I said that Prince (the bay colt) would be aimed at a dressage career BUT "maybe if he can make it to a high level he will be a very good stallion to use on 'hot' mares (of any breeding!) to produce more rideable and trainable offspring without sacrificing movement." Obviously, an RID stallion would HAVE to prove himself at high level before being taken seriously by those wishing to breed dressage horses! As he's only 2, it's a little early to predict his future beyond his grading - but it is certainly my ambition to prove that an RID CAN make it to the top. A number have got close - but their stud careers - or lack of suitable 'opportunities' - have got in the way.

As RID stallions are generally so easy to ride, owners tend to compete them themselves - or just have fun on them - and don't seek out top riders to produce them. And that, IMHO, has been the undoing of some that have shown considerable early talent.

Personally I thought Ken was a dick (and I told him that, so you don't need to take the cheap shot) for getting involved in an argument you and the other non performance breeders, where the people who are breeding for performance agreed with him 99% of the time.

But you're doing EXACTLY the same thing. This thread had NOTHING to do with 'performance' breeding (whatever that is!) You didn't bother to read it without diving in with your initial insulting remarks (if you HAD read it, you would have known WHAT gradings - my opening post STARTED "This is one of my candidates for Irish Draught stallion grading next February - doing a bit of loose schooling!")

I certainly didn't expect - or want - this thread to degenerate into a 'Warmbloods are the only thing worth breeding' thread - a la Ken!

And you can shove your 'non-performance breeders' insult where the sun doesn't shine. Irish Draughts DO perform, so do many other breeds you would look down your nose at! And no - I don't expect one of my colts to go to the Olympics - but I see NO reason why one of them might not - one day - produce a horse that might (given the right mare) - or sire a mare who might produce a future Olympic horse.

And no - I'm not angry or worked up - just bored with Ken/you - jumping into threads that have NOTHING to do with the stallions Ken pimps for - and trying to knock other breeds and breeders in the process.
 
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Isn't Royal Concorde, Shane Breens Hickstead speed derby winner, an Irish Draught Sports Horse??? Just shows the ID crosses well with Warmbloods too
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Yep - he's out of a King of Diamonds mare. Just PROVES the ID is redundant in jumper breeding, doesn't it.
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Of course, ALL his jumping ability COULD have come from Concorde and NONE of it from the King of Diamonds line
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I said that Rambo (the grey colt) would probably be a sire for pure-breds - and those breeding HW hunters - but qualified it with: "But that depends on what talent he shows once backed."

[/ QUOTE ] I’m not going to disagree with your there, that’s onevery heavy horse and he’ll no doubt produce heavy weight hunters. Did you say something about him going to Hornby’s? It that to pull locomotives?

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I said that Prince (the bay colt) would be aimed at a dressage career BUT "maybe if he can make it to a high level he will be a very good stallion to use on 'hot' mares (of any breeding!)

[/ QUOTE ] Yes, I think he’ll go perfectly with a Weltmeyer mare

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to produce more rideable and trainable offspring without sacrificing movement.

[/ QUOTE ] I’m sure that they will be more trainable and rideable, but they WILL be sacrificing movement whatever you may think, that is just plain crap movement.

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Obviously, an RID stallion would HAVE to prove himself at high level before being taken seriously by those wishing to breed dressage horses!

[/ QUOTE ] Do ya think so? Are you seriously suggesting that your ID stallion will produce dressage horses? Dear god Janet, this is just too funny.

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As he's only 2, it's a little early to predict his future beyond his grading

[/ QUOTE ] You seemed very assured of his future earlier in the thread why the doubt now?

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but it is certainly my ambition to prove that an RID CAN make it to the top.

[/ QUOTE ] That’s a commendable ambition, but has the smell of failure all over it.

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A number have got close - but their stud careers - or lack of suitable 'opportunities' - have got in the way,

[/ QUOTE ] there’s always a good reason.
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A typical losers attitude.

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As RID stallions are generally so easy to ride, owners tend to compete them themselves - or just have fun on them - and don't seek out top riders to produce them. And that, IMHO, has been the undoing of some that have shown considerable early talent.

[/ QUOTE ] That may well be right, I wouldn’t argue with you there, but have you thought that perhaps it was also because of their limitations?

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This thread had NOTHING to do with 'performance' breeding (whatever that is!)

[/ QUOTE ] If you don’t know “what that is”, that might (is) be where you’re going wrong.

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I certainly didn't expect - or want - this thread to degenerate into a 'Warmbloods are the only thing worth breeding' thread - a la Ken!

[/ QUOTE ] Well that might have had something to do with your claim of fantastic movement, and trying to promote your future stallions.

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And you can shove your 'non-performance breeders' insult where the sun doesn't shine.

[/ QUOTE ] You owe me a new keyboard, I just spit my coffee all over it laughing. You’re a real beaut’! Do men find you attractive?

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Irish Draughts DO perform,

[/ QUOTE ] No! Irish draught crosses perform (that's with tb), some of them do very well and the odd one at the top level. Shane's horse is an example of the second generation, second outcross. Please don't tell me that this is all down to ID's.

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so do many other breeds you would look down your nose at!

[/ QUOTE ] There are over thirty different studbook/breeds which perform at the top level, pure Irish Draught ain’t one of ‘em! I wouldn't look down at ID's they have their place, but if you're representative of them............dear god!

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And no - I don't expect one of my colts to go to the Olympics

[/ QUOTE ] I see a chink of light!

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but I see NO reason why one of them might not - one day - produce a horse that might (given the right mare)

[/ QUOTE ] Oh dear god! Well at least you understand the importance of mares, shall we give Ratina Z a quick buzz and see if she's interested? You're too funny. Chink of light fizzles out.

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- or sire a mare who might produce a future Olympic horse.

[/ QUOTE ] Right so you’re talking about a second generation outcross. Knock knock Janet, they did that 30 years ago, catch up honey. This is not your opportunity to reinvent the wheel. Which century are you living in? Has Cook found Australia yet?

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And no - I'm not angry or worked up.

[/ QUOTE ] So swearing and general abuse is standard for you? I can smell the Penfold's sponsored red mist in Surrey deary.

For those of you who study and understand the difference between coincidence and irony, the main reason for Ken’s visit (Blenheim) seems to have been cancelled (sad coincedence), but the second reason is to pick up his new Labrador………………………………..whose name is PADDY. Now that just plain funny (as well as classic irony).

Time to open the yellow label and put it next to the AGA, so ta ta for now (shows age!).

BTW Janet thanks for helping get the hunting ban through, we always knew you'd help, bless you.
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Personally I thought Ken was a dick

And no - I'm not angry or worked up - just bored with Ken/you - jumping into threads that have NOTHING to do with the stallions Ken pimps for - and trying to knock other breeds and breeders in the process.

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Hear hear to the above. Can I make a suggestion that we leave Ken & his clones to toss their doctrines back & forth between themselves & not bother replying to their dross anymore? I have to apologise for my reference to the Borg in an earlier thread. The somehwt hysterical daleks would have been a far closer analogy
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Hear hear to the above. Can I make a suggestion that we leave Ken & his clones to toss their doctrines back & forth between themselves & not bother replying to their dross anymore? I have to apologise for my reference to the Borg in an earlier thread. The somehwt hysterical daleks would have been a far closer analogy
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You're right. BRITbreeder has a 'personal' beef with me - not my horses - revealed in his/her profile - "I hate blood sports and all forms of hunting. " He/she forgot to say that he/she extends that hate to everyone who hunts - or promotes hunting.

Does this forum have an 'ignore user' button??
 
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Does this forum have an 'ignore user' button??

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It certainly does Janet! Go to their profile and it is one of the options at the bottom in red type. A wise decsion I think!
 
Janet I do hope that you didn't infer that I was including you in the phrase 'Ken & his clones toss their doctrines back & forth between themselves'? That certainly was not my intention - it was aimed mainly at S**tbreeder & his ilk, & certainly not at you.
 
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Janet I do hope that you didn't infer that I was including you in the phrase 'Ken & his clones toss their doctrines back & forth between themselves'? That certainly was not my intention - it was aimed mainly at S**tbreeder & his ilk, & certainly not at you.

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Oh heavens no - never crossed my mind. (No-one could mistake me for a Ken clone - and certainly no-one who talks as much sense as you do!
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) And the aptly-renamed new member is at the total end of the doctrinal scale from me on more things than horse breeding.
 
What beautiful stallions, especially the bay, I would definitely use an ID of that quality and movement for either of my mares! Good luck at the gradings!
 
Oh dear Admin are going to be busy on Monday! I like the ID & ISH which is why I have used them. We have a branded SF at the yard, if that is an improvement on what we breed then you can keep them.
 
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The ID's I've met have always been very sweet natured and docile, the crosses TB x ID I've ridden have always been super hunterhack/family horse types. If I wanted a hunter type I'd go for tb x ID, because I'd want a horse to hack for a couple of hours in the forest (or longer) and be very good at it's job, a great horse and every type of horse has it's place.


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I never post in here because, well, I don't breed, but this is one of the more amusing things I've read on this forum - are you seriously saying that IDxTB does not equal sports horse? Because I beg to differ, as the one I have in the stable seems to be doing a pretty good job of being a Novice eventer, who is trainable, has bags of scope (will go intermediate at some point in the future when I learn to ride well enough) and moves well enough that a respected dressage trainer told me I'd do very well on him if I did pure dressage.

ETA - he's 'defined' as a british warmblood, in reality if you look at his bloodlines, his sire was angloarabxIDxTB, his dam was a full TB - so he's mostly TB with a bit of arab and a bit of ID in the mix. He has the feet and head of an ID - it's very obvious when you see him 'in the flesh'. He's got that ID trainability and temperament as well, and I'd have another like him in a shot. 'Proper, serious' riders like him too - two professional 4* eventers have asked me if his breeder has bred another with the same lines (she didn't sadly).

Here is a link to (rather a lot) of pics of him doing his job (and I agree, riding leaves a bit to be desired!)
 
i have to say irish breeding is important and i think gustavii stud have bred some world class horse with there irish x warmblood crosses, but i must admit i find the tit for tat childish and uncalled for, we all know our horses and our hopes for them, who cares what others think, proof is in the pudding, can we just go back to enjoying our horses and successes and posting on happy days!!!!! dont shoot me for this.
 
If you make sweeping statements such as the one I quoted above, you have to expect people will point out the obvious flaws in your argument. I couldn't care less what any breeding expert thinks of my horse as it is immaterial since he is a gelding, I was just tickled by the fact that an expert thinks IDxTB can't make a sportshorse, and rather than saying 'you're wrong' I chose to provide evidence that they can indeed make a sportshorse. I shall go back to competition riders now!
 
yes you have the right to defend what is said but it goes on and on and on, i know i started the last one that got removed. it was directed at not one person but it ended that way.
 
This was a totally happy post until Ken/BB stuck their oar in with an obviously very insulting and hurtful remark just because the Irish Draught (see, I can spell it, unlike him/them!) does not appeal to him. So if we're talking about tit for tat, then yes, they started it!
 
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