TB living out, NOT in work - hard feed needed?

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merliebug

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Hello all,

I've bitten the bullet, handed my notice in at my full-livery yard, and am moving my boy to grass livery closer to home. I have always had him on DIY up until about two months ago, when I moved him to a yard with better facilities (namely a medical paddock) and supervision whilst he was recovering from an injury and illness. Unfortunately I have taken the decision to retire him, age 8, unless by any miracle he becomes sound enough to ride in the future. It seemed crazy to be spending £500+pcm on a pet, which I've done for several years of not riding, and I am sure he would be happier spending more time out.

I have taken his shoes off (hoping as a last ditch attempt it may help his navicular) and plan to winter him out in a herd of approx 10 horses, all of whom come into a barn at night in bad weather, but otherwise stay out 24/7 on very very good grazing. On the nights he would come in he'd have ad-lib hay/ haylage, but obviously not every night, and otherwise just grass. The owner of the yard is very strict in that he does not want any of them fed hard feed as he believes it causes bullying, regardless of whether the horse is taken away to a stable and fed. He also believes they shouldn't be rugged, but I put my foot down on this one - I'll let him grow a coat and then rug for the worst of the winter.

Do you think that not being worked, and with good grazing and forage he'd cope without feed? He's generally a good doer, and tends to be sounder when holding less weight. It does, however, mean he can't have biotin and joint supplements in his dinner :-(

Thoughts anyone?
 
Personally, I would always feed at least a balancer and good quality chaff to horses out 24/7. Especially in winter when the grass nutrients are poor.
 
I'm afraid it's impossible to know until you've tried! I know some people with TBs that winter them out without hard feed, so its not beyond the realms of possibility. But is there somewhere you can move him if it doesn't work out? And if he has navicular, will he need bute or any other kind of medication?
 
I have wintered my TB out without feeding hard feed, she was fine and even came out of winter quite weighty! I do have a rug on her though, although I don't tend to rug up until mid November as I like her to grow her own coat. If this is his first winter out then he may need something more than forage to keep him going. I also make sure mine has access to a mineral block and of course shelter.
 
As long as he has plenty of good forage there is no need for hard feed - my 15 yo tb is ridden 4-5 a week without any hard feed, just a handful of mollichop in which to put her vits and mins.

But if you have to feed him supplements for navicular he's going to have to have a bucket feed somehow. Forbidding you to take your horse out of the field seems a bit harsh. How do you cope when he needs feet trimming, dentist, etc? Surely the herd will get used to him being taken away every day for a short while.

It's a tough decision, but I would be inclined to see if I couldn't find somewhere where my hoprse could receive the supplements he so obviously needs.

Good luck!
 
Yes of course it's possible, if the field provides good grazing all year round and you have the option of feeding good quality hay (as and when you want) but I be very relucant to keep my horse somewhere that would not allow me to feed my own horse if needs be (as in bring in your horse and feed away from the others in a stable where they others can't see) because you may need to, it's not like your chucking a hardy Welsh pony out for the winter, I know some TB's are tough but it's nice to have the options and a flexible YO, what if you just want to give a hand full of chop to make sure your horse is getting a supplement or medication if needs be?

If it works out though, it sounds spot on.
 
Thank you everyone, that's what I thought too.

The guy has no objection to horses coming and going from the field - you can bring in to groom, ride, see the farrier, have a cuddle, whatever, he just seems to think that if one horse is being fed the others will know and bully it? Seems a bit far fetched to me, especially if the others can't see said horse chomping away! I may just tell him my vet has advised that I keep my horse on his supplements, and if he doesn't sway then I guess I'll need to look elsewhere. The funny thing is that of all the horses mine is most likely to actually DO the bullying - the rest are all pretty old, bar two or three who are about 10 or 11, so I can't see it being an issue.

I'll give him a call tonight and see if he won't budge... In all other respects he seems very fair, and the place would be ideal insofar as I could still go down after work in the winter when it's dark and there will be people there, a yard to tie up on, etc, which most other grass livery places don't offer.

Eeek. I really need a house with land.
 
You're in the same position as me, I have a 10 year old, retired, unsound TB on livery! I must be mad!!

I think you won't know until you've tried it. Some TBs are better doers and seem to keep weight on a lot better than others. Do you not need to give him any meds or supplements? If you do, how will you be able to feed those?

Personally if it was me, I'd be a little worried about not being able to give my TB a feed throughout the winter, even if the grazing quality is good and plentiful. Are you only allowed to give hay when they are in during the very worst weather?
Are there any other TBs at this yard?

I don't understand why you're not allowed to bring your horse in, out of sight of the others for a feed?
 
merliebug said:
The guy has no objection to horses coming and going from the field - you can bring in to groom, ride, see the farrier, have a cuddle, whatever, he just seems to think that if one horse is being fed the others will know and bully it?
Eeek. I really need a house with land.
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Lol, that's absurd! What does he think, that your horse will go back into the field and start bragging about what he had for dinner? :rolleyes:
 
It's mad isn't it? Paying livery for a pet! I just realised I have to try something else, he's so young I can't afford to keep him in luxury for the next god-knows-how-many years!

I pointed out that as and when he needs bute, he would need to be fed, to which he replied that we would give it to him in a syringe, without the feed. The more I think about it the crazier it seems, it's not like he's going to go back to the herd and say 'guess what I just had guys!!'

There are other TB-types there, lots of ex polo ponies too. They're all quite fine breeds and aren't rugged, but I would be so much happier to be able to just give him a nice feed in the evening, which would mean I could keep a close eye on his weight and manage it accordingly.

It's frustrating, there's a place just up the road which allows you to feed, etc, but after work in the dark there would be no lights at all so I would probably struggle to find him in a 66 acre paddock, and probably scare myself silly in the process!
 
I would really say, at the age of 8, take the mans advice and DO NOT RUG. The horse will be far better off for it. My polo ponies, 2 tbs and 2 mixed, were always kept rugged, clipped and worked in winter.

when away at uni, i turned them away. They all did excellently, especially the tb with no rug.

There was an extremely good article in the polotimes magazine about why not to rug as the rugs push the hair down and mean they cannot make their own laer of warmth etc. Maybe try googling it.
 
Never know until you try it - you could always feed the bute in a treacle sandwich, don't think that would count as feeding would it - more of a 'treat' ;)

With no shoes and 24/7 turnout though, he might just surprise you - he could come sound again and ruin his own long retirement :D
 
Stencilface that would be AMAZING! I've tried everything with him, except a neurectomy which was almost on the cards (but I wimped out of) so I've come to terms with his retirement, but if he surprises me that would be great. He's also be calmer out 24/7, whereas at the moment he's a bit loopy and I wouldn't be that keen to sit on him!!

I am definitely going to leave him unrugged for as long as poss, and if he does grow a decent coat I will leave him naked, but he really doesn't like getting wet, so even if I put a thinner rug on just to keep him dry but still allow his coat to trap heat, then that's what I'll probably do.

It's quite scary all of this, when your horse has been safely tucked in a nice warm stable for the past five winters! I wish we could ask them what they would actually prefer, no doubt mine would opt out of 16 hours of confinement overnight in the winter! It's reassuring that the barn is there to use though, that way I can at least not feel terrible if it's blowing a snow gale and I'm nice and warm at home.
 
merliebug said:
He's also be calmer out 24/7, whereas at the moment he's a bit loopy and I wouldn't be that keen to sit on him!!

so even if I put a thinner rug on just to keep him dry but still allow his coat to trap heat, then that's what I'll probably do.

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Unfortunately ANY rug will flatten his coat, so I'm afraid that won't work.
If he will be calmer, then he will probably be better without hard feed.

While I can't understand why YO won't allow a horse a bucket feed out of sight of the others, I do think that for this to work you need to stop anthropomorphising. Horses are meant to live out in herds. They really don't need to be tucked up in a stable for 16hrs a day. I'm sure he'll soon get used to the new regime.
 
But you said he'll have access to a barn in bad weather? IME our horses out 24/7 prefer to tuck themselves by the side of a hedge over going in our rubber matted field shelter :) One of those is a TB, but he is 27 so appreciates a rug and hard feed :)
 
Just to reassure you

my tb mare ( the polo pony) was pampered to her hearts content, but she thrived on being turned away. When pampered and in work she got rain scald if rug off, fly bites, would not be caught and any skin condition going, oh and hard to keep weight on without going mental.

turned away: she never got a skin issue, no mud fever nothing, rain scald nothing!!! She was fed from February onwards xx
 
Thanks again everyone, it's reassuring to hear from other people who winter theirs out - it's not really the done thing around here. I do my best not to anthropamorphise (hence me putting him out, when I'd be more comfortable with him being in) as I know that what horses prefer and what humans prefer are two very different things!

The barn is used several nights during the week in the winter as some of the fields don't have much shelter, other than a hill and the odd tree, so it gives them a bit of respite and a chance to munch on some hay/ haylage.

Didn't manage to call new YO last night but will try today, a bucket feed out of sight really shouldn't be an issue but he's an old farmer type and quite set in his ways it seems! We'll see....
 
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