Teach me about health tests

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vieshot

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I know the basic principle, all dogs should have relevant breed affected health tests before being allowed to produce a litter.

But in reality I know nothing! What is a hip score? What's a good score? What's a bad score? What's that Baer eye test or whatever it's called checking for? What other common ones are there? Educate me :-)
 
I can only really tell you about hip and elbow scores. Basically the dogs are x rayed at any age over 12 months and the x rays are scored (marked) by a panel of scrutineers at the BVA. In hips each hip is scored out of a maximum of 53, 0 on each hip, shown 0:0 total 0 is perfect hips, 53:53 total 106 is pretty disastrous! In breeds prone to hd there is a breed average and responsible breeders won't breed from a dog who has a higher score. In GSDs the average is around 19 (not checked recently), personally I wouldn't breed with anything over 15. Elbows are slightly simpler, each elbow is marked 0,1,2,3 with 3 being the worse. Again it varies within breeds but I would only breed with a 0 or 1.
The only other test I know a little about is a DNA test for PLL (primary lens luxation) which our Lancashire Heeler had. This is done when the pups are tiny and the can be clear, a carrier or affected. Although ideally affected dogs wouldn't be bred from , in some breeds this would reduce the gene pol drastically so it is recommended that affected and carriers dogs are only mated with clears.
Hope that helps a bit.
 
Here are a couple of score sheets showing how the scores are applied to different parts of the hip. The dog with the score of 38 was not bred from, but her hips never affected her and she lived until nearly 11.

scan.jpg
 
Wot she said re hips and elbows. Male GSDs should also have a haemophilia test if they are to be used for stud, there are also tests to rule out whether studs carry the gene for pituary dwarfism, also a new test to determine whether the dog is likely to develop CDRM.

Just to be complicated, I am awaiting my results under the German scheme where Normal is the best score for hips and elbows, Fast Normal is middling, NZ is 'still OK for breeding' but not great compared to the BVA scheme, and MW (I think, or MS or something) which is off the scale.
It is a tad more expensive and time consuming than the UK scheme (it's been a couple of months now) but the dog is also DNA registered at the same time and the results go into a massive breed database to help identify future problems and the best producers.
I will post both pics of the plates and the results when they come back but I am too superstitious to to do that right now :o
I am doing it under the German scheme because while we accept their system, they do not accept ours, and if I ever want to show him or breed survey him (I don't give a toss about breeding him) or compete him abroad, it's better done under the international scheme than doing him here and then getting him redone.

The Germans are also bringing in the spine x-ray, following the lead of the Scandinavians, which I think is an excellent idea, there is no grade, just 'problem found' or 'no problem found'.

I think health testing is so accessible that I would never, ever buy or encourage a puppy buyer to buy a pup from parents without low hip and elbow scores, preferably generations of. Personally speaking I now would only ever go for a pup from parents with at least the entry level working qualifications as well so I know they are capable of getting around a field.

Anyone who breeds GSDs, with all the knowledge and help that is out there, without health testing, is just a tightwad who doesn't want to stick their hand in their pocket, IMO!!!
 
So if dogs are getting bad scores are they going back to the breeders and telling them this? or even good scores for that matter?
 
Yes, and also the SV (they hold the database I was talking about) and now also the KC keep records of health tests/results that anyone can access when looking for information about breeding animals or are researching their own dog.

The breeder was the first person I phoned when I saw my young dog's plates and I texted him the pics I took of them, on my phone. A good breeder should be more than interested in the results!

You will routinely see dogs hip and elbow scores printed in their ads in magazines, handbooks etc, even if they are not being bred from or shown.
 
CaveCanem said:
Yes, and also the SV (they hold the database I was talking about) and now also the KC keep records of health tests/results that anyone can access when looking for information about breeding animals or are researching their own dog.

The breeder was the first person I phoned when I saw my young dog's plates and I texted him the pics I took of them, on my phone. A good breeder should be more than interested in the results!

You will routinely see dogs hip and elbow scores printed in their ads in magazines, handbooks etc, even if they are not being bred from or shown.
Click to expand...

Thats good.
 
One little gripe - I would like to see health test results or lack thereof printed for every animal on every generation of a dog's pedigree as a matter of course....with the pink papers in Germany, it is a fold-over A4 booklet - ID details, details of the parents and the pup's brothers and sisters on the front and space for the stamps used for health tests, big six-gen pedigree on the inside detailing all the relatives health tests and working qualifications and the critique from the breed survey of the parents and grandparents and then the back serves as a performance record for trials/shows/scores etc...while that is very German and obsessive :p but it would be nice to look at a pedigree and have a bit more idea about what is behind the dog, apart from just names and whether it was a champion or not. Under the international scheme, these papers stay with the dog for life, no matter how many times it changes hands.
 
Each breed is different. Bull terriers should have the BAER hearing cerificate,a heart doppler test and a Urine /Protein/Creatinine (UPC) test ,current in both parents.Puppies should be BAER tested and vet checked for heart function.
Mini bullies should have those tests also,but every parent and puppy should have the PLL DNA test certificate as well. We also scan all our bullies and minis for Polycystic Kidney Disease (PKD) rare but not unknown in the breeds.
My labs are HD scored,and eye tested annually prior to breeding;puppies are heart checked and of course first vaccination as all puppies are. The border terriers are not known to have any genetic problems,but are all heart tested and puppies are vet checked for heart probs and given a first vaccination at that appointment.
The worst scenario for me would be a new owner finding their puppy is defective once having got iot home,so all of this protects myself and the new owners from such heartbreak.
My vet is currently in the Maldives!!! :D:D:D
 
I agree about the information being available on pedigrees. I have always written my own pedigrees, and have of course included hip scores. For Evie's litter I decided to use KC pedigrees as I naively thought they would look more professional, I was quite shocked to see they don't show hip scores etc.:(

At a slight tangent, those 2 score sheets I have posted above, the 12 was mated to a dog with a score of 8, result was the 38:(, there were 5 generations in the pedigree all scored, highest score 14, or A stamps normal and fast normal, nothing is guaranteed in breeding animals!
 
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