Teaching ‘sit’.

[Clodagh]

I mean, how hard can it be? ?.
Red doesn’t know how to do anything. She mastered bopping her bum down for a treat but instantly stands up again. Keeping it there is proving impossible! I don’t think it is pain or anything, just a quick sit, stand up while eating treat. If I make her wait for the treat she stands up again.
I normally use hand, whistle and/or verbal to get sit, none make any difference.
If you try to ‘loom’ her into a sit she avoids eye contact and pants, she gets worried with any pressure at all. As soon as she gets like that she obviously can’t take anything on board. If I stand back and wait she just does little paw dance of anticipation while standing up.
Ideas?
She absolutely loves retrieving and actually prefers it to eating. (None of mine will take treats while training) so maybe throw dummy but keep hold until she sits? I’m not really worried about steadiness yet but it’s only 6 weeks to go.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

Can't help, sorry. We are having exactly the same problem with our latest acquisition. She is only 6 months old though and there is a slight improvement sometimes.
Good luck!

 

[CorvusCorax]

I teach all my positions mechanically (lure dog's head up with food in hand, while putting light pressure on the rump) in an oblong/box so they literally cannot go anywhere and they eventually don't get the mark/food until they sustain the position for a while with the food held slightly out on front. Focus on the hand, hold the position, mark, reward. I like the oblong as they never learn a sloppy sit or down in the first place/it's correct from the start.

ETA having read post properly about stress/pressure, I'd look at hand feeding her and a bit of free-shaping to free up her head a bit and let her think a bit/work out how to make rewards happen.
Before I train positions the dog already knows how to push into my hand for food and then hold themselves when the hand is withdrawn so transferring it to the oblong is not a problem.
I mostly lure my dogs but I go for dogs that are genetically a bit more independent and bolshy and free-shaping doesn't work as well for them, because they just decide to free-shape their lives

 

[twiggy2]

If she knows to sit for a treat have a second treat that flows instantly after the first in very quick succession, you create a 'pause', very gradually increase the time between the first and second treat and increase the 'pause'

 

[Clodagh]

She actually just did an amazing sit! I was doing recall training with the beagle boys so ignoring her and she came and did a prolonged and wonderful sit with eye contact… so maybe I need to train someone else in front of her ?.
CC if I try to shape her she collapses and rolls over, but in an obsequious way rather than tummy rub.

 

[PapaverFollis]

What twiggy said. Two or three treats in quick succession for maintaining the sit. I would add a release cue, "ok" or similar, after the last treat. Veeeeeeeeerrrrrrry gradually increase the time between treats. Like painfully slowly. ?

It sounds like she's a bit nervous and wants to bounce up to her feet as she maybe feels a bit vulnerable in the sit? Can you train while sat on the ground so you are less loomy? It might help her feel more confident.

 

[PapaverFollis]

I always teach sit by luring the nose up with a treat until the bum goes down. I've never need to push a bottom down.

 

[skinnydipper]

Deleted. Seemed a bit silly explaining my rather simple training to an expert

 

[Clodagh]

What twiggy said. Two or three treats in quick succession for maintaining the sit. I would add a release cue, "ok" or similar, after the last treat. Veeeeeeeeerrrrrrry gradually increase the time between treats. Like painfully slowly. ?

It sounds like she's a bit nervous and wants to bounce up to her feet as she maybe feels a bit vulnerable in the sit? Can you train while sat on the ground so you are less loomy? It might help her feel more confident.

I will try the sitting. Lead by example? ?

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I always teach sit by luring the nose up with a treat until the bum goes down. I've never need to push a bottom down.

That method has always worked well for me with young puppies, unfortunately our latest acquisition is 6 months and has had a home before us where I'm not sure that any training was done, although her recall is excellent. We will get there, at least ours is still young, unlike Clodagh's, who is 4.

 

[Clodagh]

If she knows to sit for a treat have a second treat that flows instantly after the first in very quick succession, you create a 'pause', very gradually increase the time between the first and second treat and increase the 'pause'

What twiggy said. Two or three treats in quick succession for maintaining the sit. I would add a release cue, "ok" or similar, after the last treat. Veeeeeeeeerrrrrrry gradually increase the time between treats. Like painfully slowly. ?

It sounds like she's a bit nervous and wants to bounce up to her feet as she maybe feels a bit vulnerable in the sit? Can you train while sat on the ground so you are less loomy? It might help her feel more confident.

Well get you both. I wasn’t sure my coordination would be up to multiple treat dispensing but it totally works.
She was even able to join in a retrieving session today, sitting on your bum being a requirement!

 

[PapaverFollis]

Excellent!

 

[poiuytrewq]

Cecil was awesome at the treat boop!
Get yourself a pet rabbit and some fenugreek bunny crunchies.
The competition between Cecil and Bella for the next treat has produced a far better sit….. simple! ?

 

[twiggy2]

Fantastic

 

[Cinnamontoast]

Excellent! It must be hard with a nervous dog. I’ve always just stepped forwards and they sit, but Bear and Zak already knew the sit for treats things at the breeder’s and Mitch and Goose just copied him. They know the hand being raised or verbal command too.

 

[Clodagh]

Red now sits at every opportunity. Including when I am labouring up a steep hill. Greed is good!
She had her first ‘get in the car and drive out for a walk’ today. Suzuki Vitara not designed for five! She was excellent.
You can see how her face has softened and she doesn’t pant all day now.

 

[Cinnamontoast]

She looks very relaxed-good job!