Teaching a youngster to pick up feet - advice please

Demolition_Derby

Demolition_Derby

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Hello all

*looks around a little scared and ready to duck and scuttle out*

I have recently bought a 4 year old who was unhandled, everything else he has learnt incredibly quickly and is almost 100% with fantastic manners. However, at 17.1hh and never had his feet picked out it is not fun :(. Front feet I can just about hold until he's relaxed and I put the foot down, he does try and snatch it but I've been eating my spinach so I can hold it long enough until its my choice to put it down :p

My problem is the back feet, he will pick them up but then wants to put them straight back down and if I try and hold it he snatches it, and I mean really snatches it and I really can't hold it. I am not a weakling either! I am sure he wouldn't kick out at me normally but when he snatches he really has quite a 'kick' :(.

Up to now I have been continuing to pick the back feet up but only for a couple of seconds so that I can put the foot down before he snatches it but what do I do now? I want to progress and be able to hold it for longer without a fight and yes I do tell him off when he snatches but then I go back and do it again.

Any tips please :)
 
It sounds as if you are doing exactly the right thing and doing very well. However here are a couple of extra thngs you can try which might help. Firstly get a helper to put their hand gently on the opposite hip to the hind foot you are working on. This helps horses with balance issues,which many youngsters have. Secondly try placing a finger in the squishy spot behind the horse's ear(you should find a little dimple) run your finger firmly from there all along the back and down to the hind foot. This can work like magic for connecting the horse's back end to their brains....something a lot of big youngsters have difficulty with!
Finally make sure you are working on a comfortable safe surface and stand as close as possible to the horse making sure your body is in contact with the horse's body. This is much safer than reaching from a distance and just having hand/fetlock contact.(watch a good farrier at work and you will notice this technique.)
Good luck.
 
had this with mine when i got him, i just started rubbing my hand up and down his leg, kind of massaging, and then when he was brave enough to let me pick it up i rubbed all round near the hoof, heel etc and then placed it back on the floor (tried to do it before he snatched it back)
 
You could also try just putting a lead rope around his foot and lifting it slightly and putting it down while you are out of the firing range - i have a 2.5 year old he's 16.3 now and built like a brick 'outhouse' and he's generally good but occasionally will get mis balanced whip his foot out quickly but its really helping him and hes learning really quickly
 
I think you are doing well, it takes time to build up trust with a new horse, I have just been through this with my two yearlings. They are a lot smaller than your horse, but it has taken me 3 months of keeping to a routine of always picking up feet every day to get the the present point. To start with I was satisfied with just getting foot up as you are doing. I had someone to stand at their head each time to talk to yearlings as well and keep them calm. I then managed to progress to them standing whilst tied up, and just this last week they will stand in the stable without being tied up and pick up their feet in turn!
 
You're fine.

I've now bred 4 and scarcely handle them also. Makes not one jot of difference to the feet picking up. Some are brilliant from day one (usually the less intelligent ones) and some are horrors. If you go with the couple of seconds they will get better honest, doesn't need to be every day either. What you mustn't do is set up a battle. There are plenty of horses out there who for this reason are unshoeable behind.
 
Like the others have said your doing really well and you obviously understand the importance of only putting the foot down when the horse is behaving. Try picking back hoof up just slightly and put it back down... as you are doing by tye sounds of it, just go slow and gradual and you'll get there! Took me months of this to get my yearling comfortable to let me mess with her feet, now she actually dozes off whilst I mess, but that's because I do it everyday, pick, clean, scrubb, dry, spray.
 
Years and years ago we bought a mare and foal from a sale. The mare was a Shire x TB, very big and chunky and at 6 years old almost totally unhandled. We managed the front feet eventually but the hinds were another matter, she was far too strong for us to hang onto. The farrier came and advised that we stand her with her back to a brick wall, when he went to the back end and lifted the foot, she did the snatching thing and in doing that belted the brick wall. It hurt! She never snatched again. Farrier repeated the exercise on the other hind foot with the same effect. She was the sweetest mare ever and the thing about this exercise was that we had done nothing, so in her head it was her fault it hurt and she wasn't about to repeat the exercise.

It worked then, might be worth a try for yours.
 
Suelin said:
Years and years ago we bought a mare and foal from a sale. The mare was a Shire x TB, very big and chunky and at 6 years old almost totally unhandled. We managed the front feet eventually but the hinds were another matter, she was far too strong for us to hang onto. The farrier came and advised that we stand her with her back to a brick wall, when he went to the back end and lifted the foot, she did the snatching thing and in doing that belted the brick wall. It hurt! She never snatched again. Farrier repeated the exercise on the other hind foot with the same effect. She was the sweetest mare ever and the thing about this exercise was that we had done nothing, so in her head it was her fault it hurt and she wasn't about to repeat the exercise.

It worked then, might be worth a try for yours.
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Gosh, the risk of a broken pedal bone is huge. With my feral carthorse I just kept handling his legs, first with a padded walking stick and used the pressure and release method, if he kicked I kept the padded hand on, when he gave up I removed the hand. It has taken 4 months (he is 17 months old and very nervous) but now I and the farrier can handle him and he is growing in confidence everyday. My farrier handled his legs yesterday in the box and without him having his halter on. It is just repitition and patience !

I really wouldn't advise letting anything kick the wall. My other yearling recently belted a gate post whilst practising her break dancing routine in the paddock, the end result being a very lame filly in a Robert Jones for 3 weeks and a decent vet bill.
 
Sorry I am on my phone so can't quote but thank you all very much for your advice :)

Some very interesting ideas, especially the one about running my hand from his ear along his back, I will try this. And having someone 'helping' balance him, I am sure this is a big part of it for him.

It is also very reassuring that I am going in the right direction and other people have been practising for a while before they get it, maybe he's not as thick as I thought :p

Again, thank you all very much, this has all been very helpful :)
 
What's his reward for doing what you want?

He's a horse and he doesn't understand what you want. All he knows is that you hang onto his foot - something a predator might do - and when he tries to get it away from you, you hang onto it. He doesn't know how long you want to hold on to his foot (from him point of view, it may well be until you've finished eating his leg :p) and he doesn't know the point of the exercise is to hold his foot, do something to it, and then put it down.

Best way to teach that is to (a) make it very predictable and (b) show him that there's a good reason for him to cooperate.

Does he like to be scratched? Does he like carrots? Break it down into small steps - touch leg, lift hoof, place hoof down, reward. touch leg, lift hoof, hold hoof in your hand for count of one, place it down, reward. touch leg, lift hoof, hold it for count of two, place it down, reward. touch leg, lift hoof, hold it for count of two and tap with hoof pick, place it down, reward.

Build it up very slowly, and reward him for doing what you want, and you'll find the whole process is learned faster and remembered longer :)

Horses aren't that much different from us, and we tend to pull away from scary situations (especially where we try to get away and then get told off), but we do tend to like situations where we get recognition and reward for doing the right thing.
 
Thank you, I do appreciate he doesn't understand and I don't get angry with him because I do understand he's not being naughty, he just simply doesn't get it :)

Unfortunately he is amazingly uninterested in food and to be honest I am quite happy with that as the first few days I got him he tried to nip me so I don't want to encourage that. But he is very responsive to vocal praise and a neck rub so that's how I've been rewarding him so far :)

I will keep going and as you suggest hold it for a second linger each time and just keep practising. I want to make the farriers life as easy as possible too so in time I will start banging around on his hoof and actually using the hoof pick but right now I will be ecstatic with holding the damn leg for more than 2 seconds :p

Thank you :)
 
My (was 4,now 5) pony used to do this, i had to get a strong man to hold her legs for me as i'm weak! , has been a year of having them picked up almost every day, she now picks them up fine, the odd time she will snatch them from me not very often, think it will just take time for him to realise what he has to do and that he can't mess you around :) Also to add, i used to get someone to hold carrots and when she didn't snatch, she got a carrot, didnt do this every day but once or twice a week
 
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