Teaching foal to pick up his back legs

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HashRouge

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I work for an SJ rider so mainly deal with horses that are 4 years+, but my boss and his parents also have a number of youngstock and broodmares that live out and although their day to day care (checking/ feeding etc) is undertaken by his parents, I do have to hold them all when the farrier comes. Over the last year the job of teaching the foals to pick up their feet seems to have been delegated to me too. Last year we had one foal born on site and she didn't even really need teaching - she just seemed to pick it up from watching the other horses. Then another foal was imported and arrived late summer and me and the other grooms taught him. He was a bit prone to trying to lie down at first when his fronts were picked up and he did kick out with his back legs, but he was a quick learner and now is very good. This year they have bought another 2014 youngster (he was a late foal so quite a bit younger than our other two and a lot smaller) and I'm having a bit of trouble teaching him to pick his back feet up. When he first arrived we couldn't even get a headcollar on him so over the last four weeks he has come a long way. I don't think he has been handled very much and is quite shy, but I can now get a headcollar on him easy peasy and pick up his front feet no problem (he used to run away if you tried to go round to his side, he only liked you in front of him) and he is getting much more friendly and confident. He will now come up to the gate with his fieldmates and say hi, whereas before he used to hang back and hide. And last week the farrier managed to trim his front feet (they were in a horrible state) and I was so, so proud of how good he was. We didn't even try his back feet as they are proving trickier and I wanted his first farrier experience to be a good one. I'd now love some advice on where to go from here in regard to picking up his back feet. I'm not in any hurry, it will take as long as it takes, but I'd love some advice on people with more foal/ yearling experience than me! His reaction to anyone trying to pick up his back feet is to kick out, numerous times in very quick succession. He's so quick and violent with his kicks that I can't even manage to get a proper hold on his foot so it's not like I can hold on till he stops. I'm also a bit worried about getting kicked! At present, my plan of action is just to keep on picking up the fronts, then work on getting him used to me running my hands down his back legs before I start trying to pick them up again. But any other ideas/ advice would be much appreciated!
 
He is about a year old - is that right? Just trying to get an idea of size. The usual way I deal with this is to stop them kicking first. You can do that by making them run in a circle (on the lead rope) if they kick out. You first have to make sure you can do that without the horse taking off though! So practice that and then try rubbing down the legs. As soon as the horse kicks out or threatens to do so, make them run around once. Then stop and try again. And keep doing it until they try something different. When the horse lets you pick the foot up even a little bit, let go right away, gently, and give them a break. Then continue. If you repeat this and go slow, the horse will eventually get the idea that all you want is to pick up the foot.

You can also try putting a rope around the leg (not tied) and moving it up and down. If the horse kicks, don't do anything - just keep it there. Once the horse stops kicking, relax tension on the rope so it falls to the ground. Wait 15 seconds and then repeat the process until you can tug on the rope a bit and the horse doesn't kick out. Then you can try lifting the leg with the rope... The idea is basically the same as above but instead of risking getting kicked, you use a rope. And instead of telling the horse off for kicking out, you maintain the same pressure until it relaxes. This is an easier method but can really agitate some horses so you need to have the right frame of mind to keep going. If you give up, you'll make things worse.

I like to add a voice command to the lifting - like "foot" - so you can start "warning" the horse of what you're about to do.
 
Yes I think he is just under a year old, probably closer to ten months as he was born late in the year. I'm not sure running a circle would work well with him as due to his shyness and timidity I'm worried he would run away! We have got him to the stage where he doesn't do that, so don't want to go backwards! I like the rope idea though, might give that a go :)
 
With a yearling I would use a broomstick or similar with a glove attached to the end to stroke first the body and then when its relaxed with that the back legs so that if it kicks tou are well out of the way and they soon give up and realise that its not going to hurt them. once they are happy with the glove you are normally safe to get closer and use your hand first to get them to bring the foot part way off the floor (even just lifting the heel so the toe is still on the floor gets scratches) and then a little bit at a time until they will pick it up properly. I would think using a rope is more likely to scare yours and if you use the wrong sort of rope it could give the yearling burns round its pastern
 
You just loop soft webbing iloosely, after dangling it down the leg, the danger is that you will end up training him to kick if you don't sort it. De sensitise using rope all over body, have his headcollar lead rope thru a ring so he is not jumping about, probably need two people if this does not work, and zonked on sedalin if essential to trim.
So if other things don't work get a strong person to hold his head, sedalin, farrier, and have him on soft surface but push him against a wall so he can't really escape.
Pesronally I would might puting a roller on, use a breast girth, get him used to this, then let him go in to arena with a headcollar, roller and a soft bandage round the derrier. He will make a huge fuss but it won't make any difference, just be sure it will stay in place, if you have an old mare it may help him to settle. He should know to tie up each time the farrier comes even if he' s not being trimmed.
The soft bandages eg old tail bandages are great for horses who are very body aware/excitable.
 
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Pretty much as above but due to old age and cowardice, I use a long light hazel stick cut out of the hedge (a lunging whip without the thong would do) with a super market carrier bag tied to the end. I show it to them and gradually, over days or even weeks, rub them all over with this. They can kick all they want and all they'll hit is thin air. I do this to all our youngsters and the farrier is delighted. By the time he has to trim feet they are used to things around their legs and don't protest -- and I haven't lifted a foot! I think youngsters are sensitive about their legs because it is where they bite each other when playing. I do have an old walking stick I can use to pick up feet if necessary but seldom use it.
 
This is a good idea, I might just take a long schooling whip down next time we go and use that to run down his back legs. It's tricky as often we just don't have time to go (we work on a very busy yard) and really he could do with a little bit every day. But organizing the farrier and holding the youngsters is left to me and, to a lesser extent, the other grooms so it is in our interests to do it as often as we can as obviously we want him to be good for the farrier! We haven't managed to go down since Saturday and tbh I'm not sure anyone will manage again until the coming weekend, when we have three staff on (normally we have two) as it needs two people and often we just can't leave the main yard (youngsters are a fair walk away). Still, I'm sure we'll get there, we managed it with the other colt :)
 
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