Ted Update (severe hindgut acidosis)

Hi

Sorry it isn't better news. The first thing that jumped out at me was when you said he was being fed alfalfa cubes. My horse cannot tolerate alfalfa in any form, even the small amounts in some chaff. She has done fantastically on copra and oats though. My horse is also being treated by the same vet and is at the second stage where we are trying to repopulate the good bacteria. Someone who hadn't seen her for a long time saw her today and said she looked like a different horse.
Since starting the protocol her concavity and footiness have massively improved and I have noticed various other little symptoms to lessen:
Happier to be tacked up and rugged, not leaning on my left leg as much or constantly looking to the right when ridden, much bigger more swinging walk, improved topline to name a few. However she does still have off days and she does still crib bite a lot.
The vet is saying she doesn't really need to do a repeat faecal sample until January but I don't want to get to then and discover that we need to go back to the beginning otherwise my insurance claim time will also be up.
 
Almost certainly the right hind lameness would have been linked to his guts Alsxx if it has improved with your management because that is the side that the horses ceacum and liver lie (or so I have been told) and my horse's lameness was right hind too. This too has improved with my protocol from this vet
 
Just as a comment on this, I've a horse prone to this, and there is one field we have that no matter what time of year/state of grass he just cannot tolerate it, on close inspection the combination of types of grasses is different to my other fields & they just do not agree with him, a week of being in there & his tummy is uncomfortable, he's bad tempered & his performance decreases....

As long as I keep him out of this field, I don't have a problem.

Just a thought but It'd be worth looking closely at the types of 'grasses' that are growing in your field?
 
This is a good point too - as my horse moved yards from primarily rye grass (heavily managed and fertilised) to old established pasture. This move coincided with starting the protocol from the vet so I am sure this has helped too.
 
melle said:
This is a good point too - as my horse moved yards from primarily rye grass (heavily managed and fertilised) to old established pasture. This move coincided with starting the protocol from the vet so I am sure this has helped too.
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Sorry to repeat myself, but I do feel this is SO important. It is by far the main bulk of what the horses eat, even on restricted grazing, if we worry about what a handful of alfalfa cubes can do, what can 12 hours+ of grazing do to them?

I have seen such a massive difference moving my horses to rough, unfertilised but well managed grazing.
 
Thanks everyone, yes apparently certain fields dont agree with him. They move between 3 fields, each very different. One an old ungrazed (until this year) orchard (very old grass that was previously topped), one well maintained paddock with decent grass (temporary) and our main field (awful! they trashed it last winter and turned it into a 5 acre bog, and whilst it is green it seems to be about 10% grass!). Its the one in the middle that seemed to disagree with him. But they were only on that for about a month and his intake was restricted. Chloe is forever analyzing / sniffing his poo (yuk) to see if anything is upsetting him.

The alfalfa nuts were introduced around spring time, so after he was at his absolute worst (when he wouldn't have been eating any alfalfa) so i'm not sure they are to blame. I recommended Chloe feed them in place of beet as i'd read that somewhere beet can sometimes upset them, even the sugar free ones. But i think she's carried on with the beet too, so feeds a bit of both.

He was on copra, beet and chopped hay chaff previously when he was really sick, and pretty much zero grass - as said above they ruined their paddock in the wet weather last winter and there was no grass.

I did him over the weekend as chloe working and to my untrained eye his feet look better than my horses. I still the apparent footiness is partly due to him being generally uncomfortable.
 
My HGA lad cant have beet, copra or alfalfa - the beet upsets his gut big time, so much so in 3 days he was admitted to the vet hosp because he'd got so poorly. It seems beet is a big no for hind gut issues. He's also barefoot and alfalfa does make him footy almost immediately.

I'd really recommend taking him off of that if you can - even on Equishure mine cant get beet or alfalfa at all.

My vet got me to put him onto Rowan Barbury Solution Mash and Rice Bran for now. Literally took about 4 days and I had a much healthier, happier horse. He's totally sound now and even putting him on new grass last week hasn't caused any problems. Vet super pleased with his poo sample results too, so much so that we are going to reduce/stop the Equishure.
 
Scarlett said:
My HGA lad cant have beet, copra or alfalfa - the beet upsets his gut big time, so much so in 3 days he was admitted to the vet hosp because he'd got so poorly. It seems beet is a big no for hind gut issues. He's also barefoot and alfalfa does make him footy almost immediately.

I'd really recommend taking him off of that if you can - even on Equishure mine cant get beet or alfalfa at all.

My vet got me to put him onto Rowan Barbury Solution Mash and Rice Bran for now. Literally took about 4 days and I had a much healthier, happier horse. He's totally sound now and even putting him on new grass last week hasn't caused any problems. Vet super pleased with his poo sample results too, so much so that we are going to reduce/stop the Equishure.
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OK thanks - that's really useful to know. I shall refer back to Chloe. Glad you are making progress : )
 
Hi, I'm in Tunbridge Wells too :)

When my horse was scoped and diagnosed with grade 2/3 stomach ulcers back in June, she also had a faecal blood sample to test the hind gut. The vet said she had some of the highest levels he had ever seen. She was treated with Peptizol (same as Gastroguard, contains Omeprezole) for the gastric ulcers and Equitop Pronutrin for the hind gut.

She was re-scoped 4 weeks later and was clear of gastric ulcers and the faecal test came back completely clear. Vet said he knew it was good stuff but was amazed how well it had worked in such a short time.

I have kept her on a small dose of Peptizole and also the Pronutrin and she is feeling great.

Pronutrin really was a wonder for her, worth a look. It's also the thing that Dr Kerry Ridgeway mentions in his paper re ulcers as something he wishes they had in America as it is so fantastic.

Good luck
 
rising_promise said:
Hi, I'm in Tunbridge Wells too :)

When my horse was scoped and diagnosed with grade 2/3 stomach ulcers back in June, she also had a faecal blood sample to test the hind gut. The vet said she had some of the highest levels he had ever seen. She was treated with Peptizol (same as Gastroguard, contains Omeprezole) for the gastric ulcers and Equitop Pronutrin for the hind gut.

She was re-scoped 4 weeks later and was clear of gastric ulcers and the faecal test came back completely clear. Vet said he knew it was good stuff but was amazed how well it had worked in such a short time.

I have kept her on a small dose of Peptizole and also the Pronutrin and she is feeling great.

Pronutrin really was a wonder for her, worth a look. It's also the thing that Dr Kerry Ridgeway mentions in his paper re ulcers as something he wishes they had in America as it is so fantastic.

Good luck
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Ahh, must be a Kent thing!! I'll make a note of that drug and pass on, loads more suggestions on here so its all good. Just trying to persuade Chloe to look at his feed and cut out everything except the chaff. Got to be worth a shot. Looking at your forum name, is yours a primitive rising reli too? : )
 
stilltrying said:
Ahh, must be a Kent thing!! I'll make a note of that drug and pass on, loads more suggestions on here so its all good. Just trying to persuade Chloe to look at his feed and cut out everything except the chaff. Got to be worth a shot. Looking at your forum name, is yours a primitive rising reli too? : )
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Mine was on Alpha A, Calm and Condition and linseed. Vet advised to take her off everything and put her on Dengie Healthy tummy which is again alpha based but designed with ulcer horses in mind. She's thrived on it along with the Pronutrin.

He also said to remove the linseed as although it's good for some horses, it's not good for all.

I did have a Primitive Rising mare when I joined this forum yonks ago. Sadly we lost her to colic. She was the most beautiful, special girl :)
 
stilltrying said:
Ahh, must be a Kent thing!! I'll make a note of that drug and pass on, loads more suggestions on here so its all good. Just trying to persuade Chloe to look at his feed and cut out everything except the chaff. Got to be worth a shot. Looking at your forum name, is yours a primitive rising reli too? : )
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Maybe it's in the blood - my boy is by Primitive Rising and also trying to sort out his hindguts too!
 
rising_promise said:
Mine was on Alpha A, Calm and Condition and linseed. Vet advised to take her off everything and put her on Dengie Healthy tummy which is again alpha based but designed with ulcer horses in mind. She's thrived on it along with the Pronutrin.

He also said to remove the linseed as although it's good for some horses, it's not good for all.

I did have a Primitive Rising mare when I joined this forum yonks ago. Sadly we lost her to colic. She was the most beautiful, special girl :)
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Sorry to hear about your girl, Ted is fab on paper just got to get all his bits working at the same time! Didnt realise linseed could be an issue...its a minefield. I know the vet has given the ok to feed what he is getting, but i suppose unless you cut everything out, you cant be certain that there isnt something remaining that is acting as an irritant.
 
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