Terrible ground manners - advice/help urgently needed

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Kelly_boyden

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I have recently taken on a 6 year old Walsh cross mare around 14.1hh who I am trying to bring back into work very slowly. She was professionally backed and broken over 18months ago. Since then her owner fell pregnant and the pony remained in the field since I went to see her three weeks ago. With just a visit daily to check water and give carrots.
The pony was initially quite good to handle, stood to be brushed, allowed her feet to be picked, slightly pulled to be lead but would Follow commands when asked, I could also get her bridle on to be lead. I initially thought her few green manners would be ironed out with the treat system for good behaviour. However that lasted a few days, since then she has turned into a monster and I'm being kind in saying a monster! She continuously pours at the floor whilst being tied up and she will go for hours, she's contineously in your space, she's started kicking out so I can no longer pick her back feet up, she barges you, flicks her head constantly, I can no longer put the bridle on without putting myself or her in danger. The only thing I can still manage to do is to catch her and walk her from the field to the stable block. All treats have long stopped!
She's been paddocked with 3 other horses since returning from being broken. The pony is vastly over weight and I advised initially putting her into a smaller paddock as there is plenty of grass for only 4 of them. I think this may have been the start of where it all went wrong, she paces her paddock when out, despite being able to see them. When tied up she constantly turns her head to there paddock. I've been bringing her in for a few hours daily and then stabling her for a couple of hours to build on her ground manners but I fear there getting worse. Any advice would be much appreciated as I don't think I can take any more fights which I know I'm going to loose.
 
My feeling about this is that you need to seek professional advice with this mare: especially so as she's beginning to be dangerous around her back feet and you don't feel happy being there.

When you say "treat system for good behaviour", can you enlarge a little? What was/is the "treat" exactly? Is it food? I'm thinking it might have been, as you've obviously now stopped it, which is good, as this obviously wasn't helping one jot!

Something you could try is a Halti knotted halter which is a thin rope halter basically which if used correctly works by exerting pressure on points on the horse's head; or a Dually one, if leading in hand, which will give you more control. If you have an enclosed (and therefore safe) space you can use then you could try working her in that, leading her around, making her go from side to side, and backwards. You will need a very long training line, not like a short headcollar rope too. Ideally though you need a professional to help you from the word go with groundwork as it is a lot to do with timing, and also you need to make sure your own body language and way of doing things is making the right statements to the mare. Groundwork will be essential in building any sort of rapport with this mare and so that is why I suggest you seek professional help at the earliest opportunity - it really will pay dividends in the long run to get things properly established from the start.
 
oh its awful isn't it when they get like this :( Stay strong! :) I would get her physically checked by a good chiropractor firstly. is she in season/are her seasons regular?
When she paws the ground when tied up do you do anything? Sometimes purely ignoring it is better than telling them off.
It sounds awful but if she raises a leg to go try and give her a quick 'kick' in the coronet back and ALWAYS keep her in her own space. Remember you are the dominant mare here :) Even if shes coming in for cuddles etc No. She stands in her own space where YOU put her. It sounds like she could do with having a dominant horse in the field with her- maybe shes just got too big for her boots and is seeing where her boundaries lay now..
 
It may some separation anxiety, are you able to get her a companion in her smaller field?

How I would deal with it depends on what sort of horse she is. With Jake, I growl and he knows it's wrong, and he does as he is told to an extent. For example, if he is really in my space in the stable then I growl and take a hard step towards him, and he moves back. However, if you think she may be the type to fight back this is of course not the best tactic.

Repetition is your best friend, if she moves into your space, move her back a step.. and repeat until she is bored. I would also take her into the school (or safe space) and practise moving her sideways/back etc from the ground, make sure she knows what is expected of her, and that she must listen to the pressure, or it will increase (if she is ignoring you) until she does what is asked, even if its just half a step, release pressure and repeat
 
Your mare is stressed out. These behaviours are because of separation anxiety. At this point in her training you need to reduce the pressure on her. Everything is happening at once; less food, separation from her friends, withdrawal of positive reinforcement and riding. It's all too much. You need to work at one thing at a time.
 
AShetlandBitMeOnce said:
Repetition is your best friend, if she moves into your space, move her back a step.. and repeat until she is bored. I would also take her into the school (or safe space) and practise moving her sideways/back etc from the ground, make sure she knows what is expected of her, and that she must listen to the pressure, or it will increase (if she is ignoring you) until she does what is asked, even if its just half a step, release pressure and repeat
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perfect advice :)
 
I would seek professional help from an IH ( not Pirelli). If she's threatening to kick you need help sooner rather than later. Can you muzzle her so she's out with the others?
 
Wagtail said:
Your mare is stressed out. These behaviours are because of separation anxiety. At this point in her training you need to reduce the pressure on her. Everything is happening at once; less food, separation from her friends, withdrawal of positive reinforcement and riding. It's all too much. You need to work at one thing at a time.
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I absolutely agree.
 
I had a Welsh like your one. He was a total b*gger for about 6 months. With him, anything negative would send him spiraling further down so I wouldn't even raise my voice at him no matter how naughty he'd been. He was highly defensive over his feed, very bolshy, would tank off when leading, pawed the ground, generally quite stressy etc. I worked damn hard on him basically! I wouldn't let him take the slightest centimetre (or he took a mile!) so if he so much as stepped into my space I would politely (but firmly) push him back (saying "back"), to begin with I had to repeat this many many times - some sessions were purely working on this. The leading, I'd use a very thin string controller halter (which tightened when he pulled) which worked very quickly. I would spend sessions just working on leading politely (stopping, moving away from me sideways/backwards etc.). He also tried kicking a few times early on, I attached a plastic bag onto the end of a stick and ran it up and down his hind legs until he gave up, it helped a lot. I'd give lots of well dones and strokes if he behaved (even the slightest improvement) but avoided giving treats. I found the pawing lessened a lot as he slowly improved (I think for him it was a stress thing). Once he finally learnt manners, he was much happier in himself, I think these types of horses just get so stressed and worked up they go super defensive. I admit he wasn't 100% perfect always, he occassionally had a slip up but I always made sure I didn't let him get away with the slightest thing - I learnt to be very aware of his movements and thoughts! Of all the horses I've had, he actually taught me the most and he had such an amazing character.

I agree with what another has already said though, getting her checked over (back, teeth etc.) would probably be a very good idea to ensure she's not behaving like this through pain.
 
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