Terrible luck with liveries - non payment

[niagaraduval]

Hi,

I took on a livery at my home as suggested on here a few years back, mainly for company for my boy but also because I was hoping to have someone to ride with and really didn't want/couldn't afford another of my own.

I took on a livery (was my boys old sharer who got herself a horse) and of course having farmer family my hay is excellent quality and super cheap, this also means that my field rent is minimal, so ofcourse I did super cheap livery as it was mainly us helping eachother out, she got her own horse and cost her very little (20 euros/month summer) and I had company for my boy as well as a riding partner.

That went tits up, I got sick of having someone harass me by text, genuinely being nasty, when the deal was we both paid for our horses feed/bedding and nothing else and we each did our own (like DIY infact). She couldn't come and feed morning night, muck out etc. because she lived 20 mins away and probably couldn't be bothered, but as it's my place, I took care of feeding them and skipping out both.

Fast forward 6 months, some terrible lies, didn't even want to go out my house over to my stable incase she turned up, it was a nightmare, she told me she was leaving, cue : I found someone to replace her as my horse can't be on his own (current livery)

Fast forward 3 years, still have the livery, see her once every 4 months (seen her twice this year), but have grown attached to the horse, having looked after him 100% on my own for the past 3 years, holding him for farrier etc. had to buy him brushed, headcollar etc. because she didn't leave me one, so I just think of him as mine.

She used to drop some cash off in my letter box, however for the past year I have had to prompt her all the time to come and pay, and that the horse needs the farrier etc. it's just really frustrating having to ask for money all the time, even though I charge 40 euros a month in the summer, which includes (or does to her) all care, mineral lick, water, 2 x daily visit (I would have to see mine anyway) but it's the lack of acknowledgment I think that is starting to take it's toll. There is no where at all that would keep him for this little (money wise) and have the standard of care I give him (I treat him as my own), stand for farrier (which I have to arrange myself) & vet, do all mucking out, grooming etc.

Keep adding up figures and they don't add up, it has been like this for a while but I was just adding say 5 - 10 quid a month so I haven't said anything as I valued more her horse and feel as though she is helping me out mainly (although she's never had it so good).

I have cut costs every where I can to keep the price down, my boy has COPD and I can't keep him on straw (which I used to get for 1 euro a bale (farmer family)) since I have to use dust free shavings, as the stables are indoor I had to have the livery on shavings too. When I talked to her her answer was 'as long as it doesn't change the price it's ok with me' which is totally fair as her horse doesn't need shavings so I agree that she shouldn't pay.

However, to keep costs down as much as I can, I bought mats for his stable, sourced feed at a cheaper price (but same brand) although it means ordering in and paying delivery fee, stopped feeding him apples & carrots with his tea, I have literally gone over and cut every cost bar quality of feed and hay which I will NOT skimp on to keep being able to keep him for this minimal price.

At first, she paid the 1st of the month for the first few months, she was a perfect livery, no hassle, just gave the money, turned up to see horse and went.

As time goes on I just feel more and more used (although I am very sure this isn't how it is) and I feel ashamed to have to ask her for money every month.

All this work and time I spend caring for the horse and she can't even pay me on time ?

It's all getting a bit too much for me, but of course I can't get rid as my horse needs a friend, and I am currently not at all in a position to take on another one of my own time wise or financially.

Sorry for ranting, I'm sure that I am also not perfect as I do feel as though I need her horse but then again... I know I am too good..

 

[Claire-R]

I hate asking for people for money as well as it makes me feel uncomfortable and naggy!! Could you politely say to her that maybe it would be better to set up some sort of direct debit or maybe write a price list for your services to make her understand how much you have been doing for her for very cheap?

It sounds like she is most definitely taking the mick!

 

[JillA]

I get mine to set up a standing order, which is one reason they pay per calendar month. I know a few land owners who won't take liveries because the ones they have had in the past have been nothing but hassle, shame for the good horse owners needing somewhere.

 

[Sugar_and_Spice]

Give her notice and advertise for another livery.

If you let people take the mickey over one small thing, it will escalate until they're taking the mickey over everything, lose all respect for you because you're putting up with it, and start treating you like dirt.

Work out what you *want* eg full, part or DIY, not what suits them. If you don't want to cover holidays sickness and emergencies, make it clear on the initial visit and have it in the contract that the livery is responsible for arranging their own cover if they can't come.

If you need a dust free zone they should totally pay for it properly. No its not their fault your horse has COPD but they don't need to choose to livery on a dust free yard do they? Cost things, including your time, appropriately and don't charge less because you get cheap field rent off family. They're not your field sharer, they're your livery. Making a profit is the payback you get for having the odd bit of hassle. Expect prompt payment and give notice if it doesn't appear so you only lose at most one weeks or one months money. Don't make allowances or give chances or allow arrears to develop.

As YO you are entitled to change rules to suit you as and when necessary, just give a weeks it months (depending in how they pay) notice of the new situatiin before you implement it. If the livery doesn't like it they are free to leave.

Start acting like a business and stop being so nice! Anyone who causes hassle, doesn't pay, or doesn't care properly for their horse just give them notice.

 

[be positive]

You are obviously undercharging and she is taking advantage by not doing any work and failing to pay on time, however you set the rate originally as you needed someone and the price must have been fine then even though she hardly ever turned up to do anything other than see him and pay you.
The arrangement suits you as you are able to do what you want, when you want and you need a companion, the horse never leaves the yard and you don't have someone coming and going at all hours, the perfect livery initially as you hardly saw her.

I sometimes resent how much I do for my liveries, they pay regularly but I do not charge for many small jobs such as bringing in for the farrier or vet, they are full livery so I do most things it just seems that sometimes they take it for granted and like you I certainly do not charge a high rate, not as low as you though.

I would contact her and ask that the money is paid directly into your bank account that way you know the livery is paid regularly and can stop stressing about it, it may be the time to bring up a slight increase to cover all of your outgoings, I don't think you can expect your time to be covered as you need the companion and while you are giving a good deal you would have to visit twice a day anyway to check your horse, water needs doing, it may be drinking some but it is hardly a major job to top up a water tub, the horse doesn't need grooming just a check over by hand is sufficient and checking feet, cut back on what you do and you may resent it less.

If you give notice the next one may be even worse, turning up at all hours, leaving your horse stressing alone while they ride, unless you get your own as company you will have to put up with something that you are unhappy about.

 

[9tails]

Why are you charging so little? If you're offering retirement livery, which this seems to be as you say you haven't seen her for month on end, then €40 a month is a ridiculous amount of money. If you're offering DIY livery where she should be up at least once a day in summer and twice in winter, then she should be charged full livery. If you've taken on a loan horse with all costs incurred by you as company for your horse, then €40 a month is a bonus.

You may have created a rod for your own back here, if you weren't firm when her standards started to slip and now it seems she's rarely coming up to see her horse. I can't understand your stance on bedding, plenty of DIY livery yards stipulate what type of bedding is to be used and liveries either suck it up or move on. Why are you feeding her horse hard feed? Does the horse need hard feed? It's not getting any exercise apart from stuffing its face in a field. Why are you including hay at such a ridiculously low monthly price?

I just don't get it. What do you want? More money? A direct debit? A DIY livery who actually does her horse? All three? Then tell her to buck up, move on or charge her more for full livery.

 

[niagaraduval]

You are obviously undercharging and she is taking advantage by not doing any work and failing to pay on time, however you set the rate originally as you needed someone and the price must have been fine then even though she hardly ever turned up to do anything other than see him and pay you.
The arrangement suits you as you are able to do what you want, when you want and you need a companion, the horse never leaves the yard and you don't have someone coming and going at all hours, the perfect livery initially as you hardly saw her.

I sometimes resent how much I do for my liveries, they pay regularly but I do not charge for many small jobs such as bringing in for the farrier or vet, they are full livery so I do most things it just seems that sometimes they take it for granted and like you I certainly do not charge a high rate, not as low as you though.

I would contact her and ask that the money is paid directly into your bank account that way you know the livery is paid regularly and can stop stressing about it, it may be the time to bring up a slight increase to cover all of your outgoings, I don't think you can expect your time to be covered as you need the companion and while you are giving a good deal you would have to visit twice a day anyway to check your horse, water needs doing, it may be drinking some but it is hardly a major job to top up a water tub, the horse doesn't need grooming just a check over by hand is sufficient and checking feet, cut back on what you do and you may resent it less.

If you give notice the next one may be even worse, turning up at all hours, leaving your horse stressing alone while they ride, unless you get your own as company you will have to put up with something that you are unhappy about.

Thanks for this reply, it has really helped, I totally agree and I think that is the reason why I have put up with it so far and have just got on with it.

As regards to doing less, I really don't feel I can, but as said I see her maybe 3 times a year so I don't think I can stop grooming him ?

 

[be positive]

Thanks for this reply, it has really helped, I totally agree and I think that is the reason why I have put up with it so far and have just got on with it.

As regards to doing less, I really don't feel I can, but as said I see her maybe 3 times a year so I don't think I can stop grooming him ?

I have several retired field ornaments, they never get groomed apart from a tidy up to their manes and tails before they get too long and tangled, in summer they look shiny and don't require grooming to keep them that way, in winter I only rug when really necessary the rugs come off as early as possible and they may get a bit of grooming as they change their coats, I keep a check for any skin conditions but keeping them naturally they hardly get anything to worry about.

 

[CBAnglo]

It's all getting a bit too much for me, but of course I can't get rid as my horse needs a friend, and I am currently not at all in a position to take on another one of my own time wise or financially.

You already are time wise - you are looking after two? and if you keep him on so little per month, could you not get another and keep them just as cheaply but also get a sharer (do they exist in France? If not, create the concept!) that would help out with the costs?