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For me, George is still dominating Colin (not surprisingly) and isn’t quite there at the ‘playing’ stage? More threatening him into submission ? Just wondered what terrier people thought?
Terrier people - is this playing?
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Pearlsacarolsinger
Up in the clouds
I am not terrier people, as you know 
but it looks like playing to me. I think there is a fine balance though and I wouldn't want George to get any fiercer. Take you cue from Colin but keep a close eye on the play, just in case Colin pushes his luck. Our Rottweiler plays in a similar way with the black Lab but much more gently with the yellow one.
but it looks like playing to me. I think there is a fine balance though and I wouldn't want George to get any fiercer. Take you cue from Colin but keep a close eye on the play, just in case Colin pushes his luck. Our Rottweiler plays in a similar way with the black Lab but much more gently with the yellow one.
Red-1
I used to be decisive, now I'm not so sure...
Love this. George is training the pup. He is a superstar.
Quigleyandme
Well-Known Member
To me it appears George is just putting manners on Colin. Colin is coming back for more and George just got off the bed when enough was enough. I think this is perfectly normal dog behaviour between a puppy and an older dog.
Tiddlypom
Carries on creakily
I had my heart in my mouth watching this, I have to say.
Mrs. Jingle
Well-Known Member
Well I would be very happy with that especially when we are watching terriers play! I think George is actually being very,very good with Colin - and I think Colin is learning the boundaries. Gorgeous videos to watch.
Red-1
I used to be decisive, now I'm not so sure...
Although I think George is a superstar, I would add that I wouldn't eave them alone unattended for quite a while.
Bellasophia
Well-Known Member
George is tolerating Colins‘s play,but tells him off when he oversteps Eg when Colin grabs at his tail / hind..George has turned his back the pup at this point to stop the play escalating.Colin however,keeps going back in,George snaps a reprimand.
When George is sneezing,for me ,it’s a sign he’s had enough( displacement)..he’s an old boy and gets off the bed to end play.
If Colin wants to play on I’d give George a break at this point and divert Colin with a toy.
George is doing a grand job,but with his age I’d definitely referee play.
When George is sneezing,for me ,it’s a sign he’s had enough( displacement)..he’s an old boy and gets off the bed to end play.
If Colin wants to play on I’d give George a break at this point and divert Colin with a toy.
George is doing a grand job,but with his age I’d definitely referee play.
splashgirl45
Lurcher lover
i think george is telling colin very politely F off i am too old for rough play. he is being very good but colin needs to learn when to stop and maybe you should step in to stop the play when its getting a bit much for george just in case he gets cross and gives colin a bite. otherwise they are doing really well...
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Sorry I should have said - Colin is never left unattended with anyone ever at the moment! I am always within sight line or at the very least ear shot, Colin is far too small and precious still and he has absolutely no sense of parameters ? But of course he is a puppy, he wouldn’t have!
I was watching them poised to intervene at any second, it was almost like George wanted to play but isn’t quite there yet and he still wants to splat Colin into submission at every chance. Fortunately I know George quite well by now and I know what his ‘bite’ indicators are, but I’d never ever leave them unsupervised!
ETA - I must video Millie playing with Colin..... ?
I was watching them poised to intervene at any second, it was almost like George wanted to play but isn’t quite there yet and he still wants to splat Colin into submission at every chance. Fortunately I know George quite well by now and I know what his ‘bite’ indicators are, but I’d never ever leave them unsupervised!
ETA - I must video Millie playing with Colin..... ?
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Parrotperson
Well-Known Member
George is doing what terriers do! He's training Colin his manners. It wouldn't worry me particularly. Keep an eye obviously but once George thinks Colin is under control he'll play more and put Colin in his place less !
Sandstone1
Well-Known Member
I think George is a bit annoyed by the pup.
planete
Well-Known Member
My bitches used to play with the foster pups but would have been unhappy if they had not been able to get away from the pups when they had had enough. George is being very tolerant but is trying to tell Colin he wants some peace. If he does not get it he might lose patience and give him a scare. He is not actively playing, more reacting to Colin and fending him off if that makes sense? The trouble with most feisty pups is that they will not take no for an answer and will either bully a not very assertive adult dog and run him ragged or they will end up being severely told off if nobody intervenes. In contrast, Millie is a willing and enthusiastic play partner though she may also need to be given a safe space away from Colin as my bitches did.
On the Hoof
Well-Known Member
I’m with those suggesting that he tolerating Colin a bit and then saying F off. I was going to comment on the sneezing - I think dog’s can do this both when anxious and when excited ?- have you noticed other occasions when G sneezes when the delectable Colin is not around?
ponyparty
Well-Known Member
Colin is goading George ? and as others have said George is humouring him but then telling him when enough is enough. Seems pretty normal to me, pup pushing boundaries like a toddler ? terrier play is sometimes very rough - certainly Manchesters anyway, they do a lot of boxing with their paws and sound horrendous - but you can tell it is play.
Frank used to try and get George to play with him, but George was having none of it.
Frank used to try and get George to play with him, but George was having none of it.
EventingMum
Well-Known Member
I think George is being very good, he's interacting with Colin, wagging his tail but also prepared to say "that's enough" and move away and obviously as you're there you can ensure he can have peace. Colin isn't being bad IMO, he wants to play but I've seen puppies being much more wild and he does stop momentarily when George warns him although soon tries to re-engage with him. I suspect that, carefully monitored at this stage, George and Colin will be fine together, Colin will learn to respect when George has had enough and George will realise that Colin is just a pup. We usually have one older dog when we get a pup and I've seen this interaction often, sometimes the older dog has to put the pup in their place and as long as you're there to make sure things don't go too far and the older dog can move safely away when he wants.
Sandstone1
Well-Known Member
Look at the blinking and stiff tail from George, he is putting up with the pup but hes not happy. If the pup pushes too far George may well really tell him off.
palo1
Well-Known Member
I don't know much about terriers tbh but my reading is that George would almost like to play, he is being polite but as yet unconvinced that playing is for him; he is also careful to ensure that he is maintaining his position in terms of ensuring manners etc. I think this looks good though obviously at this age/stage you are there to ensure everyone stays safe! From what you have said, if George really didn't welcome this interaction or at least feel really quite tolerant toward Colin, you would have already had some trouble My older bitch was very iffy about Red IT when he first arrived and we saw similar for the first few weeks until Red pushed it too far when the old hound then actively hunted him down (we were there) to give him a right telling off. After that Red learnt when enough was enough. I don't think my old dog would have really hurt the pup but I never was going to wait and see. I think George is being a superstar and his tolerance and patience bode well at this point!
My older bitch was very iffy about Red IT when he first arrived and we saw similar for the first few weeks until Red pushed it too far when the old hound then actively hunted him down (we were there) to give him a right telling off. After that Red learnt when enough was enough. I don't think my old dog would have really hurt the pup but I never was going to wait and see. I think George is being a superstar and his tolerance and patience bode well at this point! {97702}
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Yes George sneezes a lot when he gets over excited bless him! It is something I’ve got used to now, I was convinced he was ill when he first did it - but exactly as you say, it’s a sign usually of over-excitement or occasionally the fact he has had too much. It’s easy to have too much of Colin ??
ponyparty
Well-Known Member
I always felt that about George - he did seem to sort of want to play with Frank sometimes, so for instance when Frank was trying to instigate play, George would do the play bow for a split second.... but then it was like he didn't know what to do next (or perhaps just didn't like it?) and would just end up telling Frank off. And Frank, being a big wimp, would run away and hide upstairs until he plucked up the courage to come back down for more. Maybe a ballsy pup who doesn't know when to stop will get George to come out of himself and play a bit? Either that or he'll get a royal telling off and never bother Uncle George again!
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To be honest Colin does need someone to give him a proper telling off .... George is nice to him, Millie encourages him and the greyhound boys ignore him so he is a little thug ??? He will learn I’m sure ?
Errin Paddywack
Well-Known Member
I think you need someone like George to put him in his place. When we had the first collie pup of our own, the old farm collie was far too soft with her and never attempted to put her in her place. I really wish she had as she was a nightmare at times, never did really learn manners.
Bellasophia
Well-Known Member
Lev.,,the pack hierarchy has its place ,but the owner has the last word..
Once you get Colin on a lead and walking ,even a little bit...then back into a carry bag,you will have a different hierarchy and a very different pup..
...once my schnauzer had her first walks all this excess energy was spent on her outings..in the house they all crashed out together.
Once you get Colin on a lead and walking ,even a little bit...then back into a carry bag,you will have a different hierarchy and a very different pup..
...once my schnauzer had her first walks all this excess energy was spent on her outings..in the house they all crashed out together.
IrishMilo
Well-Known Member
Totally normal. This is how they learn manners. Same with horses.
misst
Well-Known Member
Looks very like mine. When we got Moti he was 6 month and Tilly was 10. She would play for a while then sneeze a lot like George. I would sometimes step in but usually she would change her behavour and he would leave her for a while. We would then play with him instead. He is a very submissive dog as he was a stray and is nervous and she was "senior bitch" so I think it was easy for her. They were equal in size.
Now we have Ruby (very very confident JRT) who we had from 16 weeks and Moti is chief dog. He plays for hours with her but if she bites his tail or becomes too much his tone changes and he sounds quite nasty. She immediately backs off and sits wagging her tail. This point is where I come in usually. Bellasophia is right about crashing after a walk - this will help. Moti and Ruby are also similar sizes and weights. I wish I could post video of them as they are so full on. We have never had an injury or an actual fight so I am fairly confident they sort themselves out. I do think if Colin is like my Ruby and over confident he will need a knock back now and then!
Also I always feed the older dog first and treat the older dog first so the pack order is enforced. Ruby is very "in your face" and their play is very very rough but Moti is only 4 so he copes. Does George have a safe space or time out area he can access that you can keep the pup away from?
To me it does not look nasty or very worrying but George is like my Tilly was and needs a little bit of peace now and then.
Now we have Ruby (very very confident JRT) who we had from 16 weeks and Moti is chief dog. He plays for hours with her but if she bites his tail or becomes too much his tone changes and he sounds quite nasty. She immediately backs off and sits wagging her tail. This point is where I come in usually. Bellasophia is right about crashing after a walk - this will help. Moti and Ruby are also similar sizes and weights. I wish I could post video of them as they are so full on. We have never had an injury or an actual fight so I am fairly confident they sort themselves out. I do think if Colin is like my Ruby and over confident he will need a knock back now and then!
Also I always feed the older dog first and treat the older dog first so the pack order is enforced. Ruby is very "in your face" and their play is very very rough but Moti is only 4 so he copes. Does George have a safe space or time out area he can access that you can keep the pup away from?
To me it does not look nasty or very worrying but George is like my Tilly was and needs a little bit of peace now and then.
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Yes, quite a lot of my time is spent ensuring that the other 4 dogs get time out from Colin - and that Colin gets time out from Millie ? Otherwise I end the day with a small damp dishevelled puppy where she has mauled him relentlessly all day ??
Hexx
Well-Known Member
Looks fine to me - George is just instilling some manners into little Colin. My bitch would do the same to any foster dogs that were pestering her to play. She was a lot bigger than George so would either pin them down with her paw or sit on them if they became too much!