The best homozygeous coloured stallion to use

As much as I love to see the foals, I also like to see their dams, for me this is a better indication as to what sort of foals the stallion produces. I know I am not the only person to think the mare gets too little attention! I think that is what so good about going to the stud open days, because very often you get to see the whole package, dam, stallion & offspring.
 
I woudl also have to totally agree with the above and thankfully more and more stud with homozygous horses are following this trend. One stud I won't mention for fear of advertising have made up a band of decently bred homozygous mares and bred to popular and fashionable solid stallions like London Swing, Stalypso, Bentley, Ampere and more and I know of a nother with homozygous mares doing the same with top jumping stallions. Definitely the way to go to improve coloured breeding!
 
I have a mahogany bay tovero tested at 75 - 90%, he is half PRE, but looks more Spanish than his father. Bert although young has a massive pop to him.

Although his father is a jumping horse in France. Google my Rancar Arado and find Ulberto do Marwood.
 
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HarasdeMarwood said:
I have a mahogany bay tovero tested at 75 - 90%, he is half PRE, but looks more Spanish than his father. Bert although young has a massive pop to him.

Although his father is a jumping horse in France. Google my Rancar Arado and find Ulberto do Marwood.

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=56475&id=1013171604&l=400ebb7e53
Click to expand...

How can he be tested 75 - 90%!? The foal is coloured, or not. 50% is a better number.

Your horse looks tobiano to me!? Not tovero. This topic is about homozygous tobiano not homozygous tovero. In WB breeding talking about homozygous means homozygous tobiano.

But I understand your horse in not homozygous?
 
He is deemed by the testing agency to be tovero and this is what is on their certificate.

I am sorry he is not a warmblood, but there are other breeds out there that jump and perform equally well but are not warmbloods.
 
did they test for LWO then? as well as Tobiano as thats the only other test apart from sabino 1 if that is you are using Animal Genetics in the UK to do the testing as the Splash gene has not been found I am assuming your horse is carring Frame Overo?
 
I am going to have "the full monty" done on him, 2 years ago when he was tested they didn't have all of the options that they have now. Back then I sent the sample and a picture of him and this is why they have put on the certificate Tovero.

I must test my grey too because he has never thrown a grey, but throws bays and dun dilutes with leg barrings.

I will update you if you like when the tests are back.
 
NAILED, as to your reply 'what difference does the bloody colour make' it makes no difference but I want to breed for myself not for anyone else. And what is the point of me putting my mares to a stallion to get a foal I don't want! So yes I do want a homozygous stallion to make sure I at least a get a coloured foal I do want, regardless of it's sex!

Some people try and avoid breeding chestnuts so what is the difference of people doing that and me wanting to breed a coloured?
 
markvannunen said:
Wentink from Scotland AI service is offering Barcutan Zulu Chief.
Homozygous, 16.1hh, Samber, Ico free and British bred by Cutsdean Centurion x Honeybrook Zulu.
He will be presented for grading later this year.
pres-zulu1.jpg
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I really like this stallion. Have been looking around at the moment for a stallion for my mare next year. Needs to be Bay/Brown and white homozygous. Are there any more pictures or videos of him anywhere?
 
markvannunen said:
I would just contact them through the website www.scotlandaiservice.com
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I've been looking around on the internet today again and came across an old advert for your former stallion Tom Tom, which led me to the Scottish AI services website and saw that he had been sold which was where I found this stallion. I wonder if I could pick your brains for the perfect daddy options! My mare is 151cm buckskin and white heterzygous tobiano mare of show hunter type. I primarily show her which she does very well at. I want to put more height on the foal so that it could show it in horse classes and still show mum in pony classes. The foal is to be kept so I want something really special to show so superb confirmation and movement a must. I have been told that if I wanted to try and get her colour re-produced then I need to put her to a bay/brown and white homozygous tobiano stallion. Doing that will give me the following colour possibilities (all things being well):
43.95% - Buckskin Tobiano
43.95% - Bay Tobiano
3.13% - Palomino Tobiano
3.13% - Chestnut Tobiano
2.93% - Smoky Black Tobiano
2.93% - Black Tobiano

The possible stallions I've seen that I like so far is the one above, Merrigans Legacy (however for sale and not at stud yet), and Sempers Spirit. Does Sempers Spirit have a blue eye? or is it my eye sight?
Will try and upload a picture of my mare...bear with me!
 
Sempers Spirit does indeed have a blue eye BUT you will find that that is actually quite a common trait in homozygous horses and I do not believe you will find any of his progeny have inherited it or if so not very many of them have and my foal by him and none I have ever seen by him have a blue eye. As I said, is a trait in homozygous horses, like with inks spots,
 
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Shakira38 said:
I've been looking around on the internet today again and came across an old advert for your former stallion Tom Tom, which led me to the Scottish AI services website and saw that he had been sold which was where I found this stallion. I wonder if I could pick your brains for the perfect daddy options! My mare is 151cm buckskin and white heterzygous tobiano mare of show hunter type. I primarily show her which she does very well at. I want to put more height on the foal so that it could show it in horse classes and still show mum in pony classes. The foal is to be kept so I want something really special to show so superb confirmation and movement a must. I have been told that if I wanted to try and get her colour re-produced then I need to put her to a bay/brown and white homozygous tobiano stallion. Doing that will give me the following colour possibilities (all things being well):
43.95% - Buckskin Tobiano
43.95% - Bay Tobiano
3.13% - Palomino Tobiano
3.13% - Chestnut Tobiano
2.93% - Smoky Black Tobiano
2.93% - Black Tobiano

The possible stallions I've seen that I like so far is the one above, Merrigans Legacy (however for sale and not at stud yet), and Sempers Spirit. Does Sempers Spirit have a blue eye? or is it my eye sight?
Will try and upload a picture of my mare...bear with me!
Click to expand...

You need to test your mare for the agouti and the red gene, if she is homozygous for agouti (AA)she won't produce a black or smokey black..if she is doesn't have the red gene and is homozygous for the black gene (EE) then she won't produce chesnut or palomino.
If she is heterozygous for both Aa , Ee then you may need to ask the stallion owners if the stallions are AA and EE as that will narrow your possibilities down to Buckskin or Bay :)
 
Splash white is the gene responsible for blue eyes it when tobiano horses carry splash white it show up as its possibly homozygous splash as well.
 
eventrider23 said:
Sempers Spirit does indeed have a blue eye BUT you will find that that is actually quite a common trait in homozygous horses and I do not believe you will find any of his progeny have inherited it or if so not very many of them have and my foal by him and none I have ever seen by him have a blue eye. As I said, is a trait in homozygous horses, like with inks spots,
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Allthough I like the SS progeny very much I must disagree with you about the blue eye. It's not a trait in homozygous horses, it's another gene that makes the eye blue. And yes, there is progeny with a blue eye. Actually on his website ( SS x Terimon ).
I wouldn't hesitate to use SS given the pictures I have seen on his website. I do have a comment though: some of the foals look a bit small but most of the time the dam is not on the picture so I can't compare and/or see how big the mother is.
 
Spirit himself is a little small, so bred to smaller mares, I suspect the ofsrping would be smaller. I used him on a 15.3hh Trakehner mare and the filly was very elegant and not overly big, which is what I had hoped for. I also used him on a big old fashioned stamp of a mare by Demonstrator and that foal was certainly not small, but had all of the mare's size and power, but colour and a little refinement from the sire.

So as with anything it depends what you want to breed. Personally I would use Spirit on big powerhouse mares to add a little more modern type and Ringo on blood mares to add a little more bone and suspension.
 
Thanks for that Mark - missed that one. His foals though are I would say averaged sized. My own born this year is out of a 15.2 Welsh D mare and this is her at 24 days old...not exactly small!!!!
DSCF4151.jpg


S2423913.jpg


This is mum's 5th foal and her first (my 5 yr old is 16hh - by 16hh stallion) and all others have been smaller. Her 2nd foal, full sister to the 5 yr old is only about 15.1/2
These are her first 2 foals (by Alderfarn VII not SS and whilst deceptive, the one on left is my 5 yr old who is 16hh and one on right is only about 15.2
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=3748024&l=9fe714ac4f&id=517898863

So whlist my mare may not be big she usually throws bigger than herself (although always gone to bigger stallions!) but this one will be the biggest and I expect my SS filly to make about 16.2hh!
 
I like that filly Jane!
It's a little hard to say what the outcome is when you cross a warmblood where about we know so much. For example, Marco Polo ( who is in SS pedigree ) downsizes 2.73 cm on a mare from 1.65m.
Now you have your mare, the genepool she comes from I don't know. It seems she comes form a tall family because non of her foals is smaller then she is. But that's just a suggestion offcourse.

What I mean to say is, when you have all these information from sire and damline, it's much easier to pick a stallion. And the outcome of this breeding is not a total gamble anymore;-)
 
I'm glad you like her Mark!!!! She is very very special to me!!!! and as we are now friends on FB have a look for more pics of her!!! She is a super filly and MY GOD can she move! As said above I have her elder brother but her is a show horse and I wanted the sportier version....ideally a filly....and that's what I got....yay!
 
BTW Mark - the mare is pure Welsh D - her breeders have been traced but just never bothered registering any of them!!! So she is not from a larger line...just throws big foals!
 
Well i dont normally post on subjects like this but seen as how someone seems to know more about my stallion than me AGAIN.
Mark a link to Sempers Spirit pedigree http://www.paardenfokken.nl/pedigree.php?horseid=178094&maxniveau=6
I am struggling to find Marco Polo ???????????????????
Perhaps he may have infuence in the size of Spirits progeny, if he were actually in it.
And yes Sempers Spirit does have a blue eye, im sure anyone that knows Mark Van Nunnen will know what a problem he has with it, as he blatently posted on a forum that i actually tried to cover the blue eye up !!! Ha Ha pretty unbelievable.
Yes he has thrown 2 foals with blue eyes, out of the 54 foals that i have seen by him.
 
special design said:
Well i dont normally post on subjects like this but seen as how someone seems to know more about my stallion than me AGAIN.
Mark a link to Sempers Spirit pedigree http://www.paardenfokken.nl/pedigree.php?horseid=178094&maxniveau=6
I am struggling to find Marco Polo ???????????????????
Perhaps he may have infuence in the size of Spirits progeny, if he were actually in it.
And yes Sempers Spirit does have a blue eye, im sure anyone that knows Mark Van Nunnen will know what a problem he has with it, as he blatently posted on a forum that i actually tried to cover the blue eye up !!! Ha Ha pretty unbelievable.
Yes he has thrown 2 foals with blue eyes, out of the 54 foals that i have seen by him.
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You are so right, I do ow you a big apology, I mixed his pedigree up with Chess and Sempatico. I'm so sorry for that.
I thought that after my review of his progeny and recommendation for him we could leave the "blue eye story" behind us.Now, I do feel however, that I have to defend myself.
These 2 pics were the first you placed on your website by then, they are still on. After my comments another picture with a blue eye was placed.
I won't make a comment on the original pics now, let people judge for them self if they are edited or not.
Foto-IAWYVX66.jpg

Foto-ZQRKNMKX.jpg


Edit: I hope you understand now that I don't have a problem with a blue eye but do have a problem when people try to mask it.
 
To be fair it could just be how the light is hitting that pic as the blue eye is obvious in many photos. Irresecpective I would use him again in a shot and adore my baby by him!
 
You are so right, I do ow you a big apology, I mixed his pedigree up with Chess and Sempatico. I'm so sorry for that.
I thought that after my review of his progeny and recommendation for him we could leave the "blue eye story" behind us.Now, I do feel however, that I have to defend myself.
These 2 pics were the first you placed on your website by then, they are still on. After my comments another picture with a blue eye was placed.
I won't make a comment on the original pics now, let people judge for them self if they are edited or not.



Edit: I hope you understand now that I don't have a problem with a blue eye but do have a problem when people try to mask it

Mark if it bothers you soooooooooo much and clearly it does ! why dont you call the photographer who took them and buy 2 copies then you will see for yourself they havent been touched, i will glady send you the number to call and he still does photos for the gradings.
I really dont get the point your trying to make AGAIN, most people who use Sempers Spirit come to see him in the flesh or have seen him, and i dont put a fly mask on him when they arrive, so why would i try to hide it on just 2 of his website photos ?
Its been a good 3 years since this debate started with you, i dread to think how much sleep you loose over other people's business, why get yourself involved,
{Jelousy/ dont like me/ just like to cause trouble on any forum/ so people choose your stallion }???????????? only you will know the answer.

Sempers Spirit is clearly producing good foals to a range of mares and everyone has been impressed with there foals and many have used him several times on different mares aswell.
Blue eye or not, a quality foal/horse is just that, if people dont like it they dont use him SIMPLE.
Enough said from me now as i really do have better things to be doing than lowering myself to your standards.
 
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Dear Amanda,

For the record: I'm posting in this thread for almost all pages so not jumping in to pick on your horse.
Shakira asked if SS really has a blue eye. I wasn't the one who responded on that. Eventrider did. Eventrider confirmed him having a blue eye and that she didn't know of any offspring with blue eyes and that blue eyes are common in homozygous.

I replied that blue eyes is not a homozygous mark and that there is offspring with blue eyes. I didn't give any wrong or not wrong value on it.

IMO this belongs in a regular discussion about a horse. Not to forget that I said I wouldn't hesitate to use SS having seen his offspring. So, in my whole post I haven't said a wrong word about SS.

Answering your questions:

I'm a jelous? No, I don't see why.
Don't I like you? Had a 1 time conversation with you so don't really know.
Cause trouble on any forum? I don't see why my first reaction was causing trouble, yours however is making it.
So people use my stallion? My stallion was sold in 2008...don't have 1 anymore neither do I own a share in 1.

To eventrider, I know more pics with a blue eye were posted but these 2 were the first ones, before the blue eye pictures. Amanda allready explained me in a private mail 3 yrs ago that I should ask the photographer how this happened. Which I should, he must be fantastic being the first who makes a blue coloured eye dark using only FLASHlight.

I never, ever have mentioned the story again, not in person, not in a forum. I even have never spoken bad about SS.

Once again, I feel sorry you bragging up the blue eye story again and that I need to defend myself. Specially because I only said positive things about him. A PM would have been better in this matter.
 
And neither Sempatico nor Chess have so far produced smaller foals because of Marco Polo in their pedigree. In fact there are several 17 hh horses by Sempatico and the Chess foals have so far been normal heights. And Chess himself is 16.2 hh tall. A filly was even awarded a premium with the Oldenburg Verband. You should stop to always find something to discriminate and critisize those stallions that are competition to yours. I have never seen a post by you that has not some kind of negative remarks about other people's stallions.
 
Shakira38 said:
I've been looking around on the internet today again and came across an old advert for your former stallion Tom Tom, which led me to the Scottish AI services website and saw that he had been sold which was where I found this stallion. I wonder if I could pick your brains for the perfect daddy options! My mare is 151cm buckskin and white heterzygous tobiano mare of show hunter type. I primarily show her which she does very well at. I want to put more height on the foal so that it could show it in horse classes and still show mum in pony classes. The foal is to be kept so I want something really special to show so superb confirmation and movement a must. I have been told that if I wanted to try and get her colour re-produced then I need to put her to a bay/brown and white homozygous tobiano stallion. Doing that will give me the following colour possibilities (all things being well):
43.95% - Buckskin Tobiano
43.95% - Bay Tobiano
3.13% - Palomino Tobiano
3.13% - Chestnut Tobiano
2.93% - Smoky Black Tobiano
2.93% - Black Tobiano

The possible stallions I've seen that I like so far is the one above, Merrigans Legacy (however for sale and not at stud yet), and Sempers Spirit. Does Sempers Spirit have a blue eye? or is it my eye sight?
Will try and upload a picture of my mare...bear with me!
Click to expand...

I am sorry about my comment about the blue eye. I had only asked as a mere observation in the photos. I didn't intend for this row to start over my question and I didn't mean for it to sound as though it was a fault!
 
flyingcolors said:
And neither Sempatico nor Chess have so far produced smaller foals because of Marco Polo in their pedigree. In fact there are several 17 hh horses by Sempatico and the Chess foals have so far been normal heights. And Chess himself is 16.2 hh tall. A filly was even awarded a premium with the Oldenburg Verband. You should stop to always find something to discriminate and critisize those stallions that are competition to yours. I have never seen a post by you that has not some kind of negative remarks about other people's stallions.
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Maybe you should read better;-) How many Chess M foals are there actually...People like to know.

As I earlier said, I don't have a coloured stallion neither do I have a share in it. If you and others having problems with your stallions being discussed don't sent them at public stud.
 
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