The genetics behind white socks....?

carmenlucy123

carmenlucy123

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Just pondering? Is there any?
My mare has black legs we think shes definatley got CB in there.
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Im putting her to the Humerust who has 2 white socks I think.
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Just wondered see I would have thought Mildreds black legs would cancel out any chance of me getting white socks?
but I have no idea is there any theory behind it?

just wondered really
hope your all well
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The sire is Spielberg - a very handsome boy indeed!

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He is absolutley gorgeous!
how funny you would think it would be cancelled out
interesting!
 
I would also like to know a bit more about white markings. I have a mare with no white on her, neither did her parents, and a stallion the same no white on him or parents. Two foals out of the five they produced had white socks.
 
I may be able to help here. I am a genetist but not an equine one. I believe the presence of white socks and face markings are due to the migration of cells called melanocytes in the foetus. Sometimes they don't quite make it to extremities or meet in the centre of the face. i am not sure if there is a heritable genetic component to how well a melanocyte migrates but I would think there is. However, other environmental factors would also play a part.
I hope that helps!
 
All I know about white socks is that the genetics experts would say its part of the sabino patten but not SB1
and that the E black gene is a supressor of white anywhere from Socks to body white tends to be more loudly expressed when its delivered from e which is the chestnut gene and if your horses are caring e as well as E dominat black the white socks are being displayed from the chestnut gene.
in other words the chestnut is allowing the white to be displayed.
I am sure there are more qualified experts on here that will give you a far better explanation than me as i am badly dyslexic.
 
No idea but one of my mares has a white sock on her o/h and foal born with exactly the same. Other mare has white sock on her n/h and foal born with white sock on o/h. Same stallion and he doesn't have any white on him.
 
QR - My seal brown foal came out of two parents with no white markings, and he has no white markings either. Well about 2 hairs on his forehead. Interestingly, I don't think any of them carried chestnut.

I guess the boy-bits are the last things to get coloured along with feet and faces then, as most horses with socks seem to have a pink splash there too!
 
faberge I love your mare, i'd have her in a shot! Hows she bred?

My mare has a very small white sock, a bit of white on a back foot and a stripe. Ive put her to a stallion with 4 white socks and a tiny bit of white on his face. Im hoping foalie will get mums white stripe and dads socks.
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Ordinary white markings that are not obviously what was traditionally described as sabino, have been theorised to come from stored white modifier genes probably more of the Kit gene whites that they have not discovered yet. In some lines they are very minimal but can build and crop out but moderately. A couple of mine from non sabino parents have done this. They are also affected by environmental factors and stress before birth can affect their distribution and extent. They would be small white socks and thin blazes.

Idential twins have different white markings although I beleive that they will equate to around the same amout of visible white if added up!

They were probably the first mutations of white in the horse that led to the more extensive patterns we see today.

Forgot to say CB's have had the modifiiers bred out but when outcrossed they can be reintroduced. It took a long time to breed them out but a lot of horses 100 or so years ago were minimally marked in the UK as it was thought that the white meant weakness of the skin and hoof so it was frowned upon.
 
I have a grey, with two white socks (now shes faded you can't see them until shes soaking wet), put to a stallion with a white sock behind, and I got a foal with no white socks but a teensy tiny star - 1/2 dozen hairs!
 
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I have a grey, with two white socks (now shes faded you can't see them until shes soaking wet), put to a stallion with a white sock behind, and I got a foal with no white socks but a teensy tiny star - 1/2 dozen hairs!

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Yes that can happen with modifiers, they appear to be able to be stored if not used so to speak. It could well be that a horse with little white from parents with much more white will stash that "spare" white away and pass it on to the next generation or perhaps the one after that will get the white. I wonder how white came about in the first place; it must have been some kind of advantage for it to have survived natural selection.

I Remember seeing an interesting BBC documentary on wild herds in the US, with Sir David narrating, the group they studied in the mountain desert area, predated upon by cats had no coloured horses they were all solids, though there were single dilutes and greys (which would have been born solid. There were minimal white markings only, so in their situation white got you killed.
 
white markings are dominant to no markings.....
and the level of markings is random as it occurs when the foal is developing due to a cut off in a type of cell(melanocytes i think) spreading over the whole body which is why(except in coloured horses) they are normally located on the appendages of the limbs and the front of the face.... just what we were thought in collage im sure its much more complicated than that
 
I have a 3 year old filly by The Humerist! Her dam (the one in my profile pic) is a shire x AES with typical shire markings (4 white legs and an skewiff blaze!) The filly has almost identical marking to her sire. He really seems to stamp his offspring. By the way, good choice of stallion! My filly has an futurity elite premium and a 1st premium with SPSS! She has a hell of a loose jump too! Good Luck!
 
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