the Grand National thread- a question

[badattitude]

I am happy to see there are some well adjusted educated people on this forum as most of the last few persons make good points. You cannot justify one and castigate the other, essentially they are the same thing. And there are many many horses bred for equestrian sport outside of racing who do not make the grade, are spoilt or injured who also end up as 'dog food'. Either be fair in the accusations or say nothing at all, there are much worse things happening to animals on a daily or weekly basis that does not get this sort of attention.

 

[BSJAlove]

at the end of the day, the GN wont be banned because there is too much money involved.

i hate people making judments on things they have NO idea about. im not even going in to the ''horses are forced/beatened around'' trash. have you ever seen a racing whip? do you even know the rules?

only the fit horses run, they have the best vet care around and how any one can say they are not loved!

i will leave this thread with my head down. and i will keep my mouth shut

 

[brighteyes]

Quite possibly the most hilarious inaccuracy I have ever heard!
If you had any comprehension of how much it costs to keep a racehorse at any level, and the margin of difference in cost is miniscule whether it be a maiden hurdler or a Grade 1 chaser.
The people who own racehorses do it for fun, yes you have the odd professional gambler, the guy who owned Denman was one, but the vast majority of people are your regular 'old school horsey' folk.
I think if you did an indepth poll of all racehorse owners there would probably be 1% who actually made a profit.
Now get back in your box and stop making statements which obviously have no factual basis!

Just singling this out as it's the selfish part of it IMO - do these in 'it for the kicks' owners wish to be present at the untimely end (Turners/Potters/wherever the horse ends up) of their not-so-inspired purchases? No. They simply pay up and move on, likely to the next short-lived hopeful (no pun intended).

The race itself doesn't unduly worry me. Very risky, yes, but nobody should even go out to bring their horses in from the field and think they are definitely coming home in one piece. The injured and dead are very sad casualties of a machine so big that whatever the DM print is unlikely to change anything except increase misplaced outrage. I'd like to know what fate awaits those who pulled up injured...or maybe I don't want to think about it?

Do they live in the lap of luxury? Some certainly do, albeit for a comparatively short time. I think I should try to be thankful for that.

I do think that a horse's tractability and willingness to do wholly unnatural things when we ask is exploited in all areas of the equine world. I try to square my conscience almost daily about my invovement and effort to give the five I am responsible for the best a domestic horse could realistically get. It's all I can do, really.

 

[Potato!]

The grand national is the ultimate test. The horses are pushed to (or beyond) their limits. Also they are whipped around the course. Horses are FLIGHT animals, which means they RUN when they are scared. How hard do you think it would be to make a scared horse run? When a horse dies in x country or any other event its treated as a tragedy and normally it is looked into by organisers and they try to change the fence to make it safer. When you go to see an event its a possibility that a horse may be killed but with the grand national its pretty much a given. They are swept out of the way of the other racers and from viewers eyes, then the complaints come flooding in when people actually get to see how shocking a fall is. Usually from non horsey folk who have no idea what goes on and see it as something they shoudnt have to see-an inconvienience for them while they are sipping their champagne and counting their winnings.

Also, I do believe eventers such as Mary King are TRUE horse people. When she lost her horse Come again cavalier, I believe she was truelly devestated. Whereas those involved with the racers give the impression that its just about the £££££

I have to say i disagree with the last part. I know the Jockey of ornais and he is gutted.

 

[Baggybreeches]

I do think that a horse's tractability and willingness to do wholly unnatural things when we ask is exploited in all areas of the equine world. I try to square my conscience almost daily about my invovement and effort to give the five I am responsible for the best a domestic horse could realistically get. It's all I can do, really.

I quite agree, I have been around long enough to have experienced and seen the worst that dressage and show jumping alone have to offer which I have no doubt is still going on today. I square racing with my conscience (aside from my love of the Thoroughbred) with the fact that there are showponies that are IMO treated in a much worse way than any racehorse, and nobody wants to ban showing do they? Little ponies corned up to the eyeballs, then sedated with a combo of overdosing calmers and ridden work by small adults (who wouldn't ever get on a horse because a horse wouldn't stand for the bullying the ponies put up with), just so they can look pretty? Oh and then there's the over-rugging...........

 

[huntley]

This whole debate amuses me! I wrote a post some time ago questioning whether there should be an upper age limit for eventers competing at 4* level and I received some serial abuse!!! We all ask horses to do things for us and, luckily, on the whole they respond. All racehorses are beautifully looked after, well trained and love it - look at the ones who refuse to start, they are the ones who say no and there is nothing anyone can do about it. So, yes, on the whole they do enjoy it - horses are herd animals after all. Jockeys whips are so soft now they inflict no damage - I see alot more damage caused by spurs. Let us all remain realistic - there are so many cases of dreadful cruelty in the horse world and racing is not one of them!

 

[marmalade76]

I quite agree, I have been around long enough to have experienced and seen the worst that dressage and show jumping alone have to offer which I have no doubt is still going on today. I square racing with my conscience (aside from my love of the Thoroughbred) with the fact that there are showponies that are IMO treated in a much worse way than any racehorse, and nobody wants to ban showing do they? Little ponies corned up to the eyeballs, then sedated with a combo of overdosing calmers and ridden work by small adults (who wouldn't ever get on a horse because a horse wouldn't stand for the bullying the ponies put up with), just so they can look pretty? Oh and then there's the over-rugging...........

Totally agree, BB. Most high level dressage, SJ and show animals live a far more stressful and unatural life than a race horse. NH horses get the summer off in a field, most get turnout when in training these days and running along in a herd with a few mates is far more natural than SJ or dressage test.

 

[leah_x]

This whole debate amuses me! I wrote a post some time ago questioning whether there should be an upper age limit for eventers competing at 4* level and I received some serial abuse!!! We all ask horses to do things for us and, luckily, on the whole they respond. All racehorses are beautifully looked after, well trained and love it - look at the ones who refuse to start, they are the ones who say no and there is nothing anyone can do about it. So, yes, on the whole they do enjoy it - horses are herd animals after all. Jockeys whips are so soft now they inflict no damage - I see alot more damage caused by spurs. Let us all remain realistic - there are so many cases of dreadful cruelty in the horse world and racing is not one of them!

Couldn't agree more! It seems the pro-racers get subjected to what could be classed as bullying, I've worked on plenty of racing yards and I can safely say I'd rather my horse be trained and raced in the national rather than be a riding school horse.

 

[el_Snowflakes]

I honestly dont know how anyone can call themselves a horse person and support the GN. By saying its better from them to be racing than be left rotting in a field is just absolutely ridiculous- is this the alternative??

I watched the race today as i couldnt see it yesterday and it was appauling. FAR too many horses, how can they justify having so many horses crammend together like that? obviously someone will be killed. In no other sport do we make a diversion because there are fellow competitors lying dead creating an obstacle. I also love how they pull a screen around a horse being 'worked on'by a vet....clearly to protect the gamblers from seeing the horrors that they have involved themselves in.

I dont think we can compare this type of sport to XC etc. At least if a horse falls- it falls....it doesnt fall before being trampled by all the other competitors.