The things judges say

My friend did complain, not sure if anything came of it, but plenty of people heard about it, and the next show we went to under a different judge he got a first and reserve champion, and all the competitors clapped in the ring as they were the same people in the previous show ( they were all affiliated BSPS's classes) was 24 years ago, hopefully the judge has learnt some sense..
 
Some local level judges don't now their a**e from their elbow. With regard to mixed M&M classes at higher levels one panel judge, many years experience, judged at HOYS etc. has said to me that there are times in mixed M&M classes he is sometimes unsure what breed a particular pony is. That pony will be down the line as his view is the pony should scream out its breeding as soon as it walks in the ring. If it's not 'typey' enough to identify itself it won't get placed.
 
minesadouble said:
Some local level judges don't now their a**e from their elbow. With regard to mixed M&M classes at higher levels one panel judge, many years experience, judged at HOYS etc. has said to me that there are times in mixed M&M classes he is sometimes unsure what breed a particular pony is. That pony will be down the line as his view is the pony should scream out its breeding as soon as it walks in the ring. If it's not 'typey' enough to identify itself it won't get placed.
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I whole heartedly agree with that!
 
Of a Highland pony, "He's not fat enough!". Some people are a bit out of touch!

Frankly, a judge's opinion is just that. An opinion. Who cares?
 
Showing was not for me with my Highland x TB. However I always knew I had the best pony at the show anyway.
 
zigzag said:
Many years ago, a friend of mine was in a lead rein show pony class with her son, who has Down's syndrome, Pony was placed 6th out of 6. Judge told her pony would have been placed higher if she had had a "normal" rider....
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Blood well and truly boiled over here! 'Judges' like this should be banned and blacklisted. Absolutely abhorrent attitude!
 
minesadouble said:
Some local level judges don't now their a**e from their elbow. With regard to mixed M&M classes at higher levels one panel judge, many years experience, judged at HOYS etc. has said to me that there are times in mixed M&M classes he is sometimes unsure what breed a particular pony is. That pony will be down the line as his view is the pony should scream out its breeding as soon as it walks in the ring. If it's not 'typey' enough to identify itself it won't get placed.
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Funny thing was that my lad pretty much slapped you in the face with his breeding, except he was chocolate dun not grey! He wouldnt have won many Supremes at county level and in Ireland if he wasnt a typey lad!
 
In a showing class for Natives and the judge but a NON native in first place... didn't enter anymore classes as i thought it was unfair esp. as most of the winners were from the yard and me and my friend thought there were some really stunning horses (in the right class!) missing out (being placed 5th...)
 
LittleMonster said:
In a showing class for Natives and the judge but a NON native in first place... didn't enter anymore classes as i thought it was unfair esp. as most of the winners were from the yard and me and my friend thought there were some really stunning horses (in the right class!) missing out (being placed 5th...)
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But then you get the joke of "arabs, anglo arabs and part breds" when actually ONLY a pure bred arab will win the class guaranteed every single time, no matter how bad an example of the breed! One in a class earlier in the summer did not even trot up for the judge, it either cantered sideways or refused to go out of walk so how on earth can you place that 1st when you can't even see its paces?!
 
MagicMelon said:
But then you get the joke of "arabs, anglo arabs and part breds" when actually ONLY a pure bred arab will win the class guaranteed every single time, no matter how bad an example of the breed! One in a class earlier in the summer did not even trot up for the judge, it either cantered sideways or refused to go out of walk so how on earth can you place that 1st when you can't even see its paces?!
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All of this has ruined showing for me, so i don't go to shows anymore (and im not brave enough)
 
We did an M&M future dressage stars showing class; it was supposed to be marked in 2 sections, one for a show which included serpentine, mediums etc and one section on conformation and potential for dressage. We were the only entry so it didn't really matter but the judge came over and said"I'm supposed to mark you on conformation and potential for dressage - well he's not exactly Valegro is he!" No love, he's a 13.1hh Fell pony, but I doubt you would find Valegro in an M&M dressage class!
 
the comment about the highland/ section b was of a pony that the previous week had been county show champion and won at a breed class so it doesn't always follow that they are much cop at judging and in some cases couldnt judge the pet hamster class at a garden party.
In defense of some judges at a local show recently she had a class of registered M&M with half a dozen coloured cobs, a freisian a hafflinger and several nondescript ponies that may well have been badly bred natives, a Fell stallion and our Highland mare the stallion won the class with our mare second I did feel very sorry for the judge as it was a massive class only one or two of which were genuine registered natives
 
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The judge rang the bell half way through my Novice test one day. I stopped and rode over to her amazed as I knew I hadn't gone wrong. When I asked what I had done wrong both she and the writer were powerless to tell me. She said she only knew I had gone wrong as I was 'facing the wrong direction'.

To the side of the arena a fellow competitor who had competed two horses before me and done the same test spoke to be afterwards and said she had watched my test from the beginning and I had definetely not gone wrong.

She was quite an old dressage judge and although very experienced I was told she did this a lot as she was going a bit senile and got easily confused!!!
 
Sad, especially at local shows which are normally held to raise money for charity. I don't believe in being dishonest or giving people false hope but there are constructive ways to say things which will encourage people to come back next year after some practice rather than be upset & never want to come back. Judges ect should bare in mind the amount of work every competitor in the ring has gone to for their 5 minutes of 'fame'.
 
MagicMelon said:
But then you get the joke of "arabs, anglo arabs and part breds" when actually ONLY a pure bred arab will win the class guaranteed every single time, no matter how bad an example of the breed! One in a class earlier in the summer did not even trot up for the judge, it either cantered sideways or refused to go out of walk so how on earth can you place that 1st when you can't even see its paces?!
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This is an example of how it can go the other way, I got placed last on a pure bred in an Arab and part bred Arab class only 3 in the class really low key show, one horse cantered on the wrong leg another reared up and I came last, as I came out of the ring a man said to me you were robbed, later found out all three kept there horses at the yard where the show was held, hence why I avoid this kind of show now as its a case of who you know and not what you know.
 
zigzag said:
Many years ago, a friend of mine was in a lead rein show pony class with her son, who has Down's syndrome, Pony was placed 6th out of 6. Judge told her pony would have been placed higher if she had had a "normal" rider....
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That is absolutely disgusting.

I would like to have asked what the judge to explain to me what a 'normal' rider is.....

As much as I don't really agree with naming & shaming I would have went to the local news paper with that & expected a written apology.
 
x-di-x said:
I think this might just be the area co-ordinators that stables her horse just along from me! She's a complete cow! Apparently I know nothing about finer horses as I have a sec D! Hmmm..... She missed the (albeit aged) tb standing in the field that I used to sj to a high level, oh and the finer (unsure of breeding) horse I was riding in MY arena (the one she wants to borrow foc after hurling insults at me for owning native/native crosses). All this and various other jibes from the woman who can't even catch her own horse coz he hates her (vet, farrier and instructors words!) but me, knowing nothing about a proper horse, can catch without issue! (Feel free to pm me the name just to be sure but I'm 99.9% sure there's only 1 area coordinator that is a cow bag! God imagine if there's 2!!!!!)
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There is only 1 Area Co-Ordinator in Scotland and that's Carol Magee. The one time I saw her compete her horse in a showing class it had to get pulled out of the line up by the steward and then smacked on the backside with the stewards clipboard to make it move - whilst it was being ridden.
 
I attended a local show yesterday with my mare who for her first season has done quite well, usually in top three. Yesterday was seven in my class she called up to fifth then turned to me and said 'I suppose I'll have that mare sixth' lol. My mare was well behaved and did a lovely trot up even in gale force winds and driving rain whilst others which bucked, plunged, reared, dragged and turned in several circles all came ahead of us! Judges are bizarre sometimes lol

Same judge(had been said she was a special in heavies) then told a lady her cob should not be in heavy horse...... Err it was obviously a Suffolk punch lol!!

Amusing are judges hehe
 
Dont do showing, but always take the babies out inhand to start with to deal with 'show stuff.' So took the 3 year old coloured gelding out who behaved wonderfully all day, but was unplaced in a youngstock class. Fair enough...but i thought manners were supposed to count. However, judge said on the way out something like 'lovely mare, but needs a bit more spark!'. Suggested maybe HE shouldnt have been gelded.
 
Some of these comments are horrific but please take a little bit of pity on local show judges - the great majority of us are not panel judges and are giving up our time for free. If we're lucky we get a burger lunch and a bottle of wine and only a little abuse from competitors.

My experience and expertise!:) are M&Ms - I've been involved in them for many years and at one point showed them to a pretty high level but due to a shortage of people prepared to actually give up their time for these shows I regularly find myself judging classes that TBH I know very little about. That's not even mentioning the shows where they have haffies listed as natives in the schedule...or the ever unpopular job of judging the LR and FR classes, the abuse you get from the parents is unbelieveable. No wonder shows struggle to find good judges!

Try judging a ridden class of 27 coloureds, every colour from pinto to palomino inc dun. Every type from 7/8 TB to HW Cob inc Haflingers, (Dun) Connies and Highlands with the odd Palo Welshie. That was fun, actually I enjoyed the judging because it was a challenge but because I judged hard on manners and movement rather than concentrating on markings there was uproar let alone when I used correct turnout to separate the last 6. I've also judged a 1,2 and 3 yo class that had 30 entries including an ID 3yo and a mini yearling and everything else you could think of in between. It was a tiny ring too.

I always give honest but hopefully constructive feedback but at the end of the day, it is my choice and my opinion. I will not place an obese or unsound horse (unsoundness will result in you being asked to leave the ring, sorry) and I value correct movement above flashiness. However if you enter your Welsh Cob in an Arab and Part Breds class you will not place especially if, when asked what percentage Arab your horse is you tell me that "All Welshs are PB Arab because they ran Arab stallions on the mountains way back when" No, no they're not.

I used to really enjoy judging but I do less and less every year. If you want totally consistent, expert in every breed/type judging you need to register both yourself and your horse with one of the showing societies and travel to their shows - their registration fees are high along with their entries and your travel costs will cost a lot for a handful of shows but then you can demand those high standards.
Alternatively, volunteer to judge at your local shows so that there are enough people to cover their areas of expertise and judging might improve but you will have to give up competing in that show - I never compete anywhere I judge.
 
I've not really had any horrible comments made, but I hate it when you get placed further down the line and the judge doesn't say two words to you. A little cc wouldn't go a miss!

However, I was out a few weeks ago and went to watch a class after loading my two. It was an odd-coloured in hand class and there were some really lovely duns, palominos and a super cute spotty Shetland. There was also a cremello. I'm generally not a fan anyway and this one looked really tatty.. Legs had been chalked even though they weren't actually white, didn't have much top line etc and handler was scruffy. She was pulled in last (unfortunately, someone has to be last and I would have done the same too) and when exiting the ring she had a massive moan with (I believe) her mum and I overheard her say 'Just because she liked the others more than mine, doesn't mean I should come last!' .... What!?? Is that not what showing is about? Made me laugh though :D

I had some fantastic comments at my Welshies first show. Pulled in 3rd the Pony Club Pony (not the right class for him as a 5yo but I wanted to do one before the M&M and it was the only suitable one) and then dropped down to 5th after the individual show as he struggled to get the right canter lead on one rein. Judge was great and said she really liked him but he was just too green for that particular class, completely my thoughts too. Like anything, there are nice judges too, but the bad ones sometimes need a good slap and some glasses to see what they've actually put first!
 
I got disqualified from my first comp (wrong bit duh!) but the judges still let me do the test and marked accordingly. They were super constructive and gave me the confidence to go back. A little bit of kindness goes a long way.
 
Was once put down towards the bottom of a line with my perfectly well behaved Criollo in a foreign breeds class against some rather naughty but flashier looking horses. I wasn't worried until the judge gave me my feedback that I was down at the bottom of the line up because 'you can't get a grey horse to shine like a bay' (he could have said anything to me as the place was probably deserved but what a bizarre comment!!)
 
My very first show, I was about six years old and had been recruited to be a jockey in a lead rein class. I'm not from a remotely horsey family and we had no idea what I should be wearing, so my mother kitted me out in my best red woolly jumper with a horse on front (knitted by my aunt) and turned up at the show. Obviously, we didn't go in the LR class!

However, the pony's owner let us go in LR handy pony at the end of the day. Pony and I were both tired, I was still upset from showing up WRONG, and when Pony baulked a little at walking over a mattress, I just burst into tears.

The judge wiped my eyes, took over the lead rein, and gave me an impromptu riding lesson on how to get Pony past the obstacles. She was the kindest, most encouraging person I'd met all day. And while I should have been booted from the class, she even let me be placed fourth (out of four, obviously!) and have a rosette to take home. I've still got that rosette, thirty years later.
 
This thread is exactly why i hate showing...so much so i totaly rebelled one day... I entered a show on the way of moving yards... id hired the box and wanted my moneys worth lol


I entered my coloured sports horse in a youngstock class....plaited, youngstock.

Didn't plait, i was covered in poo as the little git had **** all over the box.....

we won.

as we were the only ones in the class :D I was doing it as i wanted experience for her, as she had never been out before - her manners were impeccable, really proud of her - she had never seen flags, the show ring, people all around her - other horses etc - thats why i did it.... but because i got a rosette people were fuming... pathetic really...it was a charity fun show.

The comments I got outside the ring were horrible and bitchy - my mum heard them [not just because i didnt plat]

and that was a charity show... i have shown previous horses properly but the comments are just snide - especially if you win.... jeez - but a charity show i thought would have been just for fun.... I didn't realise HOW serious people take showing...its a flipping rosette....

i stick to dressage and jumping now,hate showing. really hate it
 
I remember being placed first in three classes at a show the other year, all judged by the same judge throughout the day. As I was walking around the ring, I heard a group of women stood at the side, and one tutted loudly as I passed and said "Urgh, and it's blatantly obvious which one is going to win this AGAIN. The judge obviously favours this one". Errr....is that not the whole point in showing?!
 
YorksG said:
If you know your pony/horse is the best that is going to be there, regardless of what the judge says or thinks, then perhaps you should stay at home and buy yourself a rosette! If, for whatever reason you cannot show your horse to it's full advantage, accept that today isn't your day, or get someone else to do the job.
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Totally agree, showing is showing, its the judges prefrence and opinion at the end of the day, people shouldnt go judge bashing just because their pony didnt get a 1st or a rosette.
 
MagicMelon said:
Funny you say that as I was just about to say similar. Last week at a show, I'd waited 2 hours for a class (honestly, it was a joke, we kept getting told "10 mins" and then no judge!) and only 4 of us hung about. Went in, judge didn't even glance at my horse, put her last below some awful types who totally pissed about. I got told "she's obviously tired from the wait" - well yeah probably, but no she trotted up beautifully and just happened to behave very well and not piss about like the ones you've placed above her!! But the fact the judge literally looked at her for 2 seconds drove me nuts, I've paid my money same as everyone else and you stick a horse in 1st just because its a pure bred... I don't mind losing, don't get me wrong but that class really annoyed me.

I also got told by the judge once that I was in the wrong class because I was in a M&M Pony class. Well just because my pure bred Welsh D was 15.2hh, he was still very much a M&M I pointed out! He was a horse I won a lot with in M&M, but in that class she stuck us very last beneath plaited ponies who couldn't canter... bizarre.
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How could it have been an m&m pony class if there were plaiteds in it??
 
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