Thin horses

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alicesorby

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Hi
I have a bit of a problem, a lady on my yard has two horses, both of which are cobs and should be good doers. However, over the winter they have both lost a considerable amount of weight. She feeds them low calorie food and not enough of it. She also over works them. every one has said to her that they are to thin but she just won't accept it. The yard owner is threatening to kick her off the yard but she still won't accept the fact that her horses are too thin. I'm really woried that when they start going to shows and things they might drop dead of a heart attack. I've tried everything to get through to her but i just don't know what to do. Has anyone got any advice?
Thanks a lot x
 
Can you take any photos of them on the sly? We could make our minds up as to their condition (not doubting your word, would just make it easier to make an informed opinion and advise). Personally I prefer to see a slightly leaner horse at this time of the year, they are much healthier for longer when they go onto spring grass. Needlesss to say there is a difference between a leaner horse and a 'thin' one.
 
Do they get wormed.......only ask as this reminds me of doing's at a yard I was at along time ago!
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Are they lean, or are they appallingly thin? What body score would you give them?

I ask because, having had cobs myself, I always prefer them to be lean(ish) coming out of winter because of the dreaded lami from the spring grass.

If they are seriously underweight, and the owner continues to ignore peoples advice, then I would contact the ILPH and let them assess the horses. They will be able to either alleviate your worries, or if appropriate, give feeding advice to the owner.
 
a 3 is normal body weight on the 1-5 scale.my vets recomend a 2.5 which is similar to a racehorse for this time of year for good doers.(if you can get them to a 2.5 that is!!!!)
its best to be a little under at this time of year
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Can you see ribs? Do they look under muscled? Do they lack energy? Do they have dull coats? If yes then I would be worried.
There is a big difference between fit and poor - I see more over weight horses than poor horses.
 
You can see there ribs, one of them has had the hair rub off her hip bones by the rug because they're sticking out so much. They definately lack energy but i don't think there coats are too dull. Has anyone got any advice on what i should say to her. I'd much rather talk to her than call out the ILPH.
 
You'll never get through to a person like this. From what you've said she's been told by everyone on the yard & the UO's threatening to kick her off ther yard. If that doesn't get through to her then nothing weill. Depending on the condition of them the RSPCA may be interested however they would have to be emaciated for them to get involved as they have so much to do.
 
I would STRONGLY advise against taking photos of someone elses horse and posting them on here. Whatever state they're in, you do not have permission to do this from the owner and may find yourself in trouble.
Igf you or your YO are that concerned contact the ILPH.
 
I think the ILPH might be good as the quite often come out with the RSPCA don't think is bad enought and give advice etc. Why not give them both a ring and see what they say.
 
I really would recommend the ILPH if you have any doubts - they are trained to deal with people diplomaticaly - our local rep is an ex-police horse person, so really knows about both people and horses - so would do their best to get the owner on their side. And they are also very used to looking at horses and knowing when they are genuinely neglected, so can make a good judgement. You can report them anoymously - the ILPH page should have a number to do this on.
 
I've heard this on this forum before - that is a warning about taking photographs and posting them. Legally - as far as I am aware - and I am not a lawyer - just a publisher - there is no law that stops you taking photographs and publishing them anywhere as long as you are not trespassing - how else would the paparazzi make a living. A publishers we regularly take pictures and publish them without permission of the people involved. However, if you are taking pictures to use for commercial gain such as to use in an advertisement or to sell prints - then you would need a model release.

I am very interested as to why people think you can't take a photo and upload it. I would be more concerned about the word published alongside the photo.
 
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I've heard this on this forum before - that is a warning about taking photographs and posting them. Legally - as far as I am aware - and I am not a lawyer - just a publisher - there is no law that stops you taking photographs and publishing them anywhere as long as you are not trespassing - how else would the paparazzi make a living. A publishers we regularly take pictures and publish them without permission of the people involved. However, if you are taking pictures to use for commercial gain such as to use in an advertisement or to sell prints - then you would need a model release.

I am very interested as to why people think you can't take a photo and upload it. I would be more concerned about the word published alongside the photo.

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No law as such, but posting a picture of someone's horse and stating bad things about their care of said horse may be deemed as defamatory.
How would you feel if say your horse lost weight via illness and someone posted a piccie of it on an open forum and saud you were starving it an over working it? That may not be the case here, but people aren't always aware of all the facts.
 
I would hope that as an inexperienced horse owner I would listen to people with more experience.

I agree with you - as I said it's the words you need to worry about.

Not particularly picking on what you said Katy - but that I have seen people say before do you have the owner's permission to post a photo of their horse on line and wondered what the thinking was - when I, as far as I am aware, you don't need it.
 
Fat horses are more likely to drop dead of a heart-attack to be honest.

What do you mean by "she also overworks them"?

How much is "not enough food"?

I wouldn't take a picture of someone else's horse (without their permission) and post it on an Open forum, but that is entirely up to you.
 
there is law regarding the ownership of photographs.

whoever takes the photograph automatically has the copyright and is the author of such work.

the copyright can pass to someone else in different ways under different circumstances and some exceptions can apply.

if you are going to use a photo or copy of a photo, you must have the permission of the author-failing to do so results in a breach of copyright and there are various remedies that can be used against you.

even if you use a photo that belongs to you, should anyone really post pics about other peoples horses, especially when the character of the owner is brought into question?

i understand that the only way we may see how bad they are is via a photo, and neglect and cruelty should no be tolerated, but all it would take is for someone to recognise the horses you describe and the s*** to hit the fan.

i think the best thing you could do is speak to the ILPH
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I think your all right i will not put a picture on. I would also like to point out that this woman's owns 2 horses both of which are in a bad condition. I think it's unlikely that they're both ill and only these two horses have the illness

What i mean by overworking them is that one of them gets at least 14 hours work a week. Neither get a day off and if she lunges it's for at least 1 hr. She part loans them both out but with the one that gets 14 hrs a week she will ride him on the day the loaner has him and so the loaner feels like she cannot ride him.

Food wise, the 14.2 has about a quarter of a small tub truck once a day and the 16hh has about double this. The feed she gives them is dengie alpha A light and a low calorie balancer. Now is it just me or is this not the right feed to give two horses that are thin all the way through the winter.

Thanks for all your advice I will keep you posted on how it turns out. Hopefully the horses will be allowed back out to grass soon and the horses will gain weight from the grass and all this will blow over. If not i will think about calling the ILPH, but i just feel like i'm betraying a friend.

Thanks again
 
That's not quite true - I employ three photographers and the copyright for any photographs they take whilst at remains with the company.

Copyright is an incredibly complex subject. We come up against it everyday in the publishing business - have also been bitten badly by someone being careless so I prefer to refer anything slightly unclear to our lawyers.

However, I do know you can take a photograph from a public place and publish it editorially!
 
it is true - i've studied the law on it and i'm going to work for a law firm that deals with IP laws.

what you describe with regards to the copyright is one of the forms in which i said that copyright ownership an pass from the author, i.e. any photos commissioned by someone else will remain their property, and any done for an employer that you work for will remain the property of the employer.

you can check all the details and relevant sections of the law at

http://www.patent.gov.uk/copy/c-applies/c-photo/c-photo-ownpost89.htm

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