Thinking about selling my horse

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ickle

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Hello everyone,

I am new to this but I wanted some advice about selling my horse. I have never sold a horse before and never imagined I would sell a horse. But I am in a situation were my head is telling me sell him and my heart says no. Just thinking about it is upsetting.

I have had my horse for two years. We have been though a lot together. He came to me a big, cocky, biting, rearing nightmare of a horse. (I suspect he had been doped when I tried him because he was very laid back - but something didn't seem to add up and looking back his then owner was terrified of him). However, he is now much improved and has a lot more respect for me. He very, very rarely rears these days and never bites. He is a lot safer to be around. BUT, he still has his occasional bad day were he will do something to challenge me and then I question to myself what I am doing with this horse. As you can imagine I have put heaps of effort into this horse to get him were he is now and on the days he challenges me I wonder why I am doing it because it isn't enjoyable. Horse riding is my hobby. I do it to enjoy it. It costs to much and I work very hard with my horse for it to be un-enjoyable.

I am also now beginning to think that this horse isn't the horse for me. I want to do the odd showjumping competition but his initial fright of fillers makes this un-enjoyable. I want to go for hacks but with the amount of times he has attempted to buck me off (but has rarely succeeded) also makes this un-enjoyable. I also want to do the odd dressage test but his lack of enthusiasm to go forward makes it un-enjoyable. He has improved over the two years I have had him but experts and BHS trained instructors agree he may never be trustworthy enough to hack out alone and that his fright towards fillers and lack of enthusiasm to go forward may also be part of this horses character that will never change enough to make riding him easier and therefore more enjoyable.

To top it all, this summer he has started head shaking.

The horse in question is a stunning 9 year old KWPN. He has fantastic paces and a good jump. He is more than capable but has no motivation whatsoever

I am at my wits end and wondered what other people think about this situation that I find myself in. Would you buy a horse like this and if so what would you be prepared to pay (if anything)

Thanks for all your views.
 
Sorry to be blunt, but most quirky or project horses have at least one redeemable quality which would encourage someone to take them on to work with them and improve them. This horse sounds bolshy to handle, a bit dangerous to hack - and assume that is in company as not reliable enough to hack alone, lazy or resistant to your aids on the flat and spooky jumping - coupled with the headshaking makes him pretty undesirable
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I'm sure he is stunning to look at but to be frank he is not a horse I would take on even for little money.
Sorry - I'm sure that isn't what you wanted to hear. Good luck in finding a nice home for him. If it is any consolation I think you are being very honest with yourself - riding is for enjoyment and it costs more than enough - why put up with the hassle?
 
I know exactly how you feel, I have had a horse like this and it is not much fun. Mine ended up going to a hacking (in company) home and a bit of a companion. Hope you sort it out, I agree they are expensive to keep, and you want to enjoy your time with your horse. It is frustrating, isnt it. Sorry, not much help.
 
I went through pretty much all of this with my horse. Boy did she teach me a thing or two. And despite wishing on many occassions that I hadn't bought her - I can say hand on heart that she is the best thing that has ever happened to me. We've been together for 14 years now, and the time has flown by. I suspect that you are turning in to a very good horsewoman because of your horse - and that in itself is a gift from him to you (no matter how frustrating the journey may be!)

I would always say don't give up horses like these.

However realistically - if you've reached the end of the road - I personally don't think he's sellable from what you describe.
 
If you are finding yourself scared of your horse then you have to sell it. My horse is quirky however after her temper tantrums it normally makes me more determined to succeed. I know she has talent we just have to work together and trust one another
 
I think you deserve a nice horse that you can enjoy, not this chap who is obviously too difficult. It sounds like you have made progress with him but you have come to the end of your time together.

This probably is not what you want to hear, but my friend was in a similar situation with a thoroughbred gelding, and she eventually sold him for £500. She made sure that the woman she sold him to knew everything about him, all his bad faults because she did not want anyone to get hurt.
 
Gosh what a hard choice you have.

From what you've said about him, he sounds like he's very stuffy, this would result in his reluctance to move forwards, and a tad spoilt (not by you). You know if he was mine I would send him hunting if you know - or are yourself - a really good jockey to get the bugger going somewhere and working for his tea! He just sounds bored and lazy, and this is by no means a reflection on your horsemanship as I can imagine you've done some brilliant work with him, but hunting would really get him going forwards and hopefully cut out this silly spooky attitude he has.

I would also do some XC with him, you often find backward thinking horses are naughty and frustrating because they need waking up in a big way!

Good luck with him with what ever choose to do.
 
It's such a hard decision to make and I really do sympathise!

I nearly sold Ty last year as my confidence hit an all time low. However, I was lucky enough to have alot of good people around me and I just couldn't let him beat me. We're now on the road to a good relationship again but it's taking time. Not sure I'd want a straightforward pushbutton pony though.....makes me feel quite proud that when I got him you couldn't pick out his feet, make him stand still to get on, canter in a circle etc but we've made progress on all of those.

Think you have to be able to see a glimmer of hope and feel it's within your capabilities or it's just not worth the hassle - this horse owning lark is supposed to be fun! xx
 
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You know if he was mine I would send him hunting if you know - or are yourself - a really good jockey to get the bugger going somewhere and working for his tea!

[/ QUOTE ]

That's a great idea!

Something I wanted to ask - do you do alot of school work? How often to you change the routine/hack out etc.....let him go for a good old gallop?
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Dont worry there is a home for most horses out there.

My friend had a similar experience. She persevered for 3 years, despite everyone on the yard urging her to sell him. In the end her nerves were shattered.

Another friend took him into his riding school and unbelievably he has turned into a star there. Everyone wants to ride him and he has knuckled down and is a different horse.

You will just have to persevere to find the right environment for your horse..Good luck.
 
Sorry to hear of the problems with your horse - I had issues with one of my horses, but didn't want to sell him under pretence or to someone who may not be suitable/or he could injure. There is a good website called www.projecthorses.co.uk which you can advertise your horse on for a nominal fee and be sure you find the right buyer. All vices/problems can be described in detail and with total honesty.
My boy went to a lovely new home and is now jumping BSJA British Novice. Sometimes we persevere for ages with possibly the wrong horse, just to find the right owner is out there somewhere. Good Luck.
 
Sounds like the kind of thing Richard Maxwell deals with all the time. Have you tried contacting him? At least read his latest book and see if it rings any bells (can't remember the name, but it'll be on his website)

good luck - mine is a difficult filly, but at least she's turning the corner and I have various people begging me to lease them to her as a broodmare - can't imagine the nightmare of a gelding

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Sounds like he is trying to tell you something, something frightens him and he is not sure of himself or you (may be bad treatments in the past before he came to you) I got a young Colt (Bobby) who I left back home (SA) with my parents and upon returning to him in December I started working with him, he is a big enormous horse for two and I fell off him, he was biting me, I had blue marks all over my arms and butt he tried to step on me and when I tried to flat work him, he challenged me I nearly gave up on him and practically gave him away when I contacted someone who did a reading on my deceased horse as I could not deal with the pain of losing him and she did a reading on him (animal communicator)

I asked him questions and asked her to explain to him what I wanted him to do when I was flatworking him, walking with him and asked what he wanted me to do (his replies were really funny) I used these replies and by the time I left, we were the best of friends, because I responded to how he needed things done to ease his weariness and he responded to my requests. I know this is something alot of people don't like and I was sceptical but this lady is amazing and I will be using her throughout my training of bobby and being so far away from him, I regularly communicate with him through her.
if you are interested in contacting her, send me a pm and I will give you the details, try this before you let him go, give it a try and ask her to ask him why he is doing certain things and what he needs and tell him what you need.
 
Thanks everyone for your replies so far.

I still haven't made my mind up properly yet.

I am not selling him because he scares me. This horse has shown me everything he has got and I have learned to cope when he gets tough and therefore his actions don't scare me. I have stood up to him and thats how I have turned him around from the agressive horse he once was.

However, on the odd day now we still have little arguments. Yesterday - going into the school he was lifting up his front leg to try and strike me. He was no were near me, but I still told him off for it because if I don't check him then next time it will be a bit worse and so on until he is rearing up in protest about going into the school. I do try to vary his work and despite his bucking (not little ones but proper ones that are meant to get me off and have on occassion) I still take him for hacks. Until our local stubble field disappeared I took him for a gallop there twice a week, every week for 3 months. He doesn't seem to want to do it though. Even with other horses around. I had to teach him to gallop. He just used to put the brakes on even with a horse in front or behind or none at all. He does now gallop but I get the feeling he would rather not.

I have checked his teeth, back, saddle and there is nothing wrong. It's all in his head. Everyone who meets him agrees with that. He thinks he shouldn't have to do anything and I think I have got better at persuading him otherwise. But its the arguments and the protest I have with him thats making it unpleasarable.

I don't know what the answer is but I know I can't sell him honestly the way he is.

Thanks again.
 
Ty paws out through frustration/lack of manners. If I hit him he'd just get worse so I boom at him to stop (not shout as that has bugger all effect). He's getting better but I assume that some horses are like children and if they have only ever known violence tend to react with violence themselves.

I do think there is something wrong though - reading someones reply to another post that their horse was rearing up and died of liver disease just goes to show that there is usually a problem.....
 
If we work on the assumption that

a) horses are intelligent sentient beings
b) they are never - ever - doing something simply to piss us off
c) that most of the nonsense written about dominance has no basis in science and is a projection of the (usually) male trainers who propose it
d) the horse is *always* trying to communicate

then we, with the larger brains and more sulci, should be able to figure out what it is.

I still think Richard Maxwell would transform your horse and as far as I know he doesn't spout pseud-science about dominance
 
Reading your post you sound really unhappy - I would sell him and get something you can enjoy more. Don't worry there is a home for every horse.
 
[ QUOTE ]
If we work on the assumption that

a) horses are intelligent sentient beings
b) they are never - ever - doing something simply to piss us off
c) that most of the nonsense written about dominance has no basis in science and is a projection of the (usually) male trainers who propose it
d) the horse is *always* trying to communicate

then we, with the larger brains and more sulci, should be able to figure out what it is.

I still think Richard Maxwell would transform your horse and as far as I know he doesn't spout pseud-science about dominance

[/ QUOTE ]

Was that aimed at me? You're telling me that a horse that has been beaten up alot won't react by becoming either violent or extremely nervous? Not saying that's the case here but to say that's nonsense is a bit of a blanket statement!

You said yourself that horses are trying to communicate and I couldn't agree more with that....was the essence of my post!
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It wasn't aimed at anyone in particular, just the general, rather depressing assumption that horses who display what are to us adverse reactions are necessarily bad. They may be dangerous, but they're rarely bad, just trying to communicate in the way that they know. Which isn't to say we should have to battle on and keep them if we can't cope, just that i'd very rarely respond to violence with violence. There's almost always a better way to communicate that will break the violent cycle.

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It wasn't aimed at anyone in particular, just the general, rather depressing assumption that horses who display what are to us adverse reactions are necessarily bad. They may be dangerous, but they're rarely bad, just trying to communicate in the way that they know. Which isn't to say we should have to battle on and keep them if we can't cope, just that i'd very rarely respond to violence with violence. There's almost always a better way to communicate that will break the violent cycle.

E

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That's exactly what I meant! You just tend to find that a horse that bites (for example) has learnt that it's the only way to defend themselves from being hit - seen it so many times. Patience and a bit of understanding and a kind but firm hand can usually get over these issues though.

I don't think that there is such a thing as a bad horse - just a bad past.
 
I'm sure Richard or someone like him (there are more of us in the world, you know
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) could transform the horse but the question is should THIS owner get that done?

A bad dynamic is sometimes just a bad dynamic. Having a horse is like any other relationship and there is no one right answer except the one that most effectively works for both parties.

I'm not advocating "giving up" and I HATE, HATE, HATE what I call the "adversarial school of horsemanship" (horses are big and strong and fast - if they were not essentially compliant we would ALL be dead) but looking at a situation realistically means taking ALL the information into account. Maybe this horse and this rider, for all the owners best intentions and efforts, are not meant to be in the long run. Your work has made it possible for him to go on, maybe he does need to do that somewhere else, not because you can't do it, but because it's better for all if you find a horse that WANTS to do what she wants.

Never teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig.

This horse is telling you he's not happy. You're not happy. Yes, you probably can still improve things, perhaps tremendously, but you can't make him a different horse. (Neither can Richard Maxwell.)

I'm not saying this is the answer - I make quite a bit of my living doing "couples' therapy" for horses and their people who want to keep going - but you are the rational one so it is up to you to look at the situation rationally.

It's not wrong to want to have fun with your horse! It's expensive and time consuming and hard work, you should at least get what you want out of it, whatever that is. AND that can change over time. I get PAID to sort out uncomfortable situations with other people's horses but I've had my own horses because I enjoyed them and because they did the things I wanted to do at the time. (I can hazard a guess that my idea of fun is not everyone's but that's exactly my point.
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)

Not to mention that you not enjoying your horse ain't much fun for him.

If you want to keep sorting the situation out and that pleases you, great. If you want to find someone who can help you change him, great. (With the qualifier that even the BEST trainer can only make the horse a better version of itself AND that there might be conditions and management issues in the long run you might or might not be okay with.) If you want to try to find him a situation that suits him better and find a horse for whom you can be the best owner, then you know what? That's okay, too.

He actually sounds like a cool horse - the kind of horse I like and might actually enjoy working with, even just as an intellectual exercise. But that's ME.

Not much help, am I? But I have this conversation at least once a week with someone. And the answer is individual. I've had people willing to pay anything to get a horse "fixed" and I've still advised letting go because I didn't think the "fixing" was in the horse's best interests. (I saw a horse last week that could be and should be a FANTASTIC event horse. His owner wants him to be a super quiet hack to ride a couple of times a week. How do you really think that's going to work out and is it fair to ask the horse so sublimate his own attributes because the owner doesn't want him to be what he is?) Then, with all the information, the owner makes his/her OWN decision.

One qualifier is that clearly your horse has some behavioural issues that are NEVER acceptable. It may be that you will have to be responsible by getting some of that addressed by a specialist in order to give him the best chance at a good home. Think of it as an investment in his future and one of the costs of taking such a horse on.

Good luck and don't beat yourself up. Perhaps get someone objective in to assess the horse and sit down with you to talk things through.
 
Cruiser you've hit the nail on the head and said what I said earlier in the post (but much better)

I had to make a decision with Ty - either perservere or sell. I decided I wanted the challenge. There is NOTHING wrong with admitting that a horse is too much of a nightmare to sort out - after all they're supposed to be an enjoyable hobby.....there's usually always someone out there who would love the challenge and give the horse the best break.

Who knows, I may be posting this same post in 6 months but at the moment I really want to make a difference with him.
 
I feel sorry for you because it is not an easy situation. I do find it odd that after all this time you still get told to perserve yet if this was a partner acting in this way, you would be told to walk away. Not all horse/human partnerships are meant to be and if this is wearing you down then perhaps you need to think about passing him on. If you are happy to continue with the challenge then there is not a problem, but you sound as if you are tired of the battle. Go with you gut feeling, usually this is the best way. You obviously have some sort of bond with him.
 
Was that for me or QR?

I think if I stop enjoying the process then I will sell him on- at the moment I'm making progress and enjoying it so will carry on. Feeling quite proud of myself that I carried on tBH!
 
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